'Railroad' Tornado

[S.A.C Martin]

Re Chimney try a gentle tap from inside the smokebox if you can get to the inside. My NRM conversions of the A3 were sorted without drama in this way. One even survived for further use if needed !.

 

Nice repaint well done

 

Thanks Mick, I'll take a look this evening after the F1 Qualifying is done on iPlayer

 

I've collated all the material I've done in this thread into a blog entry:

 

Railroad Tornado: "We fade to grey"

 

Thanks for your support, appreciation, and great advice fellas.

[GraemeWatson]

What a stunningly quick turnaround from an excellent video review to fully resprayed loco.

Thanks also for providing the Revell paint number.

Excellent work!

[S.A.C Martin]

What a stunningly quick turnaround from an excellent video review to fully resprayed loco.

Thanks also for providing the Revell paint number.

Excellent work!

 

No problem Graeme

 

Next stage is looking around for suitable transfer paper, and working out what font/size/colour suits the engine best. I've a feeling the lettering and numerals were not black, but a charcoal grey, too...

[Dan Hill]

Got myself a Hornby Magazine with a review of the Special Edition.

 

Here's the interesting bits for those who may get this version.

 

No Cab glazing

Solid Buffers

Moulded handrails

Electric lamps/lamp irons are included in detail pack

Detailed cab interior but unpainted

Moulded coal

3 pole motor

Etched nameplates

 

The magazine infers some of the details have done so that the price is £92 rather than £130.

 

I'm slightly put off now without the painted cab interior but the paint decoration look great. But I'll wait and see.

[coachmann]

The model structure looks pretty damn good from the correct profile drivers with large bosses to the sleek look of the A1. And this is in the Railroad range too.

[bluex5]

The lack of cab glazing is a bit of an a**e. Possibly get away with Kristal Klear for the spectacles but the side windows will need to be made up from sheet which takes forever!

[GraemeWatson]

No problem Graeme

 

Next stage is looking around for suitable transfer paper, and working out what font/size/colour suits the engine best. I've a feeling the lettering and numerals were not black, but a charcoal grey, too...

 

May I suggest: http://www.craftycomputerpaper.co.uk/category/Decals

 

It's probably not the only suppier of waterslide paper, but saw it in an advert in "Model Rail"

[7013]

From the list below

 

No Cab glazing.....................Should be able to be made

Solid Buffers........................Bachmann do a set of sprung buffers for the A1

Moulded handrails.................makeable or hopefully available from a small business

Electric lamps/lamp irons are included in detail pack...........just need to be fitted

Detailed cab interior but unpainted..............fiddly to paint but do-able

Moulded coal.............bit of a pain but again a do-able project

3 pole motor........................Nothing apparently wrong with that Bachmann have used them for years and this one has a flywheel.

Etched nameplates.......................Probably available from a specialist maker

 

So even with a price of £77 or £92 pounds there is scope for detailing this good value model to a high standard for not a very big outlay say £15-25.

[Legend]

From the list below

 

No Cab glazing.....................Should be able to be made

Solid Buffers........................Bachmann do a set of sprung buffers for the A1

Moulded handrails.................makeable or hopefully available from a small business

Electric lamps/lamp irons are included in detail pack...........just need to be fitted

Detailed cab interior but unpainted..............fiddly to paint but do-able

Moulded coal.............bit of a pain but again a do-able project

3 pole motor........................Nothing apparently wrong with that Bachmann have used them for years and this one has a flywheel.

Etched nameplates.......................Probably available from a specialist maker

 

So even with a price of £77 or £92 pounds there is scope for detailing this good value model to a high standard for not a very big outlay say £15-25.

 

Agreed! And it makes the model much more affordable for those who are not too bothered about the above, while those that are bothered can take matters into their own hands

[S.A.C Martin]

May I suggest: http://www.craftycomputerpaper.co.uk/category/Decals

 

It's probably not the only suppier of waterslide paper, but saw it in an advert in "Model Rail"

 

Thanks Graeme, I will take a look now

 

Has to be said - this 3-pole motor with the flywheel is a joy to behold. It is a ridiculously smooth operator, better than the A4s and A3s by miles. The loss of the tender pickups makes no difference to the model at all.

[Flyingscotsmanfan]

Looking at the pictures of Tornado in Hornby Magazine I much prefer the Special Edition version and I think if i was to buy one it would be this version. The only thing that needs doing is to add glazing and sort out the molded handrails something I feel that might just be within my capabilities

[Dan Hill]

Good review in Model Rail. Seems to confirm however that the Tornado Express pack features a Railroad Tornado. Its brunswick green with a simplier boiler band, cab and tender lining. Seems a shame for a pack that is going to cost £163.

[7013]

It is a shame that there has not been a comparison with the Bachmann offering in the magazines but that may come. It does beg the question...Is it worth paying an extra £20-30 for the Bachmann model? The £92 offering from Hornby looks a very good model as it stands without any extras.

I suppose if you buy the Hornby model you can choose to detail it more to whatever you want, but assuming it will cost £20 to purchase the bits and the time spent, would it not be worth buying the Bachamnn model which is already to a high standard, bit of a poser?

[S.A.C Martin]

It is a shame that there has not been a comparison with the Bachmann offering in the magazines but that may come. It does beg the question...Is it worth paying an extra £20-30 for the Bachmann model? The £92 offering from Hornby looks a very good model as it stands without any extras.

I suppose if you buy the Hornby model you can choose to detail it more to whatever you want, but assuming it will cost £20 to purchase the bits and the time spent, would it not be worth buying the Bachamnn model which is already to a high standard, bit of a poser?

 

When I get my hands on the top spec Hornby one, I will do a "Hornby VS Bachmann" review video for the forum. But basically, the fundamental problem with the Bachmann one is that it is a non roller bearing model, done up to represent an all roller bearing model. Then of course you factor in the subtle differences such as whistle position, cab roof curvature, boiler fittings and height of chimney, and its a mixed bag IF you want a highly accurate model of Tornado. If not, and you want an excellent representation, then the separately fitted detail of the Bachmann model might appeal.

 

However, I'm wagering once I have the two models together on the layout, next to each other, that the Hornby model will win out, regardless of the moulded detail. The cost difference of nearly £50 (RRPs of £92 and £142 respectively) in my opinion will be the deciding factor between the two. The cheaper of the two is more accurate to the engine it purports to represent, despite the moulded detail.

 

In the end, you are effectively paying for brand name, or separately fitted handrails.

[7013]

Thanks S.A.C. I agree with all you have written and appreciate your efforts for us all. It is interesting to see that there is going to be ( I read somewhere) another release of the Bachmann Tornado in September . I suspect Hornby will have cornered the market by then, I am leaning heavily towards the Hornby special edition

[jonathan452]

I've just noticed on the ever so accurate Hornby website-:

 

RailRoad BR 4-6-2 'Tornado' A1 Class Locomotive - http://www.Hornby.com/shop/locomotives/steam-locomotives/dcc-ready-steam-locomotives/r3060-railroad-br-4-6-2-tornado-a1-class-locomotive/

Peppercorn Class A1 4-6-2 "Tornado" Special Edition - http://www.Hornby.com/shop/locomotives/steam-locomotives/dcc-ready-steam-locomotives/r3070-peppercorn-class-a1-4-6-2-tornado-special-edition/

Tornado Express Train Pack - http://www.Hornby.com/shop/train-packs/r3059-tornado-express-train-pack/

 

that all of the three above versions include a

Motor: 5 Pole Skew Wound

 

Therefore was the change to 3 pole a late decision?

 

Having bought the Bachmann version I won't lose too much sleep over this one.

[S.A.C Martin]

It was described as a 3 Pole motor in the original press release on 25/12/10 last year. The spec hasn't changed in that time: but the descriptions on the Hornby site are, shall we say, less than accurate

[7013]

Also interesting to see something I had not realised the special, yes it has more general detail but it also has sprung buffers sliding cab roof and decoder socket in tender therefore I assume it has it has the (unpopular) plug between the tender and loco. Looking at the extra detail though the special looks even better value at £92

[S.A.C Martin]

Also interesting to see something I had not realised the special, yes it has more general detail but it also has sprung buffers sliding cab roof and decoder socket in tender therefore I assume it has it has the (unpopular) plug between the tender and loco. Looking at the extra detail though the special looks even better value at £92

 

None of that appears to be correct, mind. This month's Hornby Magazine ran a feature on the model, and it is pretty much the same spec as the railroad model, with the correct livery, fully applied. Certainly no sliding roof hatch on their sample model, nor is the decoder in the tender - it is housed on the chassis. The buffers certainly aren't sprung, either.

 

The extra £20 really is just for the paintwork chaps, trust me on this one. Fully painted up mind, the Hornby Tornado does give the Bachmann model a run for its money, and at £50 less I think the Hornby Tornado would get the nod from me, despite the moulded detail. The rest of the model is excellent and the 3-pole, flywheel drive motor and chassis assembly is stunning when it is running. Smooth, quiet, powerful, quite fast too. Can't recommend the Railroad one enough simply on the basis of its chassis.

[7013]

That is a shame, it would appear that Hornby's description is completely wrong for the special edition then, ho hum I was just getting really excited, now I am still excited but not so much. I wish Hornby would get a decent proof reader in before they build our hopes up only to dash them.

 

 

Edit..reading through the Hornby info on Special edition Tornado they seem to have lots wrong, even the number (60162) describing the era for a original build A1 not Tornado's era. Very strange.....They're not going to make an original A1 are they? surely not?

[coachmann]

Reading that Hornby is reintroducing moulded handrails on locos does make me wonder if the firm is testing the model railway hobby for a reaction.

[S.A.C Martin]

Edit..reading through the Hornby info on Special edition Tornado they seem to have lots wrong, even the number (60162) describing the era for a original build A1 not Tornado's era. Very strange.....They're not going to make an original A1 are they? surely not?

 

It would need the whole diecast chassis block to be replaced as again, Tornado has detail differences to the originals including differences to the roller bearing batch. The only things which can be reused from a Hornby Tornado into an original A1 model are the tender frames, driving wheels, front bogie, valve gear and cartazzi wheelset (but not the diecast cartazzi block).

 

That would be a lot of tooling up for an entirely separate model.

 

But (putting the cat amongst the pigeons somewhat), if they did tool up a new A1 model, on the basis of this chassis, I'd buy one, probably a lot more if the detail was better.

 

Reading that Hornby is reintroducing moulded handrails on locos does make me wonder if the firm is testing the model railway hobby for a reaction.

 

I think it's more to do with the Trust's insistence that the model is affordable to everyone, not just modellers, i.e. for the trainset market and general public.

 

[speculation]

I would assume they set a specific target and pricing structure, and a lot of the model's design choices (3 pole motor, moulded detail, etc etc) seem to reflect that theory. [/speculation]

 

If it had all the detail of the Bachmann A1, it would be a technically superior model overall, being more accurate to Tornado's physical form, and would probably also command an RRP similar or higher to Bachmann's £142.

 

On that basis, I think for its RRP, the two apple green models are good value for money when you also consider what a technically brilliant chassis it is.

[The Stationmaster]

Reading that Hornby is reintroducing moulded handrails on locos does make me wonder if the firm is testing the model railway hobby for a reaction.

 

I don't know if their marketing department is but I bet their accountants are

 

Huge sales (perhaps) of something which is cheaper to produce and might well have a higher profit margin, but more than likely a better cash-flow, than fancy 'scale models' with high R&D costs and finicky customers are just the sort of thing the accountants will go for as they only look at balance sheets and suchlike. Of course accountants won't then have the job of coming up with a successor product to 'Tornado', that will be dumped back on the marketeers.

[coachmann]

Of course accountants won't then have the job of coming up with a successor product to 'Tornado', that will be dumped back on the marketeers.

Maybe interesting times ahead with more Railroad models produced for around £65.00 with moulded handrails. Anyone for a Thompson Pacific, GWR 2-8-0T, Beyer-Garratt.....?

[31A]

Reading that Hornby is reintroducing moulded handrails on locos does make me wonder if the firm is testing the model railway hobby for a reaction.

 

That thought had occurred to me too, and I wondered whether it was in response to complaints which are sometimes aired about details on modern models being too fragile (I don't know whether people are in the habit of throwing models across the room; I don't).

 

My reaction would be negative, and I sincerely hope this doesn't become a feature of forthcoming models (B17, B1 etc...).

 

Back in the 'bad old days' when we used to carve off moulded handrails to replace with wire ones, this would normally be followed by a repaint either because the original livery was naff or wasn't the version we wanted, or both. Nowadays however with standards of finish vastly improved (and most livery variations turning up in due course if you're patient), in carrying out detailing of rtr models (what little there is to do) I do my utmost to preserve the factory applied livery, which would be very difficult if you were to start removing and replacing moulded handrails.

 

However, I AM glad to see a flywheel in a British outline steam loco at last!