Wright writes.....

[Woodcock29]

Chas you beat me to it, pointing out that the BB bogie Howldens had the interior/body printed as one.

 

Given BB is redoing these I quite expect the base of the seats will be on the floor and the backs/partitions in the body like the 6-wheelers.

 

Andrew

Edited November 26, 2020 by Woodcock29

[Tony Wright]

12 hours ago, Chas Levin said:

Ah - that explains it then - I assumed the floor and body were all one piece as yes, they are in the bogie vehicles - here's a pic of the kit as it was before assembly:

What kind of interior do you get for the 6-wheelers then, and how is it fitted?

I spent time this evening repainting the cornice/gutter strip in teak (and re-doing the same areas on the Mike Trice ECJS 6-wheel brake, where I'd made the same mistake). Once I'd done them I realised how much more correct and smart they looked and wondered how I'd missed that, as it's quite a prominent feature: thanks again for pointing it out!

Good morning Chas,

 

Here's the equivalent Mousa Brake 3rd....................

 

 

I replaced all the resin trussing with brass stock - just looking at it caused it to fracture! It's pretty standard practice with my carriage-building, where any plastic/resin parts for the trussing/footboards are replaced with metal - too many bits of the former in the bottom of boxes on returning from shows.

 

An excellent overall kit, nonetheless. I reviewed it in BRM some little time ago. 

 

 

Painted for engineering service on Little Bytham. John Isherwood very kindly supplied the superb transfers. 

 

As painted, far too clean, of course.

 

 

 

After weathering (by Richard Wilson); far more realistic.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 27, 2020 by Tony Wright
to add something

[gr.king]

Here's a glimpse of my finished six wheelers and an indication of one of the ways in which I attached the bodies to the floors, separably.

[teaky]

6 minutes ago, gr.king said:

Here's a glimpse of my finished six wheelers and an indication of one of the ways in which I attached the bodies to the floors, separably.

 

A neat solution Graeme.  Did you make provision for future access to the interior and, if so, how?

[Woodcock29]

Tony

 

I've just read the latest Engine Shed from Hornby which shows liveried versions of the A2/2s and A2/3s. I realise these aren't final but it looks to me like they've mixed up the boilers on 60501 and 60505.

 

Andrew

[gr.king]

2 hours ago, teaky said:

A neat solution Graeme.  Did you make provision for future access to the interior and, if so, how?

The voids under the seats are accessible from below, in the corners of the floor structure, so the pins can be pushed back out just as they can be pushed in.

Where there's a brake or luggage compartment, the floor is instead solid and there are obviously no seat bases. In those cases I glued plastic blocks securely in the lower corners of the body and put screws up through the floor. A mental note not to tighten the screws like an angry gorilla is required, but that should be obvious in a plastic model anyway.

Edited November 27, 2020 by gr.king

[zr2498]

17 hours ago, Chas Levin said:

Ah - that explains it then - I assumed the floor and body were all one piece as yes, they are in the bogie vehicles - here's a pic of the kit as it was before assembly:

What kind of interior do you get for the 6-wheelers then, and how is it fitted?

I spent time this evening repainting the cornice/gutter strip in teak (and re-doing the same areas on the Mike Trice ECJS 6-wheel brake, where I'd made the same mistake). Once I'd done them I realised how much more correct and smart they looked and wondered how I'd missed that, as it's quite a prominent feature: thanks again for pointing it out!

I'm interested to know when you purchased the kit. I have had a number of these on pre-order from mousa models since Feb 18 but alas no sign of them being available in the near future

Dave

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, Woodcock29 said:

Tony

 

I've just read the latest Engine Shed from Hornby which shows liveried versions of the A2/2s and A2/3s. I realise these aren't final but it looks to me like they've mixed up the boilers on 60501 and 60505.

 

Andrew

Andrew,

 

I've just looked, too.

 

They have indeed!

 

If the boilers were changed over, the model of 60501 would be correct for the period March 1952 (when the loco received a Dia.118 boiler) until her front numberplate was moved down to the top hingestrap on the smokebox door (1955/'56?). 

 

60505 would then be correct for the period September 1957 (when she received a Dia.117 boiler) until she got a lipped chimney (early 1959). 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited November 27, 2020 by Tony Wright

[Chas Levin]

6 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good morning Chas,

 

Here's the equivalent Mousa Brake 3rd....................

 

 

I replaced all the resin trussing with brass stock - just looking at it caused it to fracture! It's pretty standard practice with my carriage-building, where any plastic/resin parts for the trussing/footboards are replaced with metal - too many bits of the former in the bottom of boxes on returning from shows.

 

An excellent overall kit, nonetheless. I reviewed it in BRM some little time ago. 

 

 

Painted for engineering service on Little Bytham. John Isherwood very kindly supplied the superb transfers. 

 

As painted, far too clean, of course.

 

 

 

After weathering (by Richard Wilson); far more realistic.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

 

Good afternoon Tony, thanks, it's interesting to see those pictures all together. I found some of them in the course of this thread and saved them for use during the build (allowing for the fact that it's a differnet coach diagram). Yes, I too found the thin pieces highly fragile! Actually, I managed to avoid problems with the trussing and middle steps while assembling, and ensured by generous but concealed use of cyano gap-filling gel that they should be OK for the future. The bogie brake gear however was another matter: all I can say about that is, it's a good job it isn't visible during normal running. From your first pre-paint photo of your coach, it looks like you had almost exactly the same small degree of bowing up of the roof corners - very slight and only really visible if you get down and look at eye level (or get the camera down, as you have for the photo).

 

I sometimes have a later era running day using post-nationalisation locos and rolling stock, pitching it roughly late '50s to early '60s and I do intend to use a couple of pre-grouping coaches in the way you have there, cascaded into Engineering use, but as soon as I get a little way into the build I start to picture the coach in teak (or I should say, in my approximation of teak!) and get excited about how lovely it will look, and tell myself I'll use the next one for BR Departmental stock...

[Chas Levin]

5 hours ago, gr.king said:

Here's a glimpse of my finished six wheelers and an indication of one of the ways in which I attached the bodies to the floors, separably.

 

2 hours ago, gr.king said:

The voids under the seats are accessible from below, in the corners of the floor structure, so the pins can be pushed back out just as they can be pushed in.

Where there's a brake or luggage compartment, the floor is instead solid and there are obviously no seat bases. In those cases I glued plastic blocks securely in the lower corners of the body and put screws up through the floor. A mental note not to tighten the screws like an angry gorilla is required, but that should be obvious in a plastic model anyway.

That is very nicely done Graeme! Had you already posted the pics on here, or on the LNER forum? If so I must have seen them but not remembered... that age thing again!

Your photos also answer my question about what interior is provided and how it fits.

One thing I really did like about the one I built was the interior, with beautifully moulded seats. I regretfully had to abandon plans to included lighting (due to the nature of the material and my lack of confidence in successfully making the necessary modifications) which would have allowed the seats to have been more visible.

Before I started building coaches as kits, I fitted lighting, passengers and decorated interiors to a few Hornby Gresleys and I never tire of activating the motion sensor and peering in to check that all the passengers are OK:

All the coach kits I built before this latest Composite were NPCS and while one or two have LED guards lamps they're none of them suitable for lit interiors in the same way as passenger coaches, so I was looking forward to combining a kit build and a lit interior... Never mind: the next passenger carrying coach I build will definitely be a brass kit and will be lit .

[Chas Levin]

2 hours ago, zr2498 said:

I'm interested to know when you purchased the kit. I have had a number of these on pre-order from mousa models since Feb 18 but alas no sign of them being available in the near future

Dave

Hi Dave, I actually can't remember when I bought it as it had been in my pile for quite some time, but I'd say it probably was a couple of years or so ago.

What I do remember is that I'd only found out about them some time after he'd released that diagram kit and when I contacted Bill, he said I was very lucky, as he only had one more left in stock.

So I think what you're waiting on must be a second run (or perhaps even more than second?); I'm afraid I can't advise on what the current delivery times might be, especially with the current pandemic-related disruptions...

[Tony Wright]

Having just spoken with Simon Kohler, he's assured me that Hornby is aware of the anomalies regarding the A2/2 boilers shown in the recent pictures. 

 

They really are 'only' pre-production decorated samples to test assemblies and running. 

 

I'll be personally testing one or two very soon! 

[Tony Wright]

46 minutes ago, Chas Levin said:

Good afternoon Tony, thanks, it's interesting to see those pictures all together. I found some of them in the course of this thread and saved them for use during the build (allowing for the fact that it's a differnet coach diagram). Yes, I too found the thin pieces highly fragile! Actually, I managed to avoid problems with the trussing and middle steps while assembling, and ensured by generous but concealed use of cyano gap-filling gel that they should be OK for the future. The bogie brake gear however was another matter: all I can say about that is, it's a good job it isn't visible during normal running. From your first pre-paint photo of your coach, it looks like you had almost exactly the same small degree of bowing up of the roof corners - very slight and only really visible if you get down and look at eye level (or get the camera down, as you have for the photo).

 

I sometimes have a later era running day using post-nationalisation locos and rolling stock, pitching it roughly late '50s to early '60s and I do intend to use a couple of pre-grouping coaches in the way you have there, cascaded into Engineering use, but as soon as I get a little way into the build I start to picture the coach in teak (or I should say, in my approximation of teak!) and get excited about how lovely it will look, and tell myself I'll use the next one for BR Departmental stock...

Good evening Chas,

 

I don't know if you've seen this picture of the underfame....................

 

 

I think I gave up with the brake gear on the bogies.

 

Note the substantial brass strengthening bits (invisible from normal viewing angles).

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

 

 

[Chas Levin]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good evening Chas,

 

I don't know if you've seen this picture of the underfame....................

 

 

I think I gave up with the brake gear on the bogies.

 

Note the substantial brass strengthening bits (invisible from normal viewing angles).

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

 

 

Good evening Tony, that's very interesting and no, I hadn't seen that photo. You had put up one early on showing the underframe, but unpainted and definitely without the brass strengtheners. I didn't think of doing anything like that and instead built up glue between the backs of the step supports and the outer face of the solebar - invisible straight on and fairly unobtrusive from the sides too, because they're low down and under the upper steps.

On reflection I might have replaced the resin brake gear with brass to better effect - it took a lot of work to install them and - presumably because of limitations in how thin the resin can be cast - they're a little on the well fed side.

Did you add any weight to the coach and if not, does it run well?

[Woodcock29]

Hi Chas

I don't think it's advisible to add weight to the body/underframe with the design of the 3D printed bogies which have a sort of built in suspension. However, on mine I fitted heavy metal Australian made wheels so these add some weight into the bogies themselves.

 

Dave - I reckon I might have got mine up to 3 years ago now. Wished  I'd also bought the BT. So I'm waiting on the next batch which are next on the list for release according to the info on the old website before it got upgraded. I think we just have to regularly check the current Mouse website.

 

Andrew

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, Chas Levin said:

Good evening Tony, that's very interesting and no, I hadn't seen that photo. You had put up one early on showing the underframe, but unpainted and definitely without the brass strengtheners. I didn't think of doing anything like that and instead built up glue between the backs of the step supports and the outer face of the solebar - invisible straight on and fairly unobtrusive from the sides too, because they're low down and under the upper steps.

On reflection I might have replaced the resin brake gear with brass to better effect - it took a lot of work to install them and - presumably because of limitations in how thin the resin can be cast - they're a little on the well fed side.

Did you add any weight to the coach and if not, does it run well?

Good evening Chas,

 

No, I didn't add weight; it runs exceptionally well. 

 

Overall, I think these are excellent kits. And, like all the best kits, they allow for personal substitutions - brass for thin resin, for instance. My choice.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

Returning to the theme of Hornby's forthcoming Thompson Pacifics....................

 

I'm reserving any final judgements until the production models arrive for assessment. 

 

They really are exciting developments. It's three years ago that I was first approached by Simon Kohler, asking for my assistance with their development (we chatted at Warley in 2017). 

 

If someone had said to me a few years ago that by the end of 2020/early-2021 we'd be seeing exceptional RTR models (or any RTR models) of Thompson Pacifics, I'd have not believed them.

 

What's left now with regard to models of BR's big green steam-outline engines RTR? The A1/1? The A2/1s? Anything else?

[Chas Levin]

14 minutes ago, Woodcock29 said:

Hi Chas

I don't think it's advisible to add weight to the body/underframe with the design of the 3D printed bogies which have a sort of built in suspension. However, on mine I fitted heavy metal Australian made wheels so these add some weight into the bogies themselves.

 

Dave - I reckon I might have got mine up to 3 years ago now. Wished  I'd also bought the BT. So I'm waiting on the next batch which are next on the list for release according to the info on the old website before it got upgraded. I think we just have to regularly check the current Mouse website.

 

Andrew

Hi Andrew, I would have agreed if left to my own judgement, but the instructions actually say that the unweighted coach weighs around 80g and that weight can be added, but that the total weight shouldn't exceed 120g (because of the nature of the bogie construction) so I added about 35g of lead shot, which seemed to me to stabilise the ride a little (though I realise that's probably a largely subjective impression, based on a subconscious desire to see a visible improvement after going to the trouble of adding the weight!). The coach will only have light running (a small layout and not enough time to build kits and run trains are the mains reaons for that) so I'm sure it'll stay healthy...

[Clive Mortimore]

29 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Returning to the theme of Hornby's forthcoming Thompson Pacifics....................

 

What's left now with regard to models of BR's big green steam-outline engines RTR? The A1/1? The A2/1s? Anything else?

 

One that is right.....

 

 

Already running to hide with my tin hat on.

Edited November 27, 2020 by Clive Mortimore

[LNER4479]

42 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

What's left now with regard to models of BR's big green steam-outline engines RTR? The A1/1? The A2/1s? Anything else?

Time to revisit long firebox Jubilee?

Stanier 3,500 gallon tender to go with them (50 of the class towed them)

A 'proper' welded Stanier 4,000 gallon tender for that matter (Hornby one is a fudge as the rear is rivetted)

 

Sorry - am deeply into LMS 4-6-0s at the moment!

[Brocp]

28 minutes ago, LNER4479 said:

Time to revisit long firebox Jubilee?

Stanier 3,500 gallon tender to go with them (50 of the class towed them)

A 'proper' welded Stanier 4,000 gallon tender for that matter (Hornby one is a fudge as the rear is rivetted)

 

Sorry - am deeply into LMS 4-6-0s at the moment!

Original Boilered Scots

British Legion

Rebuilt Jubilees....

Edited November 27, 2020 by Brocp

[Woodcock29]

1 hour ago, Chas Levin said:

Hi Andrew, I would have agreed if left to my own judgement, but the instructions actually say that the unweighted coach weighs around 80g and that weight can be added, but that the total weight shouldn't exceed 120g (because of the nature of the bogie construction) so I added about 35g of lead shot, which seemed to me to stabilise the ride a little (though I realise that's probably a largely subjective impression, based on a subconscious desire to see a visible improvement after going to the trouble of adding the weight!). The coach will only have light running (a small layout and not enough time to build kits and run trains are the mains reaons for that) so I'm sure it'll stay healthy...

I remember now that advice, however I would say that I've had to adjust my bogies once because they sagged under the weight of the unweighted body. Its does get quite a lot of continuous running as I like to see the Howldens running behind a C12 or D2 when I'm doing work out in the shed.

 

As to when I got it I've just looked at some build photos and they're dated May 2016 so its probably nearer 5 years ago that I got it. I did replace the trussing with brass as Tony did. Biggest issue with mine was I only got one set of brake gear half OO and half EM/P4 so I had to narrow down the brakes for one bogie which was a bit of a pain given how fragile the material is. Here it is below part built. You can also see the marginal turn up of the roof at each end. I must have been able to remove the roof of this one without damage as its not painted yet - I think there was more flex than in the 6 wheelers due to longer sides as I snapped a 6 wheel roof when removing it after I noted one window had shifted in its slot. The 6 wheelers have slots in the sides to fit the windows into rather than being fitted from outside and glued in with varnish under capillary action which actually worked quite well on the coach below. Better add a photo of the finished coach which I think was posted on here back in 2016 or 17. Its meant to be representative of late 30s and probably needs some body weathering.

 

You'll note its got a Kadee on one end and small tension lock on the other as its will get to run on two layouts my own where I use small tension locks (I can visualise Tony shuddering) and Gavin's Spirsby that I posted photos on here of a couple of months ago.  The heavy metal wheels I used are by Steam Era Models in Victoria but they don't make 14 mm disk  anymore as they're really only suitable for British 4mm scale not Aussie HO. But I've got a good supply in stock!

 

Andrew 

 

[Chamby]

10 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

 

What's left now with regard to models of BR's big green steam-outline engines RTR? The A1/1? The A2/1s? Anything else?

 

You’d probably be looking at earlier pre-BR stuff like Raven Pacific’s and The Great Bear.  But if we’re including LMS Jubilees then there are a lot of other 4-6-0’s that will also come into play.

[2750Papyrus]

11 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

What's left now with regard to models of BR's big green steam-outline engines RTR? The A1/1? The A2/1s? Anything else?

 

Depends partly on whether the Bachmann V2 ever sees the light of day.  I think perhaps SR fans may deserve new models of the King Arthur and Schools classes.

 

I wonder what Hornby will plan for the FS centenary.  A new model to latest standards and facilitating the various changes made during her life?

[gr.king]

9 hours ago, Woodcock29 said:

I remember now that advice, however I would say that I've had to adjust my bogies once because they sagged under the weight of the unweighted body. Its does get quite a lot of continuous running as I like to see the Howldens running behind a C12 or D2 when I'm doing work out in the shed.

 

As to when I got it I've just looked at some build photos and they're dated May 2016 so its probably nearer 5 years ago that I got it. I did replace the trussing with brass as Tony did. Biggest issue with mine was I only got one set of brake gear half OO and half EM/P4 so I had to narrow down the brakes for one bogie which was a bit of a pain given how fragile the material is. Here it is below part built. You can also see the marginal turn up of the roof at each end. I must have been able to remove the roof of this one without damage as its not painted yet - I think there was more flex than in the 6 wheelers due to longer sides as I snapped a 6 wheel roof when removing it after I noted one window had shifted in its slot. The 6 wheelers have slots in the sides to fit the windows into rather than being fitted from outside and glued in with varnish under capillary action which actually worked quite well on the coach below. Better add a photo of the finished coach which I think was posted on here back in 2016 or 17. Its meant to be representative of late 30s and probably needs some body weathering.

 

You'll note its got a Kadee on one end and small tension lock on the other as its will get to run on two layouts my own where I use small tension locks (I can visualise Tony shuddering) and Gavin's Spirsby that I posted photos on here of a couple of months ago.  The heavy metal wheels I used are by Steam Era Models in Victoria but they don't make 14 mm disk  anymore as they're really only suitable for British 4mm scale not Aussie HO. But I've got a good supply in stock!

 

Andrew 

 

 

I'm surprised that the bogie vehicles came with instructions that even went so far as to cover the matter of weighting. My six wheelers came with just a couple of diagrams relating to the wire suspension system, the sliding centre axle, and the suggested (but not employed) magnetically mounted couplings* on a single small sheet of paper. I wasn't satisfied that when the models were un-weighted the suspension for the middle axle was compressing sufficiently at the necessary times to allow the outer wheelsets to remain firmly on the rails, so I added strips of lead under the seat bases, bringing the weight of the longest six wheeler up to about 95g, more or less matching a similar D & S etched brass model. I think the shorter luggage brake was weighted to about 75g. The suspension appears to do its job more convincingly now and the weight per axle in the heaviest carriage, coincidentally, is not dramatically greater than the recommended maximum for the bogie vehicles.

 

*I challenge somebody to use the magnetically mounted couplings on the short 6w luggage brake, along with the brake units on their mountings, as there's no space in which to fit them all!