LNER GRAIN WAGON

[DOCJACOB]

The chaps had a very big shunt around last Sunday and the next challenge has arrived in the shed. 

 

Thanks to Boris for the advice and I have to admit this will only be my second wagon resurrection. But as I well remember convincing my self while running my 65 mile ultra marathon race each step taken was one step nearer the finish and thus in a similar vein all resurrections have to start somewhere. In this case it will be the steps if only to improve access to the interior.

 

I also spent a long time getting lots of detail digital photographs so i have a sort of reference data base. 

 

Grain wagon is now in the head shunt with some other likely candidates.

 

A large selection of images; The LMS Brake van and the LNER Plate wagon (nice shade of yellow) were the other candidates for resurrection.

 

A number of few inside images, regrettably the smell can't be recreated as the upholstery was soaking wet.

 

Finally to make myself feel a bit better I painted a small bit in anticipation of the wood arriving for the steps.   

Edited May 17, 2014 by DOCJACOB

[DLPG]

Good luck with the LMS break van. Our groups was in similar condition when we started.

[Boris]

Nice to see your van retains some original features, even if it is a little tired, good luck with it I know from experience that these can be long jobs.

 

Anything I can do to help give me a shout and I'll see what I can do.

[Londontram]

Good luck with your new project Doc, I can only envy your vision and resolve to see through a project of this size. I know for sure I wouldn’t be able to do it. Regards Steve

[DOCJACOB]

Strange sort of day. Firstly arrived to find the wood has been delivered. I guessed full 24 foot lengths would be a tall order but I can't complain at such speed. Additionally all the paint has arrived too. 

 

However a more odd issue has arisen and I have to take 100% responsibility for. The footstep brackets at some point have been narrowed by 1 inch each side and the holes re drilled, and yes they are different (10mm and 12mm respectively).  Additionally a point I didn't fully understand/grasp when demolishing the foot steps was the riser part of the foot step was mounted in sections between the brackets. Consequently the tread part of the footstep was moved inwards by another 1 inch.  This would result in narrowing the width of the wagon by 2 inches each side, and overall 4 inches.  Solution is either one bolt per bracket or more correctly weld up inboard hole and re-drill. As a consequence of this mega change i fitted some temporary steps at one end. 

 

Anyone with a better understanding of MGR wagon unloading/loading facilities explain please? 

 

Some of the Thursday crew cleared out the rotten timber and the full enormity is dawning. 

 

3 footstep brackets are bent and it took 4 hours to remove them. Visible in the image is the medium sized "attitude adjustment" tool. The access difficulties prevented the use of anything bigger. Finally plan B ensued and a length of scaffolding pole was slotted over a ring spanner. More amazing than freeing the bolts was the spanner has survived unscathed for another day. You will logically ask why I didn't use an angle grinder but that just plain "died" at the start of work and will be going to electrical tool heaven.  

 

Told you strange sort of day.  

Edited May 25, 2014 by DOCJACOB

[Boris]

Didn't you heat the bolts before trying to loosen them?

[DOCJACOB]

Much better day today and managed a few hours before going home to see my "helper" and his new friend. 

 

We had a new angle grinder and between that, nut splitter and brute force we managed to get some of the handrails removed. This meant some of the cladding came off next. 

 

The current plan is to repair/splice the lower timbers before tackling the top as some of the wood is so rotten that its removal may affect the structural integrity. 

 

As regards the footsteps I think the reason for narrowing them was something to do with MGR unloading facilities and as a consequence trying to widen them is going to be a massive amount of work. The trick will be the same as that used by BR and mount the riser part of the footstep between the individual brackets.

[Boris]

Just a thought but if you are splicing into the bottom rail, regardless of what you do that will affect the integrity of the cabin.  We reinforced the corners on our to get round this, we ran some substantial L angle up the four outer corners welded onto the upper and lower corner brackets.  Once its painted up you won't even be able to tell, that should do the trick, don't forget though that as the welds are technically structural its good practice to get them done by a coded welder.

[DOCJACOB]

Thanks for that suggestion regarding the splicing. We (I'm not on my lonesome anymore) had already thought about the reinforcing issue and come up with a sort of similar idea.

 

Interested to hear more regarding your comments re "original features" 

[Mark Saunders]

 

 

As regards the footsteps I think the reason for narrowing them was something to do with MGR unloading facilities and as a consequence trying to widen them is going to be a massive amount of work. The trick will be the same as that used by BR and mount the riser part of the footstep between the individual brackets.

 

The footsteps were narrowed so that they could pass through the Daleks (door openers & closers for MGR wagons) with the arms extended!

 

Mark Saunders

[Ian Smeeton]

Loving all the updates, but isn't it time to change the name of the thread?

 

Regards

 

Ian

[DOCJACOB]

Thanks for the comments and taking time to follow the thread.

 

Happy to consider a name change; trials and tribulations of a very amateur wagon restorer? or Wagons to cherish??

 

Thanks also to MS for the proper explanation, must have been a substantial bit of work as each footplate bracket had been shortened by at least 1 inch, holes drilled and new wood attached.

 

Taken Boris idea re splicing, welding and angle iron on board as we had come up with sort of similar ideas ourselves. Note the plural as I do get more interest and help now which is really nice. The latest was a bit "tonque in cheek" though as he wondered if a bit of filler would sort the holes in the wood.

 

Rodent nest score is currently 4

[Boris]

When I mentioned original features, things like your padding for the guard, the sign by the stove pipe (or where it used to be), little things that often vanish but help the finished vehicle retain its character.  If you are working on the bottom rail you may need to pull out the two steel cross ties running through the lower framework, this is often a fun job!

 

Looking at the number this should be a Faverdale vehicle, on one of the headstocks you should find a number painted in white (under layers and layers of paint) which is the vehicles number in the lot, the frames were made at Shildon, and then taken down by rail to Middlesborough to have the concrete poured before being taken up to Faverdale (Darlington) to have the cabins added.  We have just recently finished B954854.

[nigel gill]

Didn't you heat the bolts before trying to loosen them?

Had a chat with one of your fellow C&W lads last night .....alot more C than W....If you give Mr. O  a list of your tool equipment needs i will sort some bits out for you

[DOCJACOB]

Bit lazy this W/E as slept in. I blame a dreadful finish to the week at work and a very pleasant cider from Tesco. Strange in my job as a Dr the dreadful finish had  nothing to do with patients just the insane lunacy of NHS management and politics. 

 

Rant over.  

 

Friday did have another saving grace though as 5 years ago i ran my one and only ultra marathon race. 65 miles in just over 12 and 1/2 hours;  Tarrant Rushton airfield to Portsmouth, ferry journey and a gentle to jog up to Pegasus Bridge arriving at just after midnight on D Day' sort of like the members of Operation Deadstick.  All runners for Project 65 got a named t shirt as they represented one of the assault team. As the only genuine doctor mad enough to do it I had the honour to represent Dr Jacob Vaughan the only RAMC officer in the assault party. In the film Longest Day he arrives late in the assault from the wrong side of the canal. In his book he describes the same moment and admits the area was full of "irritatingly hostile Germans"

 

Anyway late start meant little done. Was given some special "magic juice" from the coach repairers and the bolts on the ducket virtually fell off. Sawed off the last of the planking rather than rip if off, tided up and then did some painting   

[DOCJACOB]

By  a strange coincidence I found some images of my Project 65 race to Pegasus Bridge in an obscure file in one of my work hard drives. There is a loose railway connection as part of the run was on what is now the Castleman Trail The images brought back some great memories. The 2 here are; me at the compulsory circa 1/2 way stop at 35 miles I forget the pub that it was though looking very "chipper" despite already been running for about 6 hours. The other is taken inside Cafe Gondree, the first house liberated in France on D Day. With me are Harry a veteran from the raid who had met Doc Jacob for real when he tended a wounded friend and Jonathan who hooked up with me for the last 31 miles.  

 

Down to business proper. Was on my own again so firstly cleaned up and painted a number of handrails. Had goggles, mask etc on as no idea what crud was grinding off. Next job was the windows in the ducket. One is plate glass and the other perspex . They appear different sizes for reasons I can't understand, especially as the frames measure the same. Guess just lucky the glass hadn't fallen out!

 

The underneath image is from the vans previous life 

[DOCJACOB]

Bit more work before enlisting the help of a better joiner than me. Firstly tided up some more metal work, and yes I've just noticed the lamp brackets at both end are different. The one removed was pretty stubborn and needed a serious bit of "welly" and a "drift" to free the bolts. The sheet metal was painful to look at so had to have a bit of a tidy up to. 

 

Finally to finish the day the job I didn't really want to do, especially as was on my own was the removal of the ducket. Securely roped initially while bolts removed and then prised away from the gasket material. By now I had ruled up some helpers and we lowered the ducket to the ground. Not 100% sure if this will be used as a template for 2 new ones or a tidy up beckons. 

 

While all this was going on outside the P-Way chaps had got stuck into track relaying so it will be possible to do brake van rides, assuming, of course, the brake van has been suitably resurrected. 

[DOCJACOB]

Been on holiday in a rather nice villa in Valbonne near Nice. 2 weeks passed all to quickly and regrettably then had to return to being a GP and earn some more money. 

 

Lots being going on while I've been away, track relaying in ernest and a new locomotive has arrived. 

 

Sections of the frame have been needle gunned and the ducket I removed has been cleaned up. 

 

Removed another angle bracing piece today and here it is partially painted. The same item, un-treated, is directly above it

[DOCJACOB]

Managed quite a bit today before a serious downpour stopped play. I also had an early visit from Santa and he left a large selection of discs 

 

Firstly started on the interior. Lifted a selection of floorboards and the ones still in situ seem not too bad and possibly redeemable, otherwise all the interior partitions will need removal. Generally a vile job, hot and sweaty and underneath the boards were years of fine coal dust that went everywhere including all over me! No evidence of any DPM so thinking about adding one if all the floor has to come up 

 

Next was the remaining ducket. This genuinely was a one man job as everyone else was busy. The remaining bolts succumbed to nut splitting and violence but the screws were a whole different ball game. Initially summonsed help when my daughter kindly dropped the impact driver off for me. This was fine till we sheared the tops of the cheese head screws and then had to resort to plan B and drill them out. This was in total about 3 hours work.

 

Started on cleaning up but given the overcast conditions I started tiding up and not a moment too soon.  

[DOCJACOB]

Apologies for the lack of updates recently but work, children, dogs etc all conspire to keep me away from my hobby. Anyway a bit more done today. 

 

Firstly someone else helpfully cleaned up the other ducket. 

 

Next the remaining roof canvas at one end was removed and some more rotten wood removed. Yes I know the roof is bowed in the middle. If Im not careful keep removing stuff and it will all collapse! 

 

Then a change and out with the paintbrush to an area previously needle gunned. 

 

Finally thought about trying to remove the roller bearing covers, this was was a bad idea and we stopped as just loosening the bolts resulted in shower of "crud" Sort of put off having another go as worry what I might find! 

[Boris]

Unfortunately when a vehicle has been sat for as long as this one obviously has I am afraid that those covers will have to come off to allow inspection of the box components.  The best thing to do at the moment though is to leave the covers on and secure until all of the dirtier jobs are complete, allowing contaminants into the bearing wouldn't do them any good in the long term and can potentially reduce their life.

 

I'm not sure if its the angle of the photo or if the spring leaves have started to open up in the second photo from the top.

 

That roof is definitely an interesting shape, I wouldn't be practicing your clog dancing on it any time soon!  It is probably worth removing the cornice piece at this stage, but be gentle they are a pain to replace.  Although you can remake them using a home made wood steamer.

Edited August 17, 2014 by Boris

[DOCJACOB]

Agree 100% about the covers coming off some time but as plodding along I'm becoming increasing concerned as to the "savability"of this wagon.  I would surmise (assuming roller bearings generally mean easier less frequent maintenance) that loosen 4 bolts and the covers should pull straight off?

 

On the one I tackled the hooded over metal of the axle boxes seems to overlap an edge of the cover and stops this.  i'm now worried that its "stuffed" If that's correct it will likely be a jack up job and that's just not an option. I'm also still worried what I'll find inside and strongly suspect the stuff on the outside won't be much different in consistency and lubrication qualities to the inside.  

 

Cornice piece I removed never ever saw a steamer they had sawn partially through the outside of the curve to make it flexible enough to bend to shape.  

[DOCJACOB]

Quite a nice sunny day so treated my myself to a little walk down to the headshunt to oil some axle boxes. Managed quite a few amongst them one of 4 box vans at LWR. Never sat down to work out the individual identities though. In the back ground is DW 150486 according to the minimal paint job and VCT website. Not sure this is 100% right as all the axle boxes are stamped LMS and according to Departmental's website a wagon with this number was scrapped in Bristol circa 1980.

 

Finally got the last metal repair plate off one of the corners. Had to resort to impact driver to free the screws. Then out with a variety of grinding implements to clean up a small bit more of the underframe.

 

Finally had a group discussion regarding the axle boxes and the current opinion seems to be leaning towards a "jack up" solution to get the covers off and allow oiling etc  

[DOCJACOB]

I've been quite busy last few weeks with sporty type things. Firstly got volunteered to marshal at a well known local race, 10miles and can best be described as "lumpy" Went to marshal briefing, got instructions and various mobile numbers for emergency use. Headed to my spot (just lucky I guess as 1/2 way point and middle of nowhere) No mobile signal just to top things off!

 

Next week headed off to the inaugural Louth Triathlon, felt I had to show my face as I'd tried to get the same event off the ground 5 years earlier and quite a few from the Grimsby club were competing. 

 

Finally an ex club member and good friend now living away texted me to say he'd successfully swum the English Channel. I vaguely new he was planning something big and have to admit don't come much bigger! 14 hours and in his words a "tough gig" 

 

Anyway back to the wagon, and an early start. Amongst a number of jobs; whole solbar now needle gunned and primed, both duckets cleaned and primed and a start made on dismantling the brake system as it will need to be moved to the veranda as this wagon is planned to be used for brake van trips. 

[DOCJACOB]

Firstly a triathlete friend who was retiring dropped off some tools to new home 

 

Still waiting for woodworking help, seems latest idea is total wood renewal not splicing. All in all probably a good idea I'm just waiting for helpers and wood to arrive. 

 

Off to more of the clean up job. The buffer beam is a before and after job. Yes I did wear bucket loads of appropriate protective gear but still cause immense hilarity in the mess van as I looked like I'd escaped from the black and white minstrel show. Would have been cleaner if playing in the coal wagon!