Seacows... Hornby or Bachmann?

[magic_monkey09]

Hi i have been wanting to buy some Seacows for my layout but not sure which ones to get, ive noticed on Hattons that both Hornby and Bachmann make them, which ones should i go for? and are there any differences in quality?

[SRman]

Both are very good and represent different builds of the wagons; Hornby have the smooth welded sides and Bachmann the rivetted ones. Watch out though, as Hornby have another variant in the form of the older Lima ones with rivetted sides - while they have upgraded these a little, they are not as good as the newer mouldings.

 

There are pros and cons for both brands. Hornby's are lighter but have ? more detail ready fitted. I believe the heavier Bachmann ones have the more accurate internal partition arrangements. there is also a question mark over Hornby's number of end railings. I run rakes of mostly Hornby with a few Bachmann ones thrown into the mix, only because I stocked up on the Hornby ones while they were available in certain shops' bargain lists.

 

There is no reason why you cannot mix the two brands and mix the liveries a bit too.

[Willy]

Isn't there an issue with the couplings on the Hornby Seacow in that they don't have the NEM coupling pocket therefore making it difficult if you want to change to KD type couplings?

[The Fatadder]

Isn't there an issue with the couplings on the Hornby Seacow in that they don't have the NMRA coupling pocket therefore making it difficult if you want to change to KD type couplings?

 

That is certainly correct on the welded version, havent bothered looking at the riveted type so cant confirm there.

 

_______________________________

 

To answer the original question, it depends a lot on what period you want to model, as I dont think the welded type were introduced until the early 80s. The Hornby model of teh welded seacow is very nice detail wise (slightly finer than Bachmann), however it is very very light weight and the bogies are slightly narrow (too narrow for EM, can only get P4 in them with Exactoscale wheels)

 

With the earlier design, both Bachmann and Hornby make a model. On the whole the Bachmann model is vary good, the cast metal chassis block gives it plenty of weight but is slightly lacking in the detail of the Hornby one (and is a real pig to fit scale couplings to). The early wagons were incorrectly fitted with the OHLE protection cages. The Hornby (ex Lima) model is very inaccruate, (for a start the inside of the hopper is fictional, and the end detail is just reused from the welded seacow rather than the correct design for the riveted one. One to avoid

 

Paint wise, both Hornby and Bachmann have managed to mess up the shade of grey used on Dutch, Hornby also managed to use a completely wrong shade of green on their olive releases.

 

Modelling wise, if you are doing post 1984 I would say get a mixture of the Bachmann riveted and Hornby welded (and fit some extra weight to the latter). Pre 84, just go for the Bachmann riveted.

[Ravenser]

Does anyone have experience of fitting Kadees to these? I've got 3 , but have looked, swallowed, and ducked the issue so far. Another item on my "outstanding jobs" list....

[griffgriff]

One or two more opinions here...

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=42997&p=655200&hilit=seacows#p655200

[griffgriff]

Does anyone have experience of fitting Kadees to these? I've got 3 , but have looked, swallowed, and ducked the issue so far. Another item on my "outstanding jobs" list....

 

 

I cut the Hornby coupling off and replace with a No 5. Seems to work ok :icon_thumbsup2:

[magic_monkey09]

the issue with converting the Hornby seacow to P4 is not a problem as i use standard peco code 100 track so thats fine , I am modelling modern image so the later welded styles by the sounds of it seem the best to use , i will be adding weight to them as i recall i think Hornby scaldale actually make ballast loads for seacows? in terms of livery's i will probably be using a whole mixture of EWS, heavily weathered Dutch and Trainload liverys not mention covering them with rust powders to make them more realistic B)

[SRman]

Sounds good, magic_monkey09. Mine are too clean at the moment; I'll send you some to rust up and weather too!!! ?  ? 

[Waveydavey]

.... I am modelling modern image so the later welded styles by the sounds of it seem the best to use ,

 

There are still plenty of the 1971 built rivetted version around (most have the vacuum brake gear removed now though) so don't worry about putting a few Bachmann rivetted hoppers into your rake.

 

Cheers

 

David

[Edinburgh Junction]

I got myself a Hornby one, and its a real beauty. Gonna get a Bachmann one next.... very good wagons they are...

[WILLIAM]

Bachmann's Seacows are ex-Sealions (having had airbrakes added). Does anyone know when these conversions were undertaken by BR? Thank you.

[jonhall]

I think they were originally dual braked (AFI vacuum and air) and it wasn't so much converted to air, but de-converted from dual.

 

Jon

[hmrspaul]

I've not studied in detail but my collection has vacuum braked and airbraked versions into the beginning of the 1990s. But removal from others was earlier. On the otherhand the 25 wagons of lot 3724 and 3 of lot 3777 were built without vacuum brake as suitable for the SR only. All these had through vacuum pipe - YGB. I managed to capture one in original condition with an dark olive green finish https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brsealion/ebf9ee38

 

All my photos are dated. https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brsealion

 

Paul

[WILLIAM]

Thanks Paul.

 

Looking at your site you have a 1995 picture of an ex-Sealion YGH from the batches DB982440-DB982539 or DB982568-DB982927 that has had the vacuum brakes removed and has therefore been recoded YGB. There does not appear to be any before that. This tallies with what I've read elsewhere that some YGH Sealions were recoded to YGB Seacows from the early 1990s.