North Welsh Coast Railway - Welsh Dragon Rail

[Simond]

Anthony

 

i wish you well with the 3DP, but i fear it will be extremely difficult to get parts so small, well made.  might be possible and if so it will surely be cheaper, but I am not optimistic.

 

watching with interest (and would love to be wrong!)

 

best

Simon

[Anthony Ashley]

Simon, Thanks for your ideas. I have time to work out the parts for the bridge so will make inquiries. I am thinking of perhaps getting a 3D laser cutter but that will be in a few years time on return to Sydney. I hade a weekend at home and have completed all of the base boards after about 2 years of construction. I also added further hidden supports on the Penmaenmawr side of the layout. I also started cutting the next batch of vertical supports.Photos are below.

 

Mountain end of the layout. Recently completed base boards

 

 

View from the other side of the layout

 

 

Hidden support area under Penmaenmawr

 

 

 

 

The first new vertical support

 

 

Conwy castle with City of Coventry pulling the Irish Mail

 

 

 

Next project is to finish off the vertical supports and add further scenic track support

 

All comments are appreciated.

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

Edited August 5, 2015 by Anthony Ashley

[Anthony Ashley]

Dear All,

 

I have sent 2 emails a couple of weeks ago to RTS-Greenkeeper asking if they sell their 35kV grass applicator to Australia. To date no reply. Does anyone kno0w if they sent to Australia.

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley  

[St Enodoc]

Dear All,

 

I have sent 2 emails a couple of weeks ago to RTS-Greenkeeper asking if they sell their 35kV grass applicator to Australia. To date no reply. Does anyone kno0w if they sent to Australia.

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley  

Anthony, I don't know but Bob Worthington who is a Sydney BRMA member has made a very good static grass applicator. I think Charles Rudder has one of Bob's too.

 

Hope this helps.

[Anthony Ashley]

WELSH DRAGON RAIL - LAYOUT DEVELOPMENTS

 

 

Dear John,

 

Thanks for the information. I shall contact Bob over the next few weeks to ask him about static grass applicators.

 

I have had another trip beck to Brisbane and have done some more work on the layout. I have now completed 8 months out of 35 of my stay in Sydney!

 

Photos are provided below showing latest developments. Unfortunately the development does not look substantial but is a significant step forward. I managed to complete the dog bone loop track support on the left of the layout down to the bottom of the layout, including the bottom loop. I have a few more supports to put in but most are finished. With the completion of the bottom loop the run back up the layout is merely a matter of cutting another 20 feet of straight board supports and paint them. I am using the same support rods for the trip hidden track both down and up the layout. Photos are below.

 

Close up of the hidden bottom loop

 

 

 

A 30 feet straight run down the side of the layout. With the 2:100 gradient this allows an elevation change of 182 mls.

 

 

View from above the layout. Rodding is evident on the right.

 

 

View down the layout. Loop is just visible in the distance.

 

 

View from above the layout, the return se3ction of the loop is sitting on the top of the layout prior to its installation. Rodding supports are not yet installed for this section.

 

Bottom loop curving back up the layout.

 

All comments are greatly appreciated. Thanks for the interest!

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

[Anthony Ashley]

WELSH DRAGON RAIL - LAYOUT DEVELOPMENTS

 

No further developments as I have not been home for some weeks. I am going home for a week at the start of Oct some am hoping to make some progress while I look after my wife (railway modelling will be my secondary activity for the week but hopefully will achieve a lot). I have had one of my modelling mates in North Wales on holiday and am expecting a large number of photos to assist with the layout. I am looking forward to posting some of them. Will get access to them on return to Brisbane. 

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

[Anthony Ashley]

TOOTINBEC OO GAUGE LAYOUT - NOT WELSH DRAGON RAIL N GAUGE LAYOUT

 

Dear All,

 

I have been working in Sydney on Mark's OO gauge Tootinbec. THIS IS NOT MY N GAUGE LAYOUT SET ON THE NORTH WELSH COAST, which is the subject of most of this thread. We have been focussing on the back of the layout. We have finished the mounds against the back scene with ground scatter and a 5 strand fence line, using metal foil coated polyester thread. Have a look and see what you think. We were pleased with the effect. Comments are welcome. I asked Mark if he could get a fence with less strands but replied the 5 strand was prototypical. Method used to thread the polyester metal coated thread was to line the fence posts on foam in a line of 4 close together repeated up to 12 groups off set form each other. a needle was then used to thread the cotton through the groups of 4 posts. 2 people were useful to mange the thread as it was threaded through the posts. The thread reels were mounted on screws in a row on a separate piece of timber. The reels were left attached and the posts then positioned 60 mm apart, having secured the thread attached to the first post onto a tack nailed onto the base board . As the posts were positioned the thread was further wound off reels to provide the length on the thread required. Having positioned the last post, I cut each thread, pulling the thread taught through the posts and then secured the tread by winding it many times  around a tack nailed into the base board. I think the taughtness of the "wire" is good and should remain so. Very happy with the effect. We need to add a similar fence and vegetation to the front of the track section. Photos are below.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Will be home in Brisbane at the start of October. Should be able to get at least some work done on the layout.  

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

 

 

       

[Anthony Ashley]

WELSH DRAGON RAIL - LAYOUT DEVELOPMENTS

 

Dear All,

 

I think my inability to post new threads is affecting the discussion on the thread generally with little responses to recent posts. Nevertheless here is my latest efforts in completing the left hidden track area with a week at home to look after my wife . I have only one more board to cut and that is the 8 feet by 3 feet fiddle yard area. None of the horizontal supports are secured as I shell be working form top to bottom to complete the wiring and do not want to restrict access for drilling wiring holes. This was not a concern in the Conwy area as there is no hidden track under that scenic part of the layout, hence why I started with the simplest part of the layout, given this is my first and probably only layout effort.

 

Photos of my of the hidden track under the Conwy side of the layout are below.

 

A photo taken from the position of the 8 feet by 3 feet board which will hold the 33 track fiddle yard. The other one is at the bottom right of the layout, but I have more construction require to get there. The unpainted board tot he immediate front is the start of the fiddle yard points. I inserted a double level helix oval shown in this picture to drop the fiddle yard to a height of about 570 mls below the scienic level.

 

 

The helix oval on the right of the picture. The 2 highest level track supports run about 30 feet to the other end of the layout. 

 

 

 

A photo showing the other end of the layout. The curves on the hidden areas are generally 2 feet in radius as I have used a template to cut them all the same. I shall need about 6 in total.

 

 

I shall be having quite a few week ends at home between now and the end of year, so should get more developments done. I shall be focusing on laying the cork and then wiring. All comments are appreciated.

 

Regards,

 

 Anthony Ashley

 

[Simond]

Anthony

 

I like the use of threaded rod to support the sub-structures. Versatile and adjustable.

 

Looking forward to more developments

 

Best

Simon

[Anthony Ashley]

Anthony

 

I like the use of threaded rod to support the sub-structures. Versatile and adjustable.

 

Looking forward to more developments

 

Best

Simon

 

Dear Simon,

 

Thanks for the reply. The threaded rod system is a joy to work with as it make elevation and height adjustments so easy. It is relatively quick to install. I shall probably secure the bottom track supports to a length of timber secured to the baseboards to provide stability to the hanging rods. They do tend to move a littler without the extra securing,

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

[Pete Goss]

Just got back from Brisbane after attending the BRMA convention held there this year.  As part of the layout tours arranged for Sunday and Monday, we were invited to visit Anthony's place outside Brisbane on the Monday. Anthony had also given one of the talks at the Saturday convention describing the designing of the landscape for Conway Castle and some of the problems encountered, and how they were overcome. Track plan layouts were also described.

 

I don't think that most of the audience who had never seen the layout were actually aware of the scale involved and the enormity of what was being said.

 

It wasn't until the Monday site visit that I and those others who had no idea on the extent of this layout, realised how big it actually is. It is enormous by UK standards for N gauge. Even large UK N gauge layouts would look small compared to this.  Un-usually I was speechless. Once the enormity of it had sunk in, and listening to Anthony describing this and that all round the layout I looked at a colleague and nothing was said between us except we were both thinking the same thing. How can one person create such a large scale N gauge structural layout including several full size station areas virtually on his own in only 2 years?  Apparently a friend does help out on Fridays but even so, there is some extraordinary personal momentum here.

 

I am not an N gauge modeller as a norm but I shall have to start following this thread further.  I attach a shot of the man himself aside the layout, photographed on the Monday just gone.  Hope that is OK Anthony.

 

best regards

 

Pete

[St Enodoc]

Just got back from Brisbane after attending the BRMA convention held there this year.  As part of the layout tours arranged for Sunday and Monday, we were invited to visit Anthony's place outside Brisbane on the Monday. Anthony had also given one of the talks at the Saturday convention describing the designing of the landscape for Conway Castle and some of the problems encountered, and how they were overcome. Track plan layouts were also described.

 

I don't think that most of the audience who had never seen the layout were actually aware of the scale involved and the enormity of what was being said.

 

It wasn't until the Monday site visit that I and those others who had no idea on the extent of this layout, realised how big it actually is. It is enormous by UK standards for N gauge. Even large UK N gauge layouts would look small compared to this.  Un-usually I was speechless. Once the enormity of it had sunk in, and listening to Anthony describing this and that all round the layout I looked at a colleague and nothing was said between us except we were both thinking the same thing. How can one person create such a large scale N gauge structural layout including several full size station areas virtually on his own in only 2 years?  Apparently a friend does help out on Fridays but even so, there is some extraordinary personal momentum here.

 

I am not an N gauge modeller as a norm but I shall have to start following this thread further.  I attach a shot of the man himself aside the layout, photographed on the Monday just gone.  Hope that is OK Anthony.

 

best regards

 

Pete

Well said Pete, and at the risk of hijacking Anthony's topic many thanks for your contributions to the Convention - in particular for taking me back to my Yorkshire days of 30 years ago.

 

Anthony, as you know (due to work getting in the way of more important things like railway modelling) I had to head back south on the Sunday but I certainly look forward to seeing the layout on a future visit to QLD.

[Anthony Ashley]

Dear Pete,

 

I have been busy interstate with work since returning to New South Wales so been unable to reply to your entry. Firstly I would like to compliment you on your presentations at the BRMA Convention they were entertaining, informative and inspiring for novice or experienced railway modellers. As I said during the convention I have an extensive library of history books with WWII featuring. The combination of historical railway modelling within a very strong military context makes for a fascinating topic and a very exciting layout and hence lecture topic. It was first class and very stimulating.

 

I would also like to thank you for your generous comments above. I have been very focussed on progressing the layout while I have been in Brisbane and am happy with progress to date. I think with such a large project you need to take satisfaction from developing the layout in stages and the achievement of specific goals. Without this approach with the end point being so far away I think there would be a loss of interest and momentum. I shall continue to try to attract helpers who can take part ownership in the layout, but we shall see how it goes.

 

Your comments meant a lot to me given your experience and fantastic contribution you have made to the hobby. They provide great encouragement to continue the impetus of the last 2 years when I can back to Brisbane from NSW. Thankyou again for the reply it is really appreciated.

 

John the layout is available to be viewed by you and others whenever I am home. I understand the demands of work.

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

[Anthony Ashley]

HELP WITH FIDDLE YARD THROAT DESIGN TO REDUCE CONGESTION

 

 

Dear All,

I am looking for the best design for the 34 track fiddle yard throat. The picture below is the current design. The plan has the up and down tracks in red and purple at the top of the photo merging into a single point. The next point has a light blue line which is the run around loop for the fiddle yard merging with the throat of the fiddle yard (fiddle yard tracks are in orange). There is then a single piece of track from which the 32 track fiddle yard commences. The second photo below is a wider view of the same area. I hope the single access track into the fiddle yard will be sufficient to allow access to one form the fiddle yard. Does anyone have a plan modification to improve it.

 

 

 

Any comments will be gratefully received as I am unsure about the best option to reduce congestion. The fiddle yards will be operating automatically using TC gold. 

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

 

Edited December 6, 2015 by Anthony Ashley

[St Enodoc]

HELP WITH FIDDLE YARD THROAT DESIGN TO REDUCE CONGESTION

 

 

Dear All,

 

I am looking for the best design for the 34 track fiddle yard throat. The picture below is the current design. The plan has the up and down tracks in red and purple at the top of the photo merging into a single point. The next point has a light blue line which is the run around loop for the fiddle yard merging with the throat of the fiddle yard (fiddle yard tracks are in orange). There is then a single piece of track from which the 32 track fiddle yard commences. The second photo below is a wider view of the same area. I hope the single access track into the fiddle yard will be sufficient to allow access to one form the fiddle yard. Does anyone have a plan modification to improve it.

 

Fiddle yard throat.jpg

 

Fiddle yard throat2.jpg

 

Any comments will be gratefully received as I am unsure about the best option to reduce congestion. The fiddle yards will be operating automatically using TC gold. 

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

 

 

Anthony, remind me - is this a dead-end fiddle yard or are the 32 tracks loops that join up again at the other end?

[Anthony Ashley]

Dear john

The fiddle yard terminates at the end of an 8 foot board which is next to a traverser providing the loco the opportunity to access the traverser move to a run around line (the blue one) and then return to the fiddle hard throat and reverse back onto the same fiddle yard line.

Edited December 6, 2015 by Anthony Ashley

[St Enodoc]

Dear john

The fiddle yard terminates at the end of an 8 foot board which is next to a traverser providing the loco the opportunity to access the traverser move to a run around line (the blue one) and then return to the fiddle hard throat and reverse back onto the same fiddle yard line.

Thanks Anthony. On that basis I don't think there is anything fundamentally wrong with your design, but you might want to connect the blue run round line to the purple departure track rather than to the orange single track. That way another train could arrive at the fiddle yard on the red and orange tracks while a loco is running round on the blue and purple tracks. One other thing might be to even out some of the fiddle yard track lengths and at the same time try to reduce the number of reverse curves on the approach.

[Simond]

I'd tend to agree with John, if the yard is single ended, then by definition you need to access every road from both up and down lines, so it is necessary to either reduce to a single bidirectional line, and then fan out, or, as we did on Ken Stansfield's "Swanage", have a pair if back-to-back crossovers, or a scissors.

 

My preference in your situation would be a scissors, as this allows you to begin to fan out earlier, which in turn will give you longer sidings as a percentage of the overall yard length. It will also help reduce the reverse curve effect.

 

I was going to suggest that the "run round" might be advantageously in the middle of the 32 tracks, but on reflection, I guess you have a turntable in this line? That would drive it to be on one side or the other, (or have one on each side) and again, I could imagine that it connected to the main line outside the scissors, thus giving access to any of the sidings.

 

I suppose it depends on how intensively your model will operate. It is certainly possible that bringing a loco onto the front of its new train would be a bottleneck, if it prevented other trains from entering or leaving at the same time - which I guess it must - but that's not necessarily a problem if there's time to clear it out of the way before the next scheduled arrival or departure.

 

Hope this helps

Simon

[Anthony Ashley]

QUESTION FOR THROAT OF FIDDLE YARD

 

Dear John and Simon,

 

The reason for the different lengths of the fiddle yard tracks is to save some track. Given the 34 tracks if each is 8 feet that is 272 feet of track in the fiddle yard alone. I am trying to reduce the expense a little.

I came up with another ides. I have split the up and down lines into 2 pairs. The first will terminate in fiddle yard lines 1-18 and the second pair for 19-34. This will reduce the traffic over the single line form which all of the fiddle yard lines fan out. I have also included a cross over point between the 2 single lines to enable the correct tracks to be accessed for reversing back into the fiddle yard after using the run around loop. What doo you think? This option will reduce traffic on each line by about half.

 

 

 

The second picture gives you an over view of the fiddle yard layout.

 

  

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

[St Enodoc]

QUESTION FOR THROAT OF FIDDLE YARD

 

Dear John and Simon,

 

The reason for the different lengths of the fiddle yard tracks is to save some track. Given the 34 tracks if each is 8 feet that is 272 feet of track in the fiddle yard alone. I am trying to reduce the expense a little.

I came up with another ides. I have split the up and down lines into 2 pairs. The first will terminate in fiddle yard lines 1-18 and the second pair for 19-34. This will reduce the traffic over the single line form which all of the fiddle yard lines fan out. I have also included a cross over point between the 2 single lines to enable the correct tracks to be accessed for reversing back into the fiddle yard after using the run around loop. What doo you think? This option will reduce traffic on each line by about half.

 

 Fiddle yard throat3A.jpg

 

The second picture gives you an over view of the fiddle yard layout.

 

Fiddle yard throat4A.jpg  

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

That should work fine.

[Simond]

Anthony,

 

I don't think I understand... Or, if I do understand, I'm not sure how it helps.

 

I'm thinking that a train comes into any one of the 32 sidings, if it's not an MU, the loco uncouples, runs forward onto the traverser, is traversed, returns up another siding (or designated run-round), is turned if appropriate, and then runs backwards onto the same, or another, train, ready for it's next turn.

 

If I'm right, I don't see how the loops outside the entry fans help. Both the up and down line need to connect to every siding, as does the run-round, via the up or down (or a head shunt). In which case you would need the connection(s) from the run-round to the up & down lines beyond the throat, or you'll end up doing a multiple shunt to get the loco onto its train.

 

Maybe I've got it wrong?

Best

Simon

[Anthony Ashley]

Dear Simon,

 

I think you missed an essential element of my cunning new plan. I have inserted a crossover between the 2 fiddle yard throats after the point connecting the run around loop. This allows a loco to use the run around loop and access either the top or bottom half of the fiddle yard, depending on where it came from. What do you think of this as a conmpromise to reduce traffic on either line by half?? There is enough single line track above the cross over to accommodate a loco and coach if required. This will be the longest rake using the run around loop.

 

Photo below provides the picture of the cross over.

 

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

[Simond]

Aha!

 

Yes, probably!

 

Best

Simon

[Anthony Ashley]

LAYOUT DEVELOPMENTS

 

Dear All,

 

Photos of the left sided hidden track area.

 

Width of the 34 track yard is shown

 

 

First design for single track yard throat area. I am going to split it into 2 lines.

 

 

Another view of yard area from other end

 

Helix

 

 

Castle. my favourite area to date

 

 

View of bottom level of left side hidden track area

 

 

 

All comments are welcome.

 

Regards,

 

Anthony Ashley

 

 

 

 

 

 

[JRSS]

Wow what a project, completely in awe of the scale of the whole thing.

 

Will you have some form of automation for running the trains? I am sure I would get very confused with all those tracks and levels.