Christleton Junction - 1986 - Gateway to North Wales

[5BarVT]

2 hours ago, Mol_PMB said:

The book 'The Railways of Port Sunlight and Bromborough Port' was published in 1980

It was reprinted and additional material added in 1988 and 2018.

3 hours ago, 61656 said:

6E36 Bromboro to Purfleet

And it’s corresponding working 6M16 Purfleet to Bromborough.  Ran 1988 to 1992. 10x73 tonne tanks specially built for hot edible oil traffic from Purfleet to Bromborough.  Booked class 47 but 31 or peak not unknown.

Paul.

[Mol_PMB]

That’s interesting- I shall have to look out for a newer edition of the book to replace my old one. 

 

On other matters, I know this is too late for you but a DBSO is a bit of a surprise on the NWC:

 

[61656]

4 minutes ago, Mol_PMB said:

 

 

On other matters, I know this is too late for you but a DBSO is a bit of a surprise on the NWC:

 

 

Trust me, it would be an even bigger surprise at Christleton!

[5BarVT]

7 minutes ago, Mol_PMB said:

That’s interesting- I shall have to look out for a newer edition of the book to replace my old one. 

2018 one has photos of the edible oil workings whereas the 1988 version just has a description.  2018 version also has photos of the centenary celebration workings.  It’s also twice the page size so an easier read.

Paul.

 

[61656]

In other news, there is sky.

 

 

 

 

 

At the moment the sky prints are loosely held in place whilst I build up to be brave enough to peel back the adhesive protector. 

[BenW]

Bardon Hill is the big aggregate quarry over near my old place in Coalville. GBRF still take trains of stone out, no idea where to but Geoff H used to work on the line back in the day - he’d have some idea about traction 

[61656]

A few pictures from tonight’s running session. Having the back scene around the whole of the layout makes a much bigger difference than I expected. 
 

A pair of 20’s get a heavy oil train moving towards Warrington, obscured by a bog cart. The local service from Helsby is creeping in - the driver knows the signal won’t clear until the tanks are clear of the junction. 
 

 

With the current dearth of DMU’s, a loco plus coaches is an inevitable substitution. A borrowed class 31 takes a couple of mk2s to Manchester Oxford Road. The local enthusiasts have opted for the 31, having seen the 47 waiting for the next train to the coast. 

 

 

Having arrived from the north east, a large logo 47 pauses for a well earned diesel top up. 
 

[61656]

A little video interlude… green class 40 40122 passing through platform 2 with empties for Penmaenmawr. A pair of 29s have just run around an oil train about to head East via Warrington, whilst a class 101 has just arrived from Helsby in platform 3. 
 

 

[cheesysmith]

Been looking through the Hugh Longworth DMU book. Luck for you Chester had lost it last 103 before the time you set yourself. There is a entry for Chester for 1988 and it was full of 101&108s. I think you could get away with just them and maybe a 104 coming in from Manchester . Most of the non standard types had gone by then. The only one you would need would be a 127 DPMU. They had been introduced in 85, and the route to North wales coast was one they used. Check the WTT. 

[cheesysmith]

Also been doing some research on the railcar website. Bad news on the DMU front. You will need to do some scratch building and/or conversions for you parcels units. In 86, chester was allocated some 120s and 116 to use for parcels work. The 116 DMBS were paired with 120 DMBC, and 6 (3 pairs) of 120 DMBF ex scottish units with the double brake van doors were in use.

 

None of these are available RTR, so a bit of ingenuity will be required here. 

[61656]

8 hours ago, cheesysmith said:

Also been doing some research on the railcar website. Bad news on the DMU front. You will need to do some scratch building and/or conversions for you parcels units. In 86, chester was allocated some 120s and 116 to use for parcels work. The 116 DMBS were paired with 120 DMBC, and 6 (3 pairs) of 120 DMBF ex scottish units with the double brake van doors were in use.

 

None of these are available RTR, so a bit of ingenuity will be required here. 

That aligns with where my work with the WTT has got to so far. I’ve transferred all mid week freight workings into excel, but not got beyond about 11am in the passenger and parcels. 
 

So far I haven’t had an obvious turn from a 127, but late evening is probably most likely. I also have 3 supplements to work through, which make a few changes - a D585 (loco hauled up to 585 tonnes for a 47 - say 17 or 18 BGs worth) becomes a DPU! 
 

Once I’ve finalised the transfer of all services I’ll update it to the supplements. Then I need to consider the changes to services that Christleton offers. Obviously there are many services which now run round, but there is also the possibility of unit services to Manchester being an EMU. I haven’t worked out which is more likely yet, Piccadilly via Altrincham or Victoria via Newton-le-Willows. There’s also the option of diagramming some inter-regional services, such as Bristol - Edinburgh via Christleton. 
 

One genuine DMU question is the 1D30 weekday Nottingham to Llandudno. This is booked as a DMU(A), so presumably a 150. What would it have been before a sprinter? I’m guessing a faster DMU like a 120, rather than a 25 on mk1s…

[cheesysmith]

The 150/1 was introduced to Derby late 85 , replacing the 120s that went to Scotland as they were having a shortage at the time (107 axles?). Before that it would have been 120 with either a 120 centre car or a 101 ( this was done I believe as to improve the power to weight ratio but keep a reasonable passenger loading capacity, 2+2 seating Vs 3+2 in the metcam centre car).

[61656]

On 24/01/2022 at 00:18, cheesysmith said:

The 150/1 was introduced to Derby late 85 , replacing the 120s that went to Scotland as they were having a shortage at the time (107 axles?). Before that it would have been 120 with either a 120 centre car or a 101 ( this was done I believe as to improve the power to weight ratio but keep a reasonable passenger loading capacity, 2+2 seating Vs 3+2 in the metcam centre car).

Well the 101 centre car is a possibility!

 

A 120 is another unit on the list of things I’d like to have a go at. I am determined to progress further with the scenery before I get distracted with rolling stock though!

[61656]

After an excellent running session midweek, with 2 hours needed to progress from midnight to 03.30, time once again to progress with the fiddle yards. 
 

The Holyhead yard is now complete bar a spur for White Lane siding #3. There’s no rush as I won’t run out of DMU storage anytime soon. 
 

I think I’ve got all the sidings down in the Crewe and Warrington yards. Here we see the current and hopefully final layout. 
 

 

The 5 roads to the left are the Crewe yard, sidings C1 to C5. C1-3 hold six coaches plus loco, C4&5 hold five plus loco. The right hand six are W1 to W6, the Warrington sidings. They can all hold a loco plus six coaches (W5&6 to the extreme right can hold a little more). W1 should have been a through road, but the geometry at the far end just won’t allow it. W2-4 are all through roads, allowing access to the Crewe end. W3 is the tightest curve on the layout at about 450mm radius. I think the timetable will be able to accommodate this. 
 

I have one further alteration to make on the lifting section, as currently lines W1&2 can’t access the Up Warrington, which the timetable requires them to do. W1 will be pretty much exclusively for the MGR - there’s a 47 and 12 tanks in there in the photo for length testing (I’m hoping an HAA is the same length as a TTA). 
 

Not long until it’s back to scenery!

[cheesysmith]

http://barrowmoremrg.co.uk/Prototype.html

 

That should be a link to the barrowmore website. They have the BR diagram books there. Keep it, as it is useful. Answer, a HAA and a TTA are both approx the same length, just short of 30ft over buffers.

 

[P.C.M]

On 24/01/2022 at 11:18, cheesysmith said:

The 150/1 was introduced to Derby late 85 , replacing the 120s that went to Scotland as they were having a shortage at the time (107 axles?). Before that it would have been 120 with either a 120 centre car or a 101 ( this was done I believe as to improve the power to weight ratio but keep a reasonable passenger loading capacity, 2+2 seating Vs 3+2 in the metcam centre car).

I am not sure when they   went to North Wales but 142s were running by 87 88.

[61656]

4 hours ago, P.C.M said:

I am not sure when they   went to North Wales but 142s were running by 87 88.

This somewhat depressing view from Flickr shows both 142 and 150 at Chester in early 1986. At this stage the 142s were all sheded at Newton Heath and the 150s at Derby Etches Park, but it looks like they still started to make inroads into traditional DMU territory right from the outset.

 

 

Luckily Christleton suffers no such afflictions!

[Mol_PMB]

Ugh! 142s! Where's the 'dislike' button?

[61656]

1D03 arrives at 03.49 with the vans from Holyhead, booked for a class 47 and up to 280 tonnes of vacuum braked coaches, today a relatively light load of 4 GUVs behind a toffee apple 31. 

 

Meanwhile on shed there’s some activity around the 08 getting it ready to shunt the speedlink arrival just after 5am. One of the 25s receives a visual exam as it will take the speedlink onwards to the coast. 

 

 

 

 

[P.C.M]

More great pics. I am not a fan of 142s and 150s but I do run a couple on Llanbourne as they were part of the scene back then. 

[61656]

52 minutes ago, P.C.M said:

More great pics. I am not a fan of 142s and 150s but I do run a couple on Llanbourne as they were part of the scene back then. 

There is much inner turmoil as I balance my love of accuracy with my detest of 142s and 150s. But they were definitely part of the scene and they should be there. A 120 first though…

[61656]

The penultimate piece in the fiddle yard jigsaw, at least until I next have a flash of inspiration!

 

The lifting section now has a double crossover to enable all 6 Warrington sidings to exit via the Up or Down Warringtons or via the sneaky connection to the Holyhead yard. 
 

 

The 47 sits quite tight with 12 tanks (SLUs…standard length units). The pair of 20s will only fit with the raising section lowered. In writing this I’m already thinking 1-3 would be better as through roads rather than 2-4…

 

[P.C.M]

On 01/02/2022 at 22:42, 61656 said:

There is much inner turmoil as I balance my love of accuracy with my detest of 142s and 150s. But they were definitely part of the scene and they should be there. A 120 first though…

I would like a 120, and a 104 which I have the bits for it's just finding the time to do it.  

[61656]

3 hours ago, P.C.M said:

I would like a 120, and a 104 which I have the bits for it's just finding the time to do it.  

A 104 is possibly just around the corner from Heljan but I think a 120 is unlikely anytime soon. Whether the 104 will be affordable is a different question!

 

I remain determined to get on with the scenery before looking at rolling stock - but I can feel the temptation!

[61656]

A new addition to the railway room is this butchered Quail map (it’s from 1990, so should be fairly accurate). When I have visitors, most don’t really know where Christleton is in relation to the other places in the North West, and no wonder, there’s a lot of railway around there. 
 

I have temporarily sketched in Christleton, but will do a proper job with a Rotring in due course. 

Unfortunately they are oriented North - South, meaning that they are a mirror image of the layout…