Curved Canopy Station Roof

[Chrisjh]

I wonder if I could ask for some help as I have just come back into modelling ?

A friend of mine is helping to build an extension to my existing layout. On the upper layout we have built a large terminus on one of the curves. Its an oval shaped layout. As the up and down lines enter the station they fan out to give four running lines through the station and two lines which go outside of the platforms between lines 1 and 2 and 5 and 6. 

We are looking to build a curved canopy roof similar to York station which spans the two platforms and the four running lines.

With my very limited modelling skills I am not sure if this is possible.

Just wondering if anybody has any advice they can offer us?

Many thanks and best wishes,
Chris

[Siberian Snooper]

I wonder if I could ask for some help as I have just come back into modelling ?

A friend of mine is helping to build an extension to my existing layout. On the upper layout we have built a large terminus on one of the curves. Its an oval shaped layout. As the up and down lines enter the station they fan out to give four running lines through the station and two lines which go outside of the platforms between lines 1 and 2 and 5 and 6. 

We are looking to build a curved canopy roof similar to York station which spans the two platforms and the four running lines.

With my very limited modelling skills I am not sure if this is possible.

Just wondering if anybody has any advice they can offer us?

Many thanks and best wishes,

Chris

It is possible to produce a 'curved' overall roof similar to York or Bristol, what you will find is that it's a lot of straight bits joined together,as each bit is probably only 20 or 30 foot long it looks like a curve in that sort of scale.

[Chrisjh]

It is possible to produce a 'curved' overall roof similar to York or Bristol, what you will find is that it's a lot of straight bits joined together,as each bit is probably only 20 or 30 foot long it looks like a curve in that sort of scale.

 

Many thanks Siberian Snooper

 

Best,

Chris

[phil_sutters]

The January RM has an article on building a large overal roof, albeit a straight one. It might give you some tips. They have tried to keep it simple and inexpensive.

[rue_d_etropal]

Curved structure are never that easy to build. You need to work out a lot before making first cut. I could be done by 3D printing easily, but not that cheap. With care it could be designed so that all you do is slide in some thin transparet plastic fo the glazing.

[Chrisjh]

Thanks Phil, thanks Rue I think I need to have a re-think as this is well beyond my modelling skills

[Siberian Snooper]

Draw out your curves full sized, depending on the radius, I would probably use lining paper, the stuff you stick on the wall first to hide the cracks etc.use a sharpened nail as a pivot in a length of timber and drill a hole to take a pencil to act as a trammel. Once you have your arcs, inner and outer, draw the start of your roof and then step off using a pair of compass the length of each straight, 20 to 30 ft at whatever scale you are using around the outer curve, until you reach the other end ideally all the sections will be the same,a little adjustment may be needed to get the right pitch. You now need to draw lines from your marks towards your centre mark until they meet the inner radius. You will now have the width across your canopy and the number of trusses required. If you are any good at trignometry and maths, I ain't that good. Now all you need is to make a jig so that you can make all those trusses the same. Once built, it's only a matter of joining them all together. Don't forget that curved and triangular structures are strongest. Have a good look at your prototype for inspiration.

 

Plenty of help if you need it.

[rue_d_etropal]

Chris,

it has given me another idea , I enjoy the challenge. Roughly what radius of curve are we talking about?

Thing is, I am a mathematician and sometimes struggle with the trig, so know how tricky it can be. I switch between 2 and 3 dimensions with relative ease. It is sometimes when you try to explain something that you realise others simply don't see things in same way, which is why I get annoyed when some say anyone should be able to do any skill.

  At least when designing something like this on computer, it is not actually materials, so mistakes don't cost anything.

[runs as required]

I think I may be able to offer help about building a curved station.

 

Inthe last few years before I retired completely, I really enjoyed myself encouraging first year/ first term/first 3 weeks architecture students into modelmaking.

These day most are women – and virtually none have any basic skills with blades, straight edges, cutting mats or glue (Uhu). The first few days could be very scary – which is why I hid behind a professional model maker,  letting him deal with H&S introductory sessions, cut fingers and angry parents.

 

But by mid term virtually everyone had taken to actually making stuff in order to design, rather than do bad drawings.   My most popular intros were early group projects of a few days where 4 or 5 young things would go out and try and capture one of the Tyne Bridges or complex structures in model form.

Always highly popular was the interior of Central Station – which is why I think I can help.

 

In my opinion Central Station’s curved interior is more elegant and delicate than later structures And as my overlays shew, really quite simple in its repetitive geometry – as someone said above between the arch forms the longitudinal members: beams and planking are all straight.

My overlays were to show students how to “read” the structure, then simplify it.

I hope I have understood what you are wanting and have roughly sketched a double arched constant span structure that bears onto columns sited between the up and down through tracks (3&4) and outside the outer tracks (1 & 6)

One rule in our student model making was that only stuff found in skips was to be used, and I still prefer making models this way – using free materials one is not scared of making mistakes.

Making myself a simple jig, I’d bend the repetitive arched hoops-come-columns out of quite thick fencing wire then peg them into a accurately set out and drilled curved ply base.

I’d even leave the arch ribs bare (implying an overall roof) but it is easy to fill in between them with straight bits of wood and card.

Curved station platforms are best cut first from packing box corrugated cardboard and trimmed and adjusted until they work with clearance and heights, before making more permanent.

 

Things can always be re-worked later as you progress (dt’s Dover Priory thread is a good example of this way of working)

 

Best of luck

dh

[runs as required]

Today I've had a more sobering thought about the practicality of simply building a simplified model of a structure of the scale of Newcastle Central Station for an actual layout - it would be vastly too big for 00 gauge .

I superimposed a Hornby track radii diagram on the 1851 plan of the Dobson/Harrison Central Station train shed and immediately saw how the radius of Central Sttion is 7 times greater!

So I had a go at planning out the OP's required 6 track curved station with the 4 platform faces (using the same principles as the Central Station shed), on the Hornby diagram - accepting its throwover clearances but not using the tightest curve.

The result is a pretty bulky structure that would require a width of 7 foot 3 inches and would be very dominant. However the 2 roof spans of just over 70ft (288mm) are reasonable.  .

 

I've always hankered after a more modest 4 track (2 platform faces) version for the far end of my roundy-round but I now realise Icould not accommodate the width.

dh

[runs as required]

I’ve had another thought about my posts about modelling a simplified Newcastle Central trainshed.

I’ve adapted it as a project for the far end of my roundy-round.

 

An internal view of my Sketchup model

 

 

My layout has grown like Topsy from a drunken communal Christmas Eve 2006 build over a basic track mat included with a Hornby trainset (Bulleid Pacific and illuminated Pullmans) for the eldest grandson.

 

The grandson has this year reached the age of consent(!) but that branch of the family still fondly recall their heyday of travelling on the GNER from Kings Cross via us on Tyneside to the more illustrious grandfather in Newtonmore.

That is why the present round-round still has their imaginary East Coast journey (with reversal at Newcastle) built into it.

 

 

More recently it has run everything from my H0 French Jouef, Italian and Balkan stuff, all my Big Four stock plus a revived Live Steam Mallard on the outer perimeter.

I haven’t shewn anything of the landside of the station. Rather than Prosser’s porte cochere, I think I might opt for a more Huddersfield style portico/pavillion using the Ionic order.

dh

 

But... what's the betting it remains 'a pipe dream' ?

[Chrisjh]

Many thanks Dave no I hadn't seen your very detailed response which is really helpful.  Which editing tools did you use? as they are really interesting

 

Thanks Dave much appreciated

 

Best,

C

[runs as required]

Which editing tools did you use? as they are really interesting

My (expensive) main program is 'Photoshop' (a raster image editor) which I acquired for undertaking a consultancy research project shortly after retirement.

3D modelling is more problematic - I used to teach students Autocad (3D CAD vector), but I couldn't possibly afford it as a pensioner. So I jump from freebie to freebie - the one I've stayed with most is 'Sketchup M' launched originally as a Google freebie. It was subsequently sold on, since when this freebie is the blunt end of a far more expensive package rivalling Autocad in costing £1,000s!

You will see others on RMweb advocate Inkscape and CorelDraw e.g on the guide to using a Silhouette cutter.

(I do so lust after one of those cutters).

 

Good Luck!

dh

[Chrisjh]

Thanks again David C