Darstaed Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 Andries, With the vents above the toilet windows, according to the photos that youve recently pointed me to, they seem not to have the vents present/fitted (the vents should raised slightly and slightly angled too), will such be included/featured on the production models? Also, on later coaches, do they all come with commonwealth bogies or can other bogie types be specified/will they be fitted or perhaps available as spares? Thanks in anticipation, kind regards, CME Dear CME, Thank you for your post. As far as I know all toilet windows have ventilators above them. To make them slanted is not possible with etching I am afraid but they are 3 level etching. Cheers, Andries Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 Dear CME, All decisions re pricing, discounts etc are taken by Ellis Clark and Bob Wyatt jointly. I am just the manufacturer, arcane science of marketing is not my cup of tea. Perhaps you should contact them, Cheers, Andries Thanks Andries, I understand your POV. I have tried-no replies, hopefully they read this Thread though........ Dear CME, Thank you for your post. As far as I know all toilet windows have ventilators above them. To make them slanted is not possible with etching I am afraid but they are 3 level etching. Cheers, Andries ......thanks again Andries, I understand, there are ways around that in brass, depends on time, effort and costs though. Kindest regards to all, CME. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTM Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 (edited) I purchased a BSK and a CK in Southern (BR) green at the Bristol show yesterday. I am well impressed, but maybe my motives are different from the rivet counters. Firstly, these coaches offer great VFM. As a comparison, they are just over three times the price of a typical Hornby OO gauge Pullman with lights etc. which are pretty much 'spec equivalent' and that's ignoring the market economies of a much larger production run. Secondly, I like the way they are built. The coach feels robust to handle (important to me) and uses a wise combination of metal and plastic construction to suit the individual parts. The coaches, therefore have a lovely heavy feel yet incorporate the detail that satisfies me. For my modelling needs, I will be happy enough to just apply the transfers, some seated figures and perhaps some light weathering. They are a perfect compromise and if there are experts out there who can highlight any historical inaccuracies on mine, please do so as I do value your expertise. In the meantime and afterwards, I'll be using them on my layout and enjoying them. Usual disclaimer: I have no connection with Darstead, have never bought any of their products before this but really appreciate their no-nonsense approach to finescale O gauge at an affordable price. Jon Edited January 29, 2018 by KTM 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 I purchased a BSK and a CK in Southern (BR) green at the Bristol show yesterday. I am well impressed, but maybe my motives are different from the rivet counters. Firstly, these coaches offer great VFM. As a comparison, they are just over three times the price of a typical Hornby OO gauge Pullman with lights etc. which are pretty much 'spec equivalent' and that's ignoring the market economies of a much larger production run. Secondly, I like the way they are built. The coach feels robust to handle (important to me) and uses a wise combination of metal and plastic construction to suit the individual parts. The coaches, therefore have a lovely heavy feel yet incorporate the detail that satisfies me. For my modelling needs, I will be happy enough to just apply the transfers, some seated figures and perhaps some light weathering. They are a perfect compromise and if there are experts out there who can highlight any historical inaccuracies on mine, please do so as I do value your expertise. In the meantime and afterwards, I'll be using them on my layout and enjoying them. Usual disclaimer: I have no connection with Darstead, have never bought any of their products before this but really appreciate their no-nonsense approach to finescale O gauge at an affordable price. Jon Hi Jon, Any chance of some close up photos, underframes and bogies too, please? How much are they each-are they only available via a duel source outlet? Also, you mention the phrase; 'rivet counter', how would you define such relative to these coaches? Thanks in anticipation, CME Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 I bought Set A in blood and custard and quite happy with them. A few niggles which they are sorting out. Watch out for the back to back measurement as mine were set to 29mm and derailed on my Peco points as the wheels were catching the check rails. Moving them out to 29.5mm fixed it and new ones from the factory are now being set at this measurement. They do listen. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 I bought Set A in blood and custard and quite happy with them. A few niggles which they are sorting out. Watch out for the back to back measurement as mine were set to 29mm and derailed on my Peco points as the wheels were catching the check rails. Moving them out to 29.5mm fixed it and new ones from the factory are now being set at this measurement. They do listen. 507279F0-0A12-4C5D-BEF8-B629E0DC633E.jpeg They look the part on your layout. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) Thanks. They do run quite nicely. The close coupling as well is well thought out using the Kadees and the magnets in the corridor connections. Blanking plates for the BCK’s will be sent out once they are available. I moved the couplings out to allow them to go around my tight curves which they do. They have already pre drilled fixing holes to allow the draft boxes for the couplings to be moved. The issue for me is the couplings seem to be set at a more scale height rather than the height set by the Kadee height gauge so you can trip them using the magnet in the track. I moved mine down 4mm using a packer so they work now. Made very little difference to the appearance. I let them know about this. The two suppliers and Darstead are listening and taking action to fix issues. Edited January 30, 2018 by two tone green 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Thanks. They do run quite nicely. The close coupling as well is well thought out using the Kadees and the magnets in the corridor connections. Blanking plates for the BCK’s will be sent out once they are available. I moved the couplings out to allow them to go around my tight curves which they do. They have already pre drilled fixing holes to allow the draft boxes for the couplings to be moved. The issue for me is the couplings seem to be set at a more scale height rather than the height set by the Kadee height gauge so you can trip them using the magnet in the track. I moved mine down 4mm using a packer so they work now. Made very little difference to the appearance. I let them know about this. The two suppliers and Darstead are listening and taking action to fix issues. All sounds good to me! What have bogies and underframes turned out like? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 The bogies and undeframes for me are ok. I am not a rivet counter and at the distance I look at them they are very good. The bogies pivet in every direction so can cope with all sorts of uneven track. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 What I'm most concerned with are any features of these that are so badly off that they can't be mended. I don't mind (actually quite enjoy) enhancing details on RTR models - there's no fun in having a perfect RTR model. The coaches in Two Tones picture certainly look good. We need an expert appraisal I think. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 An expert will crusify them I expect. I tend to go on my own opinion. If I am happy with them then I am happy with them. Simple really. If you can wait until Friday when I get home I will take photos of the areas you are interested in. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 I expect you are right about the experts TTG. I can make my own decision once I've seen the details. I don't think I'm a rivet counter but I do like things to be essentially correct. RTR manufacturers can't put in all the details we'd like - the cost for that would be prohibitive. I look forward to seeing these in more detail. John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) I expect you are right about the experts TTG. I can make my own decision once I've seen the details. I don't think I'm a rivet counter but I do like things to be essentially correct. RTR manufacturers can't put in all the details we'd like - the cost for that would be prohibitive. I look forward to seeing these in more detail. John Hi John, I agree, we are of like minds. What I cant cope with are those things that 'jar' the eye - so Eg. I wouldnt want a MK1 that has an underframe akin to unmodified Lima MK1s, and the bogies have to be right too, if the price per coach is cost effective enough then bogies can be changed, if the former isnt the case then it isnt viable to change the bogies etc etc, so on and so forth. With the roofs, I still think I would be inclined to add weld seams using tape and then weather/paint atop - it isnt correct, but the roofs look too flat to my eyes. Viewing photos on the PC as opposed to a 'mobile device' (yuk!) does give me a better idea. BTW TTG, you have a very posh workshop (lucky fellow) - and, Im sorry to say one of your step/running boards looks to be bent on the last coach. ATVB CME Edited January 30, 2018 by CME and Bottlewasher 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Let me know which bits you want to see and I will take photos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) Let me know which bits you want to see and I will take photos. For me, bogies and underframes/battery boxes and control boxes etc.....thanks Edited January 30, 2018 by CME and Bottlewasher Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 I will be ordering Set B in blood and custard as well as others such as the TSO and another SK to make a rake of 12 coaches. Will do. For me, bogies and underframes/battery boxes and control boxes etc.....thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 I suppose I'm most concerned that the bodies are correct for the diagram depicted. Accurate length and compartments where they're supposed to be. Correcting errors here is a non starter. If there are things left off the underframes, I can probably add those myself. Same with bogies. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Order one from Scale Link. They offer a no quibble 10 days returns policy. If you don't like it, send it back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Order one from Scale Link. They offer a no quibble 10 days returns policy. If you don't like it, send it back. I'll hang on a bit. I want to see your pictures first, although I'm becoming convinced. John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 John, If you are a Guild member, you can see a detailed discussion about these coaches. Not my era, so I won’t be buying, but from what I’ve read, they’re bang on length, and every other major dimension. Here’s a quote from Andries Grabowsky, the boss of Darstaedt - this seems typical of the discussion on the forum (at least, the discussions related to Darstaedt!) Gentlemen, I can confirm that all the measurements except the BR1 bogies varie less than 1% with true scale. Sometimes the scale measurements translated to mm at a ratio of 1:43.5 from ft and inches results in too many digits so we have to round it off. The curve of the side is taken from the Parkin book pages 9 and 19. The curve is circular and I do not know why it "bulges" slightly in he picture shown by Robin. Regarding the BR1 bogies yes, that is our mistake due to the genesis of this model that started off as coarse scale until it evolved into fs. We had commissioned the tooling already using some of our 3-R coarse scale tooling too as we wanted to offer a product for the best price possible. The common wealth bogies that are fitted to the B/G , maroon and IC coaches are scale. The solution for the BR1 bogie could be to simply chuck away our stock made for the single coaches and rectify the tooling. We could make an up grade kit with two new bogie sides and a bogie frame for those who wish to change their BR1 bogies. I thank you for your constructive observations, Cheers, Andries Best Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Thanks Simon, shame on me for not thinking to check G0G. I'll take alook. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Im a GOG member, yet Ive struggled wth IT issues on their site. Does any know how much these coaches are each? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 I’d guess Ellis Clark does...! Best Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 Individual coaches are 189.00. Checking Scale Link and Ellis Clark, they all seem to be on pre order and there seems to be a push for sets. I can't see a listing for individual coaches other than RMB and SLF. I also checked G0G Forum - happily I remember being there previously I'm looking for maroon brake and 3rd. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 Try this. https://www.ellisclarktrains.co.uk/collections/darstaed-7mm-o-gauge-finescale-coaches/products/darstaed-finescale-o-gauge-mk1-coaches-singles-various-liveries Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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