BR Green versus GWR Green?

[Webstar]

I have a BR Prairie 45xx which currently has a BR green livery. I would like to convert this loco to a GWR (WW2 timeframe) livery.

It has been suggested that if I was to have the loco heavily weathered It should not really be necessary to repaint the loco to get the correct shade of green.

I should be interested in the forums thoughts on this?

[The Fatadder]

I’m fairly sure that BR green and post war GW green are the same shade, at least they are model wise. I don’t think either Hornby or Bachmann use different colours.

 

Of course I am assuming your model is in unlined green (given the odd practice of lining tank engines is very much a BR WR oddity), likewise there is the need to remove he smokebox number/shed plate

 

I have used a couple of BR locos to do similar (a relined modified hall and a 2251 from Bachmann and a castle tender from Hornby), in addition to doing similar jobs to respray a star into wartime black

[Il Grifone]

There is some discussion, but IMHO the colour is the same. BR just renamed it Brunswick green to pretend there was a difference, Allegedly there was a change in tint c 1955, but I never noticed it at the time. However, there was a change in paint composition post war.

 

As an example (I know its model copying model but...) Humbrol GWR loco green paint was an exact match for Hornby Dublo BR green.

 

The biggest problem is removing the BR lions and any lining without damaging the finish. As stated, tank engines had not been lined since WW I, but BR Western Region liberally interpreted 'passenger locomotives'. (It was only taxpayers' money not shareholders'!)

Edited November 3, 2017 by Il Grifone

[DCB]

The GWR was pretty astute when it came to penny pinching.  The unlined green livery was a pragmatic solution to Swindon not having a separate paint shop. Locos were painted during erection and slapping green paint on was a quick and easy solution to making the finished product look like someone cared instead of a no one gives a ***** unlined black.  Lined black was more difficult in that really they needed a day of so extra after repair to for a skilled painter to paint the lining, this is why lined black was so rare on the WR.

Unlined Green vs lined black for secondary locos cost few bobs worth of green pigment and saved a day on repairs.

BR Green looks different to GWR in that the lining is different and the running plate valance is black in GWR and green in BR.  I think GWR wartime green may not have been varnished (can anyone confirm) as pics seem to show it faded to a lighter green whereas the BR version looks shinier and seems to weather to a darker colour.  The old Hornby Dublo Duchess with Tinplate Tender always seemed the best model match to me. Hornby 2000's looks Khaki and quite ridiculous and later Bachmann too "Blue" but acceptable.   Dirty Kings were pretty rare as they were top link locos till the very end, and as for dirty cab windows, it was a quick and easy matter to clean them.

For accurate BR Green circa 1964 first spray the loco matt black then cover it with fine ash before it dries...

[coachmann]

The OP mentioned around the WW2 period, so after 1942 all repainting was done in plain black except for Castles and Kings which retained green but without lining. Moving into the post 1945 period, a lot of lesser locos were running in plain black and some continued to do so if they had recently received a repaint. David Jenkinson penned an article under another name in Backtrack stating that the green adopted by BR in 1949 had never changed from GWR. 

 

Sadly, the proprietary RTR manufacturers have never come to grips with green on their GWR and BR locos.  The green was neither chalky nor blu-ish.  Bluish green comes under the Brunswick spectrum and if BR called it Brunswick green, then one can see where the confusion came in, but this was not an isolated instance when it came to BR naming it chosen colours! The real green was Middle Chrome Green, which was at the yellow end of the spectrum. Some professional model painters, me included, use a colour that remains available in cellulose.....It has become a standard. A bluish green was often applied to diesel locomotives and I suspect it was applied to steam locomotives towards the end of steam judging by their appearance.

 

I would like to be able to recommend a model paint but I don't know how things stand at the moment. The  PPC 1928 loco green used to be closest. 

Edited November 3, 2017 by coachmann