Wiring Signals (CR Signals)

[thornabydemon]

Hi,

 

Have done a bit of searching but couldn't find anything specific and also deliberated over which was the best forum to ask but here seemed best.

 

I am pretty useless with electrics though with the help of this forum have had no issues wiring a large DCC layout with 50 or so seep motors etc for points, but anyone lets assume 'novice' so much so the instructions with the signals just go over my head.

 

I am looking to install a number of CR Signals mainly 3 aspect signals to my DCC layout.

 

I will be using switches which will be in the panel board alongside the switches for the points (nothing automated) and I get the wiring from the signal to the switch, although my assumption was for three way switches for the three aspect signals, logical, but what do I use for the signals that have 'feathers'?

 

Ok I understand the need to power the switches with a low voltage controller, but with the points the switches are all linked/looped so only one wire needs to go to the controllers, can that be the same principle with the switches for the signals?

 

Also for powering the signals is it best to effectively have a 'bus' with the signals concurrently plugged into it again meaning only one low voltage transformer required.

 

Anyway any advice would be appreciated on what switches are best to purchase for the ground signals (two aspect) main signals (three aspect) and signals with route indicators and more importantly the most effective wiring solution.

 

Thanks in advance

TD 

[GrahamB]

I don't know if this will help but it may get the conversation going.

 

Firstly, I have to thank CR Signals for their excellent service. I ordered mine last Thursday lunchtime and they arrived Friday morning! That also (hopefully) explains my limited experience with them. Without knowing where you signals will be placed it's a little difficult to give exact advice but here's what I have done for my Minories inspired layout.

 

The position light shunt signals only need a single pole changeover switch. The pivot light is permanently illuminated and allows you to toggle between the white and red. I found the light far too bright so I've added a further 10k ohm resistor which seems to make it look better although I'll have to check it against the layout lighting. The three aspect signals and their route indicators are fine as they are.

 

For the three aspect signals (I have four), I purchased a four pole changeover switch. That allows me to limit all of the signals to green or yellow. I've then used a single pole changeover switch to switch from red to whatever the yellow/green switch is set for. As I will only have (Hopefully) one train on the move at a time this suits me fine and allows me to step the signal up from yellow to green should I wish to simulate a further section becoming clear.

 

For the route indication, I used a car relay. In my case my home signal has three potential routes. 

Red is fed via the "normal" contact of the relay.

The switches activate the relay rather than the signal.

Where a route indication is required, the switch for that route is a double pole changeover. The second pole provides power to the route indicator.

The "switched" contact on the relay provides power to one of the four pole switch contacts mentioned above. That provides the required yellow/green aspect.

 

Please don't ask for a wiring diagram. I'm hopeless at doing them on a computer. Hope the above helps a little

[uax6]

What era are you going for, and are you having your signals controller from a local box or PSB? Also are your 3 aspects following each other along the track, or are they just going on their own in the visible section? Are you mixing them with semaphores?

 

The questions are to work out what you are planning to use them for and therefore how to wire them.

 

For instance if they are following each other, then you only need two position switches for all but the last one (which will need a three position one). You will also need a relay for each signal (except the last one).

1st signal: two position switch, to switch from red to yellow. Relay changeover contacts (normally closed) inserted in the yellow feed wire. The normally open contact wire to the green aspect.

2nd signal two position switch to switch from red to yellow. This should have two poles, the second pole on the yellow aspect operates the relay in the preceding signal to change that from yellow to green.

 

Last signal has a three position switch to allow red to yellow, and then yellow to green. The second pole for both yellow and green strapped together to allow the relay controlling the preceeding signal to go yellow to green.

 

If you are just putting single signals in then use a three position switch with no relay for each one.

 

If you are mixing with semaphores be careful that you don't show a green with the next arm on...

 

Andy G

[Suzie]

TD

 

It is usually easiest for manual operation to use rotary switches.

 

1. For ground signals use a 2-way.

 

2. For simple 3-aspect signals use a 3-way.

 

3. For 3-aspect with a feather use a 6-way - 2-pole. One pole is for the main head with the second pole for the feather. Positions will be:-

 

a. Green with feather. (diverging clear)

b. Yellow with feather. (diverging approach)

c. (Red with feather).

d. Red without feather. (stop)

e. Yellow without feather. (approach)

f. Green without feather. (clear)

 

Position c. is optional, and you should not leave the switch in this position, but it does briefly show the feather with red as on the prototype where the aspect does not change from red until the feather is proven lit.

 

As for a power supply it is probably best to consult CR Signals as to what voltage is required, but a single power supply will be sufficient for all the signals. You can run a common wire and feed the switches.

 

Switches are available from Maplin - FF74R will do everything, and FF76H will just do 2-way and 3-way.

 

I know that you want to be manual, but sometimes adding an auxiliary switch to a point to enable the feather can make life a lot easier.

[uax6]

The normal position of  Suzies rotary switch being position d, so mount that at the top.

 

Then you rotate it either direction to the required aspect.

 

Andy G

[John ks]

Here is a circuit for 3 aspect  siginals i found more than 40 years ago, if any body knows the original author of this circuit then I would be happy to give them credit

 

You will need 1 DPDT switch for each signal

 

You could use a SPST switch for each feather or as  previously mentioned you could use  a contact controlled by the point

 

 

this can be expanded to any number of signals & if you have a loop then the last signal is connected to the first signal

 

with the switches set as shown the first signal S4 will be red

 

S3 will be green because S2 is clear IE green or amber( in this case amber)

 

S2 is amber because S1 is red

 

 

 

John

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ray1949]

Hi

can somebody help me please 

My knowledge of electrics is very limited

I have purchased a Berko 3 Aspect junction colour light signal & also a Gaugemaster

4 pole 3 way rotary switch for each  signal head.

I cannot connect the wires correctly. is it possible to drabs a diagram of a switch

with how the wires should be connected ?

Many thanks

[Brian]

 

Hi

I assume you have one of these? Link to example

If so, two rotary switches are need - one for each signal head.

On the middle tabs of  each of the switches use the one usually marked as 'A' and apply a 12v DC supplies Positive to this tab.

Outside and close the the 'A' tab will be tabs marked 1, 2 & 3..  Connect signals Red aspect wire to 1. Yellow aspect wire to 2  and Green aspect to tab 3.  

That will leave the signals common return wire. This has one end of the resistor supplied connected to it and the other end of the resistor connects to the 12 volt supply Negative. Note the resistor is not polarity conscious device and can be connected either way around.

 

 

Edited April 5, 2020 by Brian
Drawing added