Yooski Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Good Evening All!I was wondering if anyone knows about the signalling within steels works - for instance, Scunthorpe or Port Talbot? Do they use 3 aspect signals? ground position lights? specialist signals? Any information regarding signalling would be useful - including in and out of exchange sidings! Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
br2975 Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 I was wondering if anyone knows about the signalling within steels works - for instance, Scunthorpe or Port Talbot? Do they use 3 aspect signals? ground position lights? specialist signals? Not sure about Port Talbot. . To my knowledge, Celsa (UK) (formerly Allied Steel & Wire and previously GKN) does not employ any signalling of significance; albeit there was once a level crossing on Rover Way between the Tremorfa Works and the scrap yard of Birds, later Allied Bird Fragmentisers. This was controlled by a brick built 'signal box' using lights and barriers, but was not continuously 'manned. . Brian R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Storey Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 There was certainly no signalling inside the steel works at Sheerness - all moves were controlled by their Shunter. The signals into and out of their yard from the national network consisted just of a shunt signal at one end and a controlled release frame at the other, linked to the Sittingbourne signal box and worked by the BR/FOC shunter or the train crew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted December 15, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 15, 2017 Lackenby and Redcar had signalling with more than one box I seem to recall it was two aspect red and green color lights and BR type ground position lights Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 Even the largest works had minimal internal signalling. Dorman Long had some colour lights controlling particularly busy sections on the works system but by and large the various works railways operated without them. Here are some colour lights controlling the busy lines by the Dorman Long Clay Lane and Bessemer blast furnaces at their sprawling Teesside complex circa 1959. There were no internal signals at Irlam and nor do I recall any at Shotton. Entry to some buildings/plant was sometimes controlled by red/green lights, the blast furnace cast house often being subject to controlled access. . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpplumy Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 scunthorpe only have signalling at road crossings (driver operated to inform driver when crossing lights are on) and stop boards on mainline connection. only others are for when entering buildings , which the driver must activate building sirens before. there are no other signals on the site appart from the fake signal at the visitor platform. all movements are radio controlled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yooski Posted December 15, 2017 Author Share Posted December 15, 2017 Thanks for the feedback everyone. Very enlightening. Is there a set work diagram to avoid conflicting movements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narrow Gauge Jordan Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 Thanks for the feedback everyone. Very enlightening. Is there a set work diagram to avoid conflicting movements? Steelworks traffic is a very as and when system, at scunthorpe, as soon as a rake of wagons are emptied or loaded, a loco will appear to take them away. as with the nature of the place its the train will run when its needed and in the case of scunthorpe, whichever route is available too. This can sometimes lead to some sights "mainliners" would be shocked at, such as a fully loaded train following another on the same track yards behind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 Steelworks traffic is a very as and when system, at scunthorpe, as soon as a rake of wagons are emptied or loaded, a loco will appear to take them away. as with the nature of the place its the train will run when its needed and in the case of scunthorpe, whichever route is available too. This can sometimes lead to some sights "mainliners" would be shocked at, such as a fully loaded train following another on the same track yards behind Speeds are generally low; the exceptions being the 'hot metal' routes from blast furnace to Basic Oxygen steel-making plant. I was amazed to see the speeds the torpedo ladles were moved at when I saw them between Redcar and Lackenby. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted December 15, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 15, 2017 Even the largest works had minimal internal signalling. Dorman Long had some colour lights controlling particularly busy sections on the works system but by and large the various works railways operated without them. Here are some colour lights controlling the busy lines by the Dorman Long Clay Lane and Bessemer blast furnaces at their sprawling Teesside complex circa 1959. 20467751-5369-4AD6-A1C1-1556F277C272.jpeg There were no internal signals at Irlam and nor do I recall any at Shotton. Entry to some buildings/plant was sometimes controlled by red/green lights, the blast furnace cast house often being subject to controlled access. . Superb picture Arthur, I recall seeing the remains of a semaphore gantry where the internal line passed under the BR line East of South bank coke ovens 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toplink@()1989))(( Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 I don't recall any specific signalling at Staveley works, ( Stanton and Staveley. ) however I believe there were 3 aspect lights where the road crossed the rails. I have a photo showing this type of light, but it was taken right at the end of Staveleys operations and the works were being demolished, it may or may not be rail related. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazjones1711 Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 Don't know if this is prototypical, but adds interest on the layout, this is a hand built signal with 5 fibre optic strands for the lights, 3 across for stop or 3 up for go , although I've seen a signal at a power station where the 2 outer stop lights are red, so may alter my signal to this design. This is on my Shepcote Lane tippler sidings layout 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Storey Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 13625393_1765187727090689_58667352948853836_n.jpg Don't know if this is prototypical, but adds interest on the layout, this is a hand built signal with 5 fibre optic strands for the lights, 3 across for stop or 3 up for go , although I've seen a signal at a power station where the 2 outer stop lights are red, so may alter my signal to this design. This is on my Shepcote Lane tippler sidings layout Nice model. This is similar to the control indicators used for Merry Go Round train loading and unloading facilities. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martyn11post Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 Current Port Talbot(& Llanwern) signalling (current) is two red lights alternate flashing (vertically mounted) at crossings. Entrance to sheds are Red & green light again vertically mounted typically above the door/roller shutters. Some have now been replaced recently by standard 3 aspect signals (although not seen amber in operation.) Also half barriers have been installed on hot metal routes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 Nice model. This is similar to the control indicators used for Merry Go Round train loading and unloading facilities. Which followed on from the 'creep' signals on the hump at Toton, IIRC 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SED Freightman Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 (edited) As BR295 mentions above, there is no internal signalling as such within Celsa UK's Castle or Tremorfa Works, however there are red and green lights at the entrance to buildings where overhead cranes operate in order to prevent rail movements from taking place whilst loading or unloading operations are occuring. In the picture below, red and green signals can just be seen either side of the entrance to the Tremorfa Works Melt Shop, where Hunslet 0-6-0 DH50-2 is about to place empty wagons for loading with billets. Edited December 18, 2017 by SED Freightman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yooski Posted December 17, 2017 Author Share Posted December 17, 2017 Cracking photo and great info. Do you have any more or a link to a album?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 I don't recall any specific signalling at Staveley works, ( Stanton and Staveley. ) however I believe there were 3 aspect lights where the road crossed the rails. I have a photo showing this type of light, but it was taken right at the end of Staveleys operations and the works were being demolished, it may or may not be rail related. 24296663_443459029384341_954757072452023612_n.jpg... OT, but the one in the photo is the standard traffic signal made by SGE (Siemens General Electric) - distinctive "bowls on stalks" design. Cast iron body - very heavy! Although long gone from British roads since the mid-80s, Singapore kept them in service for at least another 20 years, by which time they had LED inserts. A few still remain working in varying states of disrepair in Bulawayo, Zimbabwe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 Steelworks traffic is a very as and when system, at scunthorpe, as soon as a rake of wagons are emptied or loaded, a loco will appear to take them away. as with the nature of the place its the train will run when its needed and in the case of scunthorpe, whichever route is available too. This can sometimes lead to some sights "mainliners" would be shocked at, such as a fully loaded train following another on the same track yards behind I don't appear to have caught any signals at Scunthorpe, but on the brake van tour we approached a complex junction and then had to back up to permit 82 [ex D8066, 20066] to go on its working way. http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/scunthorpesteel/e91c80b9c Mention has been made of the road controls, this is the road side at Llanwern http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/industriallocomotive/e2dc34091 http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/industriallocomotive/e2060075a Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Alex TM Posted December 17, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 13625393_1765187727090689_58667352948853836_n.jpg Don't know if this is prototypical, but adds interest on the layout, this is a hand built signal with 5 fibre optic strands for the lights, 3 across for stop or 3 up for go , although I've seen a signal at a power station where the 2 outer stop lights are red, so may alter my signal to this design. This is on my Shepcote Lane tippler sidings layout Hi, I know this is off-topic, but the signal reminds me of the ones used by Edinburgh's trams; their's have five lights and with a diagonal setting too. The light positions are similar but have a different meaning. Horizontal means everybody stops (except cyclists), while vertical means everyone but the tram stops (aka - block the whole road for what seems like an eternity). Anyway, interesting to see signalling in an industrial context. Regards, Alex. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SED Freightman Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 Cracking photo and great info. Do you have any more or a link to a album?? Sorry, no album, but I have found another couple of photos showing the red and green lights controlling rail movements into buildings within Tremorfa Works. There were (a couple of years ago) no signals controlling movements from Tremorfa Works via either route into Tidal Sidings nor on the Cross Dock Link connecting Tremorfa and Castle Works via Splott Junction. The West Section Mill Billet Unloading Bay has a single two aspect signal applicable to all three sidings. The New Scrap Bay has separate signals for each siding. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkea1 Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 I Current Port Talbot(& Llanwern) signalling (current) is two red lights alternate flashing (vertically mounted) at crossings. 20170630_155533 (2).jpg Entrance to sheds are Red & green light again vertically mounted typically above the door/roller shutters. Some have now been replaced recently by standard 3 aspect signals (although not seen amber in operation.) Also half barriers have been installed on hot metal routes. I'm intrigued - what are the white cylinders in the background?? Cheers Alastair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 I I'm intrigued - what are the white cylinders in the background?? Cheers Alastair They look to have BOC markings towards the top, so perhaps liquid oxygen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martyn11post Posted December 25, 2017 Share Posted December 25, 2017 (edited) I believe replacement tanks for pickle liquor (hydrochloric acid). They were there temporary ahead of replacing the original tanks. Regards Martyn Edited December 25, 2017 by martyn11post 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkea1 Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 I believe replacement tanks for pickle liquor (hydrochloric acid). They were there temporary ahead of replacing the original tanks. Regards Martyn Hi Martyn, Thanks for this - makes sense now! I spend 6 months or so working in the Cold Mill (including pickle lines) around 1999 - fish and chips have never been the same since after the smell of the pickle line!! Cheers Alastair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now