What signalling, if any is appropriate for this layout in N Gauge?

[Longhaireddavid]

Hi there. Been in US outline for many years. Just starting out with a British outline N Gauge layout based on the LMS, somewhere (not got that far yet).

 

I am wondering what signalling there would be on this branch terminus, if any. I guess it might be run just on a token but I would like to put some signalling in.

 

Here is the layout - 4' 3" x 1'

 

My guess (knowing nothing) is probably an outer home beyond the points and a repeater protecting the level crossing. The two X show where I think that they might be.

 

Please let know how close I am - smile.

Edited January 9, 2018 by Longhaireddavid

[Il Grifone]

A small terminus such as this would probably be run on the 'one engine in steam' principle. However signals always improve a layout, so I'll give my ideas. (The signalling experts will probably shoot me down in flames....).

 

The signal* protecting the crossing is correct, but one is needed for the goods line as well (possibly ringed or a shorter arm?). The advanced starter is OK there but ideally needs to be a bit further down the line. To protect the station, there needs to be a home signal on the other side of the track.roughly where your X is. A signal box is essential if signals are installed, probably next to the level crossing to operate the gates as well. Ground signals could be installed for the sidings, but this is pushing things especially in N gauge. The LMS tended to put signals on the left of the track, but this is not a hard and fast rule. In pre-groupling days the reverse could well have applied.

 

It might be better to swop the creamery and engine shed over. A passenger road leading into a shed was not considered good practice. i'm not saying it never happened of course.

 

* This is a starter not a home, though there is no difference in the signals of course. The advanced starter could be a home and distant on the same post.

Edited January 10, 2018 by Il Grifone

[TheSignalEngineer]

Before I comment on the signalling, a few comments/questions on the layout.

 

1. The engine shed will need a trap point to protect the passenger line. 
2. What is the purpose of the level crossing? 
3. If the level crossing has a use how is it to be operated - signal box, crossing keeper's cabin? 
4. Assuming that the entrance to the goods yard is by the goods office, how does a road vehicle get to access the goods shed?
5. Access to the coal stacks for a lorry seems a bit limited. When I worked in a coal yard about 55 years ago our stacks weren't right by where we unloaded the wagons.

 

 

It is best to have some plan of what you want to run and how traffic will be dealt with to get a logical solution.

[Longhaireddavid]

I haven't put any of the roads in. The top area beyond the level crossing will probably be the town square. There would be access to the goods shed from an entrance off the board to the left. I might add 4" to the end  (easy done with foam core) to make that possible on the model(but I am trying to make this portable and stored upright out of the way!  I assumed that there would be a crossing keeper's hut at the end of the station and a signal box further down the line towards the fiddle yard (or maybe a ground frame only just beyond the last point. 

 

Access might be tight but then I am building on an 4' x 1' board. If I modelled a yard as it was then, I would probably need 12' long and 4' wide. Smile. I remember the size of the coach yards paralleling Abercairn Road in Streatham. They were huge.

[TheSignalEngineer]

The use made of the level crossing would probably determine how the signalling is treated. If it is a well-used road it would be a complete nuisance to both the road and the railway when it came to running round or shunting the yard. A lightly used road may have the gates normally open for the railway and only opened for the road on request. 

 

The LMS were not noted for over-provision of signals especially in lightly trafficed lines. My assumption in this case would be that the crossing gates were worked by hand by a signalman located in a small cabin at the crossing, probably a low-level affair or if operated by a porter signalman the lever frame may even be in the open air like several which used to be on the Bedford-Bletchley line.  The release crossover may be worked from the frame if the distance is short or possibly by a ground frame at the left end of the platform.

[TheSignalEngineer]

A couple of 'ideas' sketches, firstly the minimalist One Engine in Steam version. 

 

 

This could have a Home signal each side of the crossing on the passenger line with all other moves under the control of the shunter or guard.

 

Secondly the Full Fat version.

 

 

This would more likely be used if the was a frequent train service and a lot of use by road traffic.

 

 

[Reorte]

If the road is busy, or at least was already there when the railway was built would the station access more likely to be from that road? I'd guess that the road is reasonably busy if the town centre is just off the top of it (depending upon where else it goes of course).