Eveleigh Creations - Great Eastern 4 & 6-Wheel Coaches

[Edwardian]

There are a number of GER coaches in the 1918 Crimson.  It would be nice to see more in the earlier varnished or painted coach brown.  I think Stephen Middleton has restored some to the earlier livery. 

 

 

 

Edited August 29, 2019 by Edwardian

[Bucoops]

6 wheelers are in the post

[Edwardian]

As Bucoops mentioned, the 6-wheeler kits are now available.  I've received mine, and very splendid they look, too.

 

As a reminder, David's new kits are of the Holden standard types built 1886-1896 to either 32' or 34'6".  John Watling designates these as 'Type 5'.

 

The Type 5 is distinguished by square bottom and top radial corners to the lights and vertical panels. The Type 7A, or 'square light' coaches, have square corners top and bottom to the vertical panels and windows. The Type 5s had an internal height to the crown of the roof of 7' and a door height 5'10".   The Type 5s were built in large numbers over a long period.  Perhaps unsurprisingly, then, a review of photographs tends to throw up pictures of these, with the characteristic radial upper corners rather than the later 'square light' Type 7As.  So far as I am aware, D&S only produced one 'Type 5', the D404 Third, Danny Pinnock's other GER 6-wheel kits represented the Type 7As, built from 1896. 

 

David has produced:

 

D404 Third - 6-compartment third, and by far the most numerous with 642 built.

 

 

D219 Luggage Composite - 32' vehicle with centre luggage compartment. 295 built.

 

D514 Brake Third - 34'6" - 148 built.

 

 

D516 Full Brake - 32".  152 built to D516 and D513.  D513 has the door right at the end, a less attractive variant. 

 

D10 Third Saloon - one of a small number of saloons, the D10 dates from 1887. No more than 7 built.

 

 

D105 First- The model is from a drawing to this number of a five-compartment First. 40 built

 

D110 First (ex-Lavatory Composite). From NRM drawing 10146, described as 32ft. lav. compo, Aug 1890  D110c, it started life as 1st/2nd Lav. Compo of 1890 to D205.  The GR abolished Second on all but its Continental expresses at the start of 1893. Generally 1st/2nd composites were converted to 1st/3rds but, John Watling tells us, exceptionally the D205s were upgraded to all Firsts.  D110 was the new diagram number applied once it became a First.

 

Edited January 10, 2020 by Edwardian

[t-b-g]

At long last I am making some progress on my 4 wheelers and have the main bodies assembled for the first 5.

 

I was trying to find prototype information online and came across a photo of a Brake 3rd being restored but it appears to have a different style of ducket as it is panelled rather than a flush side.

 

Not being a GER expert, I have a question for the assembled panel. Were there two types or was the flush sided one either a later replacement or the original one plated over and if so, when were they altered?

 

I hope somebody can help as I am setting them in 1890 and don't know whether to use the one in the etch or to make a new panelled ducket overlay.

 

Edit to add: I will send an email to David Eveleigh as well, to see if he knows.

Edited June 2, 2020 by t-b-g
To add content

[Edwardian]

1 hour ago, t-b-g said:

At long last I am making some progress on my 4 wheelers and have the main bodies assembled for the first 5.

 

I was trying to find prototype information online and came across a photo of a Brake 3rd being restored but it appears to have a different style of ducket as it is panelled rather than a flush side.

 

Not being a GER expert, I have a question for the assembled panel. Were there two types or was the flush sided one either a later replacement or the original one plated over and if so, when were they altered?

 

I hope somebody can help as I am setting them in 1890 and don't know whether to use the one in the etch or to make a new panelled ducket overlay.

 

Edit to add: I will send an email to David Eveleigh as well, to see if he knows.

 

Sheet metal, not wood-paneled, as with the original Stroudley duckets on the Brighton

 

 

[t-b-g]

32 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

 

Sheet metal, not wood-paneled, as with the original Stroudley duckets on the Brighton

 

 

 

Excellent. Many thanks. There are a couple of preserved 4 wheel brake 3rds, one the type portrayed in the kit which has no panelling at all and the other has metal plating on the top half (the actual ducket) and wooden panelling on the bottom half. That is a slightly different style of body, I would think later than the etches.

 

Relying on preserved vehicles for details is not my favourite method as when you really dig down deep, many subtle and some not so subtle alterations have been made. So I thought it worth checking.

 

I appreciate the speedy response and that means, tomorrow, the ducket sides can go on.

 

Tony

 

 

[Edwardian]

Here you are, one of the clearer pictures I've found.

 

 

But see also the 1867 GER coaches on the RVR/K&ESR

 

 

And the 1875 brake third converted to a luggage brake for the W&U

 

[t-b-g]

Thanks for posting those. I am not sure the preserved one is 100% accurate. There does seem to be a visible line roughly in line with the bottom edge of the waist panelling. The etches have a change from half etch to full etch there, which would fit with the old photos but not the preserved vehicle.

[Compound2632]

A slightly off-topic question: I've recently come across photos of a number of grounded bodies of GE carriages, at least two of which are centre-luggage composites. A distinctive feature of these is that they have ventilators over the quarter-lights as well as over the door droplights. Where does this style fit in the design sequence?

[t-b-g]

49 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

A slightly off-topic question: I've recently come across photos of a number of grounded bodies of GE carriages, at least two of which are centre-luggage composites. A distinctive feature of these is that they have ventilators over the quarter-lights as well as over the door droplights. Where does this style fit in the design sequence?

 

I wonder if these were smoking compartments? A photo of part of a carriage on page 1 of the thread seems to show what you mention. I can add no more than that but perhaps others can.

 

I had a long chat with David Eveleigh this evening and the test etches for the underframes are with the etchers now, so it won't be too long before they are available. I think the photo I took to be a panelled ducket is actually the carriage shown above during restoration with the metal sheeting removed. The framing behind the metal sheet looks a bit like panelling. So that has cleared that confusion up in my mind. At least I know why I was misled!

 

I can crack on tomorrow knowing that I can go for a metal sheeted ducket and that I don't need to start making or finding underframe bits!

 

Thanks everybody who has helped.

 

Tony

 

 

[Bucoops]

Oh, is David doing underframes for the 4 wheelers? Must have missed that - have bought some W irons but would prefer a whole underframe.

[Compound2632]

9 hours ago, t-b-g said:

 

I wonder if these were smoking compartments? A photo of part of a carriage on page 1 of the thread seems to show what you mention. I can add no more than that but perhaps others can.

 

I doubt smoking compartments since the ventilators are over all the quarter-lights - unless the whole carriage was designated smoking?

 

On 20/02/2018 at 13:46, Edwardian said:

Here is an interesting picture of the sort of body style that these 4-wheelers would have, beautifully preserved as part of someone's sitting room in a house made from two coaches placed side by side, a not uncommon fate for such coaches.

 

Just like that but very much more decrepit.

 

On 21/02/2018 at 08:57, Bucoops said:

Shenfield area (probably) of the Liverpool St line

 

On 21/02/2018 at 09:39, Edwardian said:

 

You'll just need then as grounded coach bodies then!

 

Exactly the location of the carriage body of which I was sent a photo for identification! It is well hidden in the undergrowth but is just like this one at Bressingham the identity of which is known. That Bressingham one, unusually, is sitting on an underframe - the solebars appear to be iron or steel?

[t-b-g]

3 hours ago, Bucoops said:

Oh, is David doing underframes for the 4 wheelers? Must have missed that - have bought some W irons but would prefer a whole underframe.

 

Yes he is, including W irons, steps and brakes. I only found out last night. I mentioned in our chat that I didn't fancy using the Ratio underframe so I had put in a brass floor and ordered Guy Rixon parts but just needed to sort out steps and W irons and he said if I could wait a while he could help me out.

[t-b-g]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I doubt smoking compartments since the ventilators are over all the quarter-lights - unless the whole carriage was designated smoking?

 

 

Just like that but very much more decrepit.

 

 

 

Exactly the location of the carriage body of which I was sent a photo for identification! It is well hidden in the undergrowth but is just like this one at Bressingham the identity of which is known. That Bressingham one, unusually, is sitting on an underframe - the solebars appear to be iron or steel?

 

I would agree. Not likely to be smoking compartments! The one I found while trawling photos just had vents above the window on one compartment, which caused me to guess that was what it might be for but if they are above all the windows on some, it looks more like a change of design.

[t-b-g]

Just to prove that every once in a while I do actually make something, here are a couple of snaps showing progress so far, including the duckets on a Brake 3rd. I have 6 to make, so there is another Brake 3rd to start.

 

The 6th carriage at the RH side in the photo is the first of a rake of 10 District Railway 4 wheelers from some Worsley Works etches.

 

 

 

I know the etched roof vents are too flat but these have to run with some D & S carriages made many years ago with flat etched door vents and it was felt that it was more important to get a good match with those.

[Compound2632]

Talk about mass-production! But I thought you are in the throes of building a Midland / Great Central terminus in South Yorkshire?

[t-b-g]

16 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

Talk about mass-production! But I thought you are in the throes of building a Midland / Great Central terminus in South Yorkshire?

 

I am but I also earn a crust building models for other people and these are destined for a very nice East End of London layout set in the 1890s.

 

Rakes of carriages is about my least favourite task as I tend to find repetitive work not as enjoyable as "one offs" like a loco, a signal or a building.

 

Well off topic now but these were done for it too. 

 

 

[Compound2632]

1 minute ago, t-b-g said:

Rakes of carriages is about my least favourite task as I tend to find repetitive work not as enjoyable as "one offs" like a loco, a signal or a building

 

 

All the same, nice work if you can get it!

[PaulG]

I've just finished the last of three of David's GER carriage bodies for my Colchester c1955 4mm/OO layout.

 

The loco mess facilities consisted of four carriage bodies, three GER, two four wheelers and the one I've just completed a six wheeler.

 

The fourth carriage body is a Ratio LNWR, which was last used on the M&GN.

[Bucoops]

15 minutes ago, PaulG said:

I've just finished the last of three of David's GER carriage bodies for my Colchester c1955 4mm/OO layout.

 

The loco mess facilities consisted of four carriage bodies, three GER, two four wheelers and the one I've just completed a six wheeler.

 

The fourth carriage body is a Ratio LNWR, which was last used on the M&GN.

 

 

Looks fantastic As it happens i put in another order with David today for a couple more 6 wheelers and underframes for the 4 wheelers.

 

Still have no idea what I'm going to do with them, mind!

[Edwardian]

Superb grounded coaches!

 

Bucoops, I've been thinking of doubling up on the 6-wheelers if David has some in

[Bucoops]

24 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

Superb grounded coaches!

 

Bucoops, I've been thinking of doubling up on the 6-wheelers if David has some in

 

The only one not in stock is the D404 but he has some on order apparently. Not sure how caught up etchers are at the moment but he estimated about 4-6 weeks a couple of weeks ago.

[Paulrhodes]

Does anybody know if there are GER coach lettering transfers available in 4mm?

[Edwardian]

22 minutes ago, Paulrhodes said:

Does anybody know if there are GER coach lettering transfers available in 4mm?

 

Well, actually, I'm in the process of commissioning some - both pre and post 1903 lettering - so no doubt something could be arranged.  I'll let people know once they're done.

[Paulrhodes]

That's excellent - I'll keep looking out for these.