GWR South Wales paddy coach colour

[mozzer models]

I am planing a small Layout set in the south Wales valleys

From what i have found is that the coaches used were painted in Just GWR brown (from black & white photos found on line)

Now can any one tell me if i am Right or Wrong 

 

Thanks in advance 

[bike2steam]

I'm doing similar, but my layout is based on the Cannock area of the Midlands. I believe the 'Paddy' coaches were left in the original livery as brought in, not painted just allowed to fade, weather and blister - unless someone knows differently ?? 

[br2975]

Initially the GWR coaches were plain brown, but some were painted BR crimson. There was an excellent illustrated article on the South Wales workman's trains in BR days by Ian L.Wright in an old edition of Modeller's Backtrack. I have a copy somewhere.

[The Johnster]

By a paddy train I assume you mean a workman's train running on the GW or BR, subject to the same rules and regulations as any other passenger train, and not the paddy trains that ran on NCB systems, which were another beast altogether.  The last of the GW 4 wheelers and the non-gangwayed clerestory stock ended their lives on such services in South Wales.  Livery was plain brown for any vehicle repainted after 1942 until 31st December 1948 and probably for a few months after that, then BR crimson was used.  It is possible that some vehicles remained in choc/cream until withdrawal, and certain that most brown examples were withdrawn in that livery. 

 

The brown livery was not unique to workman's stock, in fact all passenger stock was painted in it between 1942 and 1946, choc and cream being reintroduced at that time.  Some non gangwayed stock and auto trailers were painted in plain brown, not including the red stripe at waist level that most stock had, probably those painted at Caerphilly Works.  

 

I model a miner's workman's on Cwmdimbath, as the real services from Cwmmer Corrwg were only 2 valleys over.  My miner's is a Rule 1 fiction homage to Glyncorrwg, though, with a Triang clerestory in choc/cream that I am considering converting to plain brown livery, and 2 Ratio 4 wheelers in crimson.

 

The point of these trains was that the upholstery was stripped from the seats in order to enable them to be cleaned; in the days before pithead baths coal miners bathed at home after work and travelled in a filthy state.  'Clean' compartments were reserved for office and surface workers.  The advent of pithead bathing brought about by the NCB enabled miners to wear decent clothes once they'd left the pit, and use ordinary passenger trains, but in some cases these did not run early enough for the morning shift and the workmens' were retained.  Photos show that the stock rapidly got too filthy for liveries to be accurately discerned!

[mozzer models]

On 02/07/2018 at 21:04, The Johnster said:

By a paddy train I assume you mean a workman's train running on the GW or BR, subject to the same rules and regulations as any other passenger train, and not the paddy trains that ran on NCB systems, which were another beast altogether.  The last of the GW 4 wheelers and the non-gangwayed clerestory stock ended their lives on such services in South Wales.  Livery was plain brown for any vehicle repainted after 1942 until 31st December 1948 and probably for a few months after that, then BR crimson was used.  It is possible that some vehicles remained in choc/cream until withdrawal, and certain that most brown examples were withdrawn in that livery. 

 

The brown livery was not unique to workman's stock, in fact all passenger stock was painted in it between 1942 and 1946, choc and cream being reintroduced at that time.  Some non gangwayed stock and auto trailers were painted in plain brown, not including the red stripe at waist level that most stock had, probably those painted at Caerphilly Works.  

 

I model a miner's workman's on Cwmdimbath, as the real services from Cwmmer Corrwg were only 2 valleys over.  My miner's is a Rule 1 fiction homage to Glyncorrwg, though, with a Triang clerestory in choc/cream that I am considering converting to plain brown livery, and 2 Ratio 4 wheelers in crimson.

 

The point of these trains was that the upholstery was stripped from the seats in order to enable them to be cleaned; in the days before pithead baths coal miners bathed at home after work and travelled in a filthy state.  'Clean' compartments were reserved for office and surface workers.  The advent of pithead bathing brought about by the NCB enabled miners to wear decent clothes once they'd left the pit, and use ordinary passenger trains, but in some cases these did not run early enough for the morning shift and the workmens' were retained.  Photos show that the stock rapidly got too filthy for liveries to be accurately discerned!

Yes a work train working on a ex N&B GWR branch line 

I have one of the short Hornby Clerestory LNER Brake Comp i will repaint it GWR Brown & weather it to Hell

Edited September 11, 2019 by mozzer models

[The Johnster]

The clerestory will do the job very well, Mozzer.  Mine was in GW choc/cream livery (still is): I have provided ratio seating and compartment dividers, and modified the BR mk1 bogies to look a bit more like Deans; the tiebars have been removed and footboards, real wood made from Sainsbury's cafe coffee stirrers cut in half lengthways, added, which gives a much more convincing impression.  They are simply superglued on.  Photos on Cwmdimbath topic 'South Wales in the 1950s' in Layout Topics.  I replaced the wheels as well, with Bachmanns, and, like you, went for some fairly full on weathering in contrast to the crimson 4 wheelers which are still fairly clean being recently outshopped!  I have retained the coach number, 2316, which is not a known South Wales workman's vehicle but sometimes you have to use Rule 1.  

[NHY 581]

There is a splendid John Wiltshire image of a paddy coach some where in South Wales. I shall post it later due to a slight techie issue at present.......

 

 

 

Rob

[NHY 581]

Found it..

[chrisf]

That coach is not as old as it looks.   If I'm right, it is an ex-GW C77 non-corridor third dating from circa 1937 and was certainly not built with the extra footboards.  Fascinating!

 

Chris

[mozzer models]

The clerestory will do the job very well, Mozzer.  Mine was in GW choc/cream livery (still is): I have provided ratio seating and compartment dividers, and modified the BR mk1 bogies to look a bit more like Deans; the tiebars have been removed and footboards, real wood made from Sainsbury's cafe coffee stirrers cut in half lengthways, added, which gives a much more convincing impression.  They are simply superglued on.  Photos on Cwmdimbath topic 'South Wales in the 1950s' in Layout Topics.  I replaced the wheels as well, with Bachmanns, and, like you, went for some fairly full on weathering in contrast to the crimson 4 wheelers which are still fairly clean being recently outshopped!  I have retained the coach number, 2316, which is not a known South Wales workman's vehicle but sometimes you have to use Rule 1.  

As i own 247 Developments i have stocks of Dean 6'4'', 8'6'' & 10' bogies so will fit some of those 

[The Johnster]

I have a set of your 8'6" Dean bogies, Mozzer, picked up at Thornbury in May, also the origin of the coach, and will one day get around to fitting them.  The ersatz Triang bogies are fine for now!

[mozzer models]

Thanks 

I have started a topic for the layout here

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/135408-blaendulais/

[Darwinian]

Just to resuscitate this topic. For a late 1920s to early 30s miners train on gwr.org there is a piece saying that the ratio 4 wheeler types were in use. However there is no comment on likely liveries. Would a very worn GWR lake livery be a possibility? If so I might just have to have a go at that for Cwmhir.

[Miss Prism]

all-over unlined brown

 

[Darwinian]

3 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

all-over unlined brown

 

Thanks Miss P.

Not quite so appealing but I’ll keep it in consideration. Need to build some clerestory non-corridor stock for the regular services first.

[mozzer models]

Thanks for all your help 

heres what i went with

The coach's for paddy train are finished by brian mosby, on Flickr