"Hawkesbury" - the engine shed area is no more.....

[Chimer]

Usual technique - get longest vehicle (usually a coach).  For platform edges inside the track, hold pencil against centre of coach side, pull round to mark line on baseboard.  For edges outside the track, pencil against end of coach side.  Trace and transfer to whatever - probably some sort of card for the surface, even if you're going to stick it on something solid …...

 

For my little trial layout, now dismantled, I used the Metcalf platform kit.  This gives an acceptable height and copes with curves reasonably easily.  Alternatively, Peco do a platform edging strip ….

 

Cheers, Chris

[Harlequin]

Platform surface should be 12mm above rail surface level (i.e. a scale 3ft).

 

[FoxUnpopuli]

Thanks to 'Professional Layout Services' website for the photo, and while they appear to have used a Class 40, the general advice as @Chimer says is to use your longest carriage.

 

 

Now if you want to get absolutely precise, you should split the pencil in half, but then you have to decide your own clearance.

 

But first, lay sheets of paper on the board, run a pencil (or your dirty thumb) along the edge of your cork to get you your starting template, cut it out and re-lay this onto the flat board.  Then you can run your pencilcoach across the top of this.  Voila - one template ready to be trimmed.  Trim it out, and then make a second copy of this template and retain the master.  Depending on what you use for your platform edging you'll need to offset back from this edge to cut whatever it is you are using for:

 

A) your platform substrate, and

B) your platform top.

 

For the PECO stuff, as you can see below, the edging is not quite 'flat' on the inside at the top so A & B are not the same, also you need to relieve the substrate for where the connecting tabs overlap, and also at the bottom of the platform edge.  I don't know how flexible this stuff is, can users comment?

 

 

Whichever: use the template copy for cutting, pasting it to whatever you need to cut and offsetting the right amount, and then if you need another one, just copy the original again.

 

 

Also:

 

 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2020 by FoxUnpopuli
Correcting the worms for grandadical accumulacy... and adding the link to a good platform thread.

[halsey]

2 hours ago, Chimer said:

Usual technique - get longest vehicle (usually a coach).  For platform edges inside the track, hold pencil against centre of coach side, pull round to mark line on baseboard.  For edges outside the track, pencil against end of coach side.  Trace and transfer to whatever - probably some sort of card for the surface, even if you're going to stick it on something solid …...

 

For my little trial layout, now dismantled, I used the Metcalf platform kit.  This gives an acceptable height and copes with curves reasonably easily.  Alternatively, Peco do a platform edging strip ….

 

Cheers, Chris

 

Thanks for this - oh and for giving me such long curved platforms!!!

 

Cheers J

[royaloak]

1 hour ago, FoxUnpopuli said:

Thanks to 'Professional Layout Services' website for the photo, and while they appear to have used a Class 40, the general advice as @Chimer says is to use your longest carriage.

 

For the inside clearance you want to use the vehicle with the longest wheelbase, for the outside you want to use the vehicle with the longest overhang.

[FoxUnpopuli]

12 minutes ago, royaloak said:

For the inside clearance you want to use the vehicle with the longest wheelbase, for the outside you want to use the vehicle with the longest overhang.

 

Ah, the new Hornby Thompson A2s will be good for something then... 

[halsey]

14 hours ago, FoxUnpopuli said:

Thanks to 'Professional Layout Services' website for the photo, and while they appear to have used a Class 40, the general advice as @Chimer says is to use your longest carriage.

 

 

Now if you want to get absolutely precise, you should split the pencil in half, but then you have to decide your own clearance.

 

But first, lay sheets of paper on the board, run a pencil (or your dirty thumb) along the edge of your cork to get you your starting template, cut it out and re-lay this onto the flat board.  Then you can run your pencilcoach across the top of this.  Voila - one template ready to be trimmed.  Trim it out, and then make a second copy of this template and retain the master.  Depending on what you use for your platform edging you'll need to offset back from this edge to cut whatever it is you are using for:

 

A) your platform substrate, and

B) your platform top.

 

For the PECO stuff, as you can see below, the edging is not quite 'flat' on the inside at the top so A & B are not the same, also you need to relieve the substrate for where the connecting tabs overlap, and also at the bottom of the platform edge.  I don't know how flexible this stuff is, can users comment?

 

 

Whichever: use the template copy for cutting, pasting it to whatever you need to cut and offsetting the right amount, and then if you need another one, just copy the original again.

 

 

Also:

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the link - I think I've been thinking too lightweight and trying to be too tidy (for no good reason as the layout is permanent) - I quite like the stripwood and battens mdf tops idea as smooth curves can be replicated things can be sanded to suit and I need to cut my cork ballast back to the sleepers just in these platform areas.

 

Back to the drawing board...………...

[ejstubbs]

19 hours ago, FoxUnpopuli said:

I don't know how flexible this stuff is, can users comment?

 

I'll try to remember to post a photo of my redundant curved section of platform/ramp that I built using the Peco platform sidewalls.    IIRC it fitted inside third radius curves.

 

I actually used the "stone" version, which has a completely flat finish and comes with "stone effect" scenic paper that you are supposed to glue on.  I ditched the paper and planned to use some lightweight moulded stone effect plasticard, but never got around to it before changing the track plan - which was what made the curved section redundant.

 

Edit: I appear to have chucked it out   In the absence of photos it's probably worth mentioning that I cut the platform surface from Wills stone paving sheets (having used the technique described by FoxUnpopuli above to determine the shape of the curve), and the platform faces were glued to that using styrene cement - so the curve on the faces was maintained by the curved edge of the cut sheet.

Edited February 4, 2020 by ejstubbs

[halsey]

Better already...………..

 

Please don't be too harsh - this is only the start but it already feels right and massively better than my first attempt.

 

The (15mm) strip wood platform side ensures great smooth curves and I'm happy to paint and "weather" it - I've bought 3mm ply for the top but now I'm not sure about its ability to be shaped (it can go back). I would like other suggestions - I bought ply as I can't seem to find 3mm MDF locally (yet) 

 

 

 

[DCB]

Looks good

Don't forget the Absolute Maximum platform height for passenger platforms is 3ft  That is the top surface. That is lower than the buffer centre lines by almost 2mm.  The step up from the platform to coach is quite a step as anyone with a long memory or deep enough pockets to afford present day train travel can attest!   Dock platforms not for passengers can be much higher to line up with wagon doors for easy loading.

What I'm saying is leave plenty of height for the platform top, glue lines, sandpaper etc to keep down to 12mm above track level or you will end up with a cock up like I did.

Other threads here show clearance issues.  Full size trains are 9ft wide (BR MK1 is 9Ft 2" )  which is 36.66666666666mm in OO  but some Hornby is 40mm.   Many GWR locos are at their widest at 3ft above rail, exactly platform height, Pre Nationalisation coaches have outside truss rods which are much wider that the MK1 etc in the 18" to 2ft above rail level and which snag on the inside of curved platform ends.  Those nice curved platform edges need to be very firmly anchored to the baseboard or framing as they will do their level best to straighten out.  

 

[halsey]

18 hours ago, DavidCBroad said:

Looks good

Don't forget the Absolute Maximum platform height for passenger platforms is 3ft  That is the top surface. That is lower than the buffer centre lines by almost 2mm.  The step up from the platform to coach is quite a step as anyone with a long memory or deep enough pockets to afford present day train travel can attest!   Dock platforms not for passengers can be much higher to line up with wagon doors for easy loading.

What I'm saying is leave plenty of height for the platform top, glue lines, sandpaper etc to keep down to 12mm above track level or you will end up with a cock up like I did.

Other threads here show clearance issues.  Full size trains are 9ft wide (BR MK1 is 9Ft 2" )  which is 36.66666666666mm in OO  but some Hornby is 40mm.   Many GWR locos are at their widest at 3ft above rail, exactly platform height, Pre Nationalisation coaches have outside truss rods which are much wider that the MK1 etc in the 18" to 2ft above rail level and which snag on the inside of curved platform ends.  Those nice curved platform edges need to be very firmly anchored to the baseboard or framing as they will do their level best to straighten out.  

 

 

Hi David,

 

Thanks for the detail.

 

My rail "base" i.e. base- board to rail top is 7mm and I've just managed to get some 3mm MDF (took the ply back) so I will end up with 18mm from baseboard or 11mm from rail tops (plus glue) as all surfaces will be painted - so that should be OK

 

The edge blocks are screwed into the ply base the edge is glued and pinned to the blocks and I will use the same strip wood to create a series of cross members to not only hold it all together but to provide support for the MDF top

 

Cheers

Edited February 6, 2020 by halsey
more info given

[FoxUnpopuli]

4 hours ago, halsey said:

Better already...………..

 

Looks pretty bloody good to me.  Test, test, test, make sure your coaches aren't fouling. 

[RLBH]

On 03/02/2020 at 18:43, royaloak said:

For the inside clearance you want to use the vehicle with the longest wheelbase, for the outside you want to use the vehicle with the longest overhang.

Being really pedantic, you want the longest fixed wheelbase - for bogie vehicles, it's the distance between bogie centres that counts.

 

23 hours ago, halsey said:

Dock platforms not for passengers can be much higher to line up with wagon doors for easy loading.

Of course, on the modern railway there's a movement to either lower train floors to 915mm, or raise the platforms to line up with the doors, to facilitate level boarding of wheelchairs, prams and so forth. I've never quite understood why that wasn't thought to be a good idea when the railways were first built.

[Zomboid]

5 minutes ago, RLBH said:

Of course, on the modern railway there's a movement to either lower train floors to 915mm, or raise the platforms to line up with the doors, to facilitate level boarding of wheelchairs, prams and so forth. I've never quite understood why that wasn't thought to be a good idea when the railways were first built

I suppose people were accustomed to stepping/ jumping up and down onto horses and stagecoaches. Though it still doesn't make much sense to do half a job - no platforms like in much of the rest of the world, or full height as they do now would both seem better than a half height platform.

[Tallpaul69]

On ‎05‎/‎02‎/‎2020 at 14:49, halsey said:

 

Hi David,

 

Thanks for the detail.

 

My rail "base" i.e. base- board to rail top is 7mm and I've just managed to get some 3mm MDF (took the ply back) so I will end up with 18mm from baseboard or 11mm from rail tops (plus glue) as all surfaces will be painted - so that should be OK

 

The edge blocks are screwed into the ply base the edge is glued and pinned to the blocks and I will use the same strip wood to create a series of cross members to not only hold it all together but to provide support for the MDF top

 

Cheers

All this trouble about platform heights makes me doubly glad that, for other reasons, I decided not to model station platforms!

 

Cheers

Paul

[halsey]

14 hours ago, Tallpaul69 said:

All this trouble about platform heights makes me doubly glad that, for other reasons, I decided not to model station platforms!

 

Cheers

Paul

 

A model railway without a platform in sight - docks? coal yard?

[Tallpaul69]

3 hours ago, halsey said:

 

A model railway without a platform in sight - docks? coal yard?

I will have station buildings visible from the road side as a scenic break, but the (non existant in my model), platforms will be hidden by them out of sight!

There will be a goods shed and associated loading bank, but as others have said in their postings, height for them is easier-just need to be able to load/unload the vans and wagons.

 

Cheers

Paul

[halsey]

Whilst the platforms are under construction/drying I have made a start on the other messy job - the "retaining" structure for the hidden tracks and I've mocked up the wall/arches effect from bits lying around - I have bought the last of Jerry Freestones kits to do this afresh when ready.

 

I'm not sure if this "tunnel" is going to remain open topped or not but the wall is important to the loco sidings/stabling and to the illusion of the main lines having gentle radius curves (Chris )

 

An interesting benefit of using the 12mm XPS foam was that I was able to cut a 3mm channel into it to retain the bottom of the 3mm MDF and more importantly the curve the channel for which I cut out using an old 2nd radius curve as a template/guide.

 

BTW - none of the brace/supports are permanent

 

Edited February 7, 2020 by halsey

[halsey]

IMHO good progress on platforms - ramps are solid balsa from my late Dads stock which I found when clearing their bungalow after Mums passing last year so it feels good to be able to use it here - baseboards/track all cleaned up and platforms sanded ready for small amount of filling pin heads and painting the edges before the tops are cut and applied.

 

Really pleased I abandoned my first try - thanks for the guidance chaps...………………..

 

Cheers

[halsey]

Hi,

 

I'm looking for inspiration/ideas...……………………………….

 

I am trying to work out whether to model this area as a tunnel or just leave this is as a wall with open easy access to the countryside tracks below - obvious requirement is that any "lid" must be very easily removeable which precludes elaborate modelling but what ideas do you guys have for this "blank canvass" - my thoughts so far are simple rough scrubland with perhaps an abandoned cars/spoil/wasteland theme?

 

FYI - its 4ft long and the majority is 8inches wide and not quite as important to the layout overall as the photo makes you think

 

The retaining arches are a "given" for the mdf wall as they are a great backdrop for the yard (and the kits have been purchased!)

 

Cheers 

 

 

Edited February 10, 2020 by halsey

[Zomboid]

To justify a retaining wall, something would need to be on top of it. It could be something that's no longer there, but it wouldn't be fields or anything else rural in nature - they'd just have built a cutting/ embankment for that.

[Tallpaul69]

5 hours ago, halsey said:

Hi,

 

I'm looking for inspiration/ideas...……………………………….

 

I am trying to work out whether to model this area as a tunnel or just leave this is as a wall with open easy access to the countryside tracks below - obvious requirement is that any "lid" must be very easily removeable which precludes elaborate modelling but what ideas do you guys have for this "blank canvass" - my thoughts so far are simple rough scrubland with perhaps an abandoned cars/spoil/wasteland theme?

 

FYI - its 4ft long and the majority is 8inches wide and not quite as important to the layout overall as the photo makes you think

 

The retaining arches are a "given" for the mdf wall as they are a great backdrop for the yard (and the kits have been purchased!)

 

Cheers 

 

 

Hi Halsey,

As it stands this area has no means of access to integrate it into the rest of the layout. The retaining wall suggests a building or building(s), but the question is how to make it (or them) strong enough and well enough fixed to the raised area roof to withstand movement for access.

Thoughts:-

Is there room to make some sort of access to the raised area? this could be just a footbridge or pedestrian slope.

 

I think I would favour a factory. Being one unit, this will be easier to fix strongly to the lid of the raised area. The story is that the access road is to the rear of the site behind the building. Things like piles of raw materials, fork trucks etc. can be glued to the lid.

 

I will think about/ develop this further if that would help?

 

Hopefully there will be other ideas?

 

Come on guys, help the man out?

 

Cheers

Paul  

 

[Chimer]

I've been thinking about this since you posted the pic of the DMU disappearing behind the wall a couple of posts ago …… It's not easy, but I think I would do a retaining wall, but only half the height of the current one, with a road behind it (not a properly modelled road, just a strip of wood high enough to clear the parked freight in the hidden siding),  with a couple of double-decker buses that you can see the top of, in front of the backscene, when you look across from the operating position).  I'd curve the wall and the road round behind the goods yard headshunt, then turn it back left across the main lines on a bridge around where the toe of the first point is, with the town at that level, and perhaps the entrance to the station on the bridge.  The idea is to pretend the main line beyond the bridge keeps going more or less straight.  I can't see how to do it if you leave 45 degrees of turn visible.

 

I didn't think photographing a dreadful sketch would come out as well as it has (as I look at it before trying to post) - hopefully it is worth a thousand words.  And now you know why I like to use CAD and powerpoint for my illustrations ...

 

Edited February 10, 2020 by Chimer

[Chimer]

Oh, and it would be a good idea to make whatever scenery you do end up with down that left hand side removable - my suggestion lets you see what's going on behind the wall, but a derailment on the freight siding would be hard to fix …..

[halsey]

Lots to think about here - PLEASE keep your thoughts coming - "Chimer" I really don't want to cover up quite as much track as you suggest - I like my arches as they work very well with the loco shed area and the current removeable "roof" will terminate in a Metcalfe double tunnel extending a little more than the wall which I think will be enough AND I do want to have enough space to develop a village in the LH top corner.

Possibly the derelict factory "TP69" but I think the access would have to be imagined as I can't see how to make it real but I have a few days away from trains so might come back fresh and see a way to do it??

Cheers