Alex's Workbench - Southern Region & Other Projects

[A.R.]

Evening All, 

 

Thanks Bryan @gz3xzf; it's interesting you make that point about the steam pipes because I thought the same but upon looking at some photos of the Lord Nelson pre-smoke deflectors, the steam pipe is set back further, and aligns with the rear of the cyclinders. I am not quite sure why, so I have settled with somewhere inbetween! With regards to cylinders, I think most likely 4 as I envisage this being a rebuild of the Lord Nelsons perhaps? What are your thoughts? 

 

This evening, I have been turning some clack valves from some spare brass. I have done this in my dremel with a fine file and some sandpaper.  As you can see, the parts are very small and using a dremel isn't ideal but it should do the trick! It will likely be painted anyway! 

 

Here is the spare piece of brass casting I started with: 

These are the first bits of the clack valves coming together: 

First one turned off the main section:

Two finished clack valves: 

Two valves with boiler attachments finished: 

 

I also finished sanding back the smokebox saddle and second steam pipe and this is now complete. Next up is sanding back the firebox sides where I had to remove the wheel arches and add packing material in. Over the weekend, I will be starting to add details to the loco body shell such as handrails, copper pipes, clack valves and some other details I have noticed from the painting. 

 

On another note, I have recieved some drawings for the T14 loco project in a 1970's edition of Railway Modeller. I will be considering how to proceed with this over the next few days. 

 

I look forward to hearing your thoughts. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

[BusDriverMan]

To kind of repeat my earlier replies - I didn't realise it was feasible to make turned brass parts using a dremel (which I own) and a small file (which I have) on a kitchen table (which… I don't have, my flat is too small, but I have a desk).

 

I got back into this hobby when I discovered DCC didn't need to be prohibitively expensive thanks to Arduino base stations running DCC++. Now I want to be scratchbuilding/kitbashing/modifying unique what-if vehicles too!

[gz3xzf]

2 hours ago, A.R. said:

Evening All, 

 

Thanks Bryan @gz3xzf; it's interesting you make that point about the steam pipes because I thought the same but upon looking at some photos of the Lord Nelson pre-smoke deflectors, the steam pipe is set back further, and aligns with the rear of the cyclinders. I am not quite sure why, so I have settled with somewhere inbetween! With regards to cylinders, I think most likely 4 as I envisage this being a rebuild of the Lord Nelsons perhaps? What are your thoughts? 

 

 

Well there's a thing, not noticed that, but I have to admit that I have never studied the Nelson's closely. I am interested in getting some drawings (or visit Ropley) to find how the loco goes together. Looking at photos on Google the Schools seems to have the steam pipe in around the same relation to the cylinders; more investigation required.

 

As far as number of cylinders, this would be dependant on what the traffic requirement was, the Nelson's (as far as Russelll is concerned) were built to haul the heavy boat trains, the imagined 4-8-0 could be for similar traffic or maybe express freight, therefore possibly requiring a 4 cylinder design.

An interesting aside is that the Nelson's had the cranks set at 135 degrees, thus meaning the locomotive has 8 beats at the chimney per wheel revolution (rather than the 4 of locos like the GWR Stars/Castles/Kings or Stanier's pacifics where the cranks are at 90 degrees), this was done to reduce the hammer blow on the track.

 

Keep up the good work.

[A.R.]

Morning,

 

@BusDriverMan Thanks for your kind comments, the turned brass bits are by no means perfect, there are limitations, but for small details, especially those that will be painted, they work well! I will be fitting the clack valves tonight so will see how they look! I don't think shiny brass looks right in 4mm so will probably paint them brass coloured. I will be also looking at making some vacuum pipes...

 

Hi Bryan @gz3xzf, thanks for your comment. I thought it was unusual as to why the steam pipe is far back so any info you find out please do pass it on as I would be interested to know! 

I bet the Lord Nelson sounds impressive with 8 beats per revolution!

 

I should be able to update with some more progress this evening. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

[Geoff_E]

On the subject of cylinders and steam pipes, I've had another look at the drawing in the Haresnape book I referenced earlier and compared it to the one for the Nelson. It  is essentially a 4-8-0 Nelson, with 4 cylinders of the same size and the outside steam pipes towards the back of the smokebox and outside cylinders. The outside cylinders are also slightly angled as shown in the painting. This is the arrangement for the original cylinders. I do not know what the arrangement for the Bulleid cylinders is , and it would be a matter of speculation as to whether the 4-8-0 would have received Bulleid cylinders. However, it is 3 inches longer overall than a Nelson and the boiler pressure stated is 200 psi rather than the 220 psi for the Nelson. Although the drawings are small, not to the same scale. and not fully dimensioned, I would hazard a guess that the smokebox on the 4-8-0 is a bit longer, the extra length being between the chimney and tubeplate. This could be to keep the cab, blastpipe, etc. in the same relative positions because of a longer chassis. 

 

According to the text, the 4-8-0 was a 1935 proposal for a standard heavy goods, although the notes for the drawing say it was for Kent coal traffic. However, the length of sidings and running loops on the main lines limited the length of trains to loads that could be handled by the S15, and so the idea was dropped. 

 

Best Regards 

 

Geoff

[gz3xzf]

2 hours ago, A.R. said:

I bet the Lord Nelson sounds impressive with 8 beats per revolution!

 

Alex

Found this interesting video on YouTube comparing Lord Nelson with King Edward II. The King makes much more noise as each exhaust beat is two cylinders rather than the one for the Nelson.

 

[A.R.]

Evening All, 

 

Thanks @Geoff_E for the useful info, I kind of wish I could lengthen the body as you say but I am a bit too far in with the build now! Hopefully it won't be noticeable! It makes sense why they didn't build it, no point being able to pull trains that then clog up the whole network with them not being able to fit sidings!

 

Interesting and useful video Bryan @gz3xzf, thanks for that. 

 

This evening I have been working on adding the rivets back onto the smokebox with some success! I had the idea of using small blobs of filler and it seems to work. I agree its not perfect, but it does the job, and is much cheaper than using the Archer's alternatives! 

 

Here I have drawn the rough lines of the rivets as a guide: 

Blobbed on filler: 

Sprayed and I think they look okay:

The rivets look a tad sharp but I can give a very light sand and with a few more layers of paint this sharpeness should be reduced! 

 

I look forward to hearing your thoughts. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

[Michael Edge]

I use an epoxy for this - Plastic Padding Super Steel (it may have changed its name by now though). This has the property of shrinking to a perfect hemisphere as it cures so all you need to do is apply the same amount each time to get a row of rivets.

[LNWR18901910]

On 17/01/2021 at 19:14, Corbs said:

Hello Alex, I came here after seeing your post in Tony's thread.

I have to say your 2-8-2 is absolutely stunning. I've loved this design ever since seeing Ian's one and yours is beautiful.

I'm a big fan of the Maunsell 4-8-0 too, did a little photoshop of it after I saw Matthew's marvellous painting (although in hindsight I should have removed the arches entirely, ah well!).

 

Will be looking forward to seeing more of your progress.

DAY-UM! What a beast of a locomotive! Good luck with the engine in model-form! Also, what if Maunsell designed a 2-8-0 heavy freight locomotive?

[A.R.]

Evening All, 

 

Thanks for the comments and advice, always welcome! 

 

I thought I would do a quick update of the weekend's progress. The focus has been the details on the left-hand side of the loco, including the clackvalves and handrails etc. I have also riveted the front bufferbeam and this looks much better than the flat surface on the original model. The project has reached the enjoyable stage of building the model back up with details etc, with less sanding and cutting of plastic required! I plan to order the wheels and some details (including a replacement chimney and some sprung buffers) shortly. 

 

An overall shot; its starting to come together now!

A close up of the various pipework, toolkit and valves!

Here you can see all the rivets on the bufferbeam and smokebox; I think they look effective.

I have also started to remove the fake coal load. Here you can see the replacement base that will be filled with real coal (hence the fairly rough edges)!

 

I look forward to hearing your thoughts. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

[A.R.]

Evening All, 

 

Sorry for the lack of updates this week! I am pleased to say, however, the wheels have arrived and I have started to fit them. This required some unforeseen work around the front of the chassis to enable the bogie to swivel smoothly. This turned out to be relatively simple and just required some filing, and a spacer moving back a few mm. 

Here is the chassis with motion bracket, cylinders and first bits of motion:

An overall view:

 

I think it is starting to come together now and I couldn't resist comparing the original painting to the current status of the model. Not too bad.....what do you think? (I appreciate the perspective isn't identical but hopefully it gives a good comparison!)

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

Edited January 28, 2021 by A.R.

[73c]

Wow!  Some really good work there Alex.

[BusDriverMan]

This is really looking the business!

Wish they'd just paid some overtime to the p/way dept and got those sidings and loops lengthened...

[A.R.]

Hi All, 

 

Apologies for the lack of progress and thank you for the lovely comments! 

 

Maunsell 4-8-0

I have managed to make some progress on the valve gear over the past few days, well, on the left hand side at least. This does make the loco look more finished than it is as the right hand side has very few details on the body and no valve gear to speak of yet! However, it is slowly getting there and starting to take on the feel of the painting, though I would welcome your thoughts, especially if I have missed something! 

 

Here is the chassis as it currently stands, just wheel weights to add to this side before its complete. 

 

 

And with the body on, its starting to come together! 

 

 

Drummond T-14

 

A few posts ago, I mentioned that I will be starting a fully scratchbuilt project of the Drummond T-14 in brass. This is certainly jumping in at the deep end but I am going to give it a go. I have now secured scans of the original blueprints and am working on digitally stitching them together so that I can start to draw out the various parts I will need. The first aspect of this will be the chassis frames, working upwards. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

[A.R.]

Morning All, 

 

I have managed to make some progress on the Maunsell 4-8-0 and have fitted the wheel weights and the sprung buffers at the front of the loco. I have begun work on the valve gear for the opposite side too and am expecting a new chimney in the post shortly! I will hopefully be ordering the motor and gearbox soon once I have worked out the best arrangement and gearing. What sort of speeds do you think a loco like this would have been averaging, I'd be interested to hear your thoughts? 

 

So here are some of the latest pictures showing the buffers and wheel weights fitted, and a slightly more atmospheric picture in black and white. 

 

 

 

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

[A.R.]

Evening All,

 

Although it may seem progress hasn't been made, I have been doing a few different modelling projects recently. The main one is a photo plank so that I can take some decent pictures of the models I am building! This has been built out of some scrap ply, leftover modelling materials and matchsticks/cocktail sticks - the only thing I bought was the little Ford tractor. I started by cutting out the pieces and building the basic structure out of thin ply. Then I built up the embankment with card, paper mache and plaster. This was then painted, left to dry and scenic material added. 

 

The fence is made from matchsticks and some leftove 0.45mm wire, and the signs from cardboard and matchsticks. The bridge is an N gauge Peco girder section cut to size. Track is legacy models 00 gauge bullhead.

 

 

I couldn't resist taking some photos of 94000 posed, both on its own and with a pullman coach - I have to say I am really pleased with the photo plank and how the model looks on it!

 

 

Finally, some progress on the 4-8-0 has been made - the valve gear is all finished on both sides and weight has been added. Just need to add detail and wheel weights before thoughts turn to motorising and painting .... I am still unsure as to the colour....any ideas? 

I look forward to hearing your comments and ideas. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

[A.R.]

Evening All, 

 

Not much progress on the 4-8-0 recently as I am searching for a motor and gearbox to fit. However, I have completed this luggage van from a Parkside kit and I think it's actually turned out really well! Here it is posed on the photo plank: 

 

I am also looking to upgrade some old coaches and will keep you updated on progress!

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex

[Geoff_E]

Alex,

 

First of all, I must admit to a large degree of envy. The loco is looking very good.

 

I can't claim to any great knowledge of Southern locos, others will know much more than me, but as you have modelled the loco with the Bulleid modifications as applied to the Nelsons, (visually, the large diameter chimney and raised sides on the tender) I believe the only 'authentic ' colour would be unlined black. As a Southern Railway loco it would be with black Sunshine lettering, as a BR loco with a BR crest.

 

Additionally, by this time I believe it would have been fitted with smoke deflectors and the snifting valves on the smokebox removed. All the pictures I have seen of Nelsons with the modifications are like this. Also, the smoke deflectors would not have had the outside steam pipes protruding slightly at the bottom as on unmodified locos. The picture posted by Corbs on 17 January of his model is a good reference. 

 

Best Regards

 

Geoff

[A.R.]

Hi All, 

 

Apologies for the lack of updates on here! 

 

Maunsell 4-8-0

The Maunsell 4-8-0 project is currently on hold until High-Level kits gets up and running again; before I progress further, I need to make sure it runs well with the motor and gearbox. This is not a problem as it has allowed me to embark on another project in the meantime...

 

BR Class 70

In keeping with the Sourthern theme, I have been working on a model of the Bulleid-designed CC Class locos (BR Class 70), specifically BR 20003. The models are to be largely 3D-printed, with brass parts where applicable.

 

The CAD work is now largely complete and the first test prints are due to be delivered shortly. I have designed the bogies from scratch and each will have its own motor, be driven via 3D-printed gears and a Delrin chain system, as well as having a flywheel. The model will also feature NEM coupling pcokets. This is a complete experiment but the benefits of CAD means drawings can be altered and re-printed to meet the required specifications. 

 

The pictures below should give you an idea of how it will look and I will hopefully have some test prints to show shortly. 

 

 

Thanks @Geoff_E for your kind words and information, much appreciated! I am still mulling over the colour of the Maunsell! With regards to smoke deflectors, thanks for the info, but as I am following the painting posted earlier the thread, I will likely leave them off!

 

I look forward to hearing your thoughts. 

 

Cheers, 

Alex

Edited May 3, 2021 by A.R.
Updated

[Michael Edge]

We do a kit for the pantograph on this loco.

[A.R.]

Hi,

 

Thanks @Michael Edge, I was going to ask if anyone knew of a pantograph kit! Just looked it up and it looks really nice so I will be getting one of those to finish this loco I think...bit of a way off yet though. 

 

Cheers, 

Alex

[Corbs]

Phwoar, more incredible work. I've not seen much using the Delrin system, will be interested to see how you get on.

[KeithHC]

A class 70 are you going to do the original version as well.

 

Keith

[A.R.]

Hi All, 

 

Thanks for your comments!

 

@Corbs I too am interested to see how the Delrin system will work, especially as I am incorporating some 3D printed gears! 

 

@KeithHC In the long term, I will likely do the original (simple modifications to the roof shape etc.) but due to the fact I am making this powered on both bogies, it is turning out a little expensive so the second loco will have to wait!

 

I recieved some test prints yesterday and I am really pleased with how these have turned out. They aren't perfect as they were done with older resin and on a lower resolution to allow for a quicker turnaround time. I have made a few tweaks and full final prints are currently underway! 

 

I have also ordered some of the brass parts such as the beam for the bottom of the loco and some sprung buffers. 

 

Here are some pictures of the prototype loco quickly sprayed in some grey primer: 

 

 

This is the prototype of part of the motorised bogie with the printed worm gear and worm wheel, and some bearings temporarily put in place:

 

 

I look forward to hearing your thoughts. 

 

Cheers, 

 

Alex 

[KeithHC]

That looks great and really captures the look of the original loco. I am looking forward to seeing this project progress. Now I need to come up with a 3rd rail layout especially as I lived by the Brighton line and saw these locos in service. I seam to recall one of them on a freight working derailed just north of Salfords station where we lived at the time I could just see in the distance the works going on to retail from my bedroom.

 

Keith