Hornby R3546 London & North Eastern Railway B12 '61576'

[AHW]

I have just been looking at this model online, and I find that it seems to be carrying the shed plate 30D - which is either Southend or Ayr depending on...

 

As far as I can tell this is incorrect - I believe the prototype was at Stratford (30A) , Colchester (30E), Ipswich (32B)  and then withdrawn from Cambridge (31A).

 

Anybody else have any information on this - or this is an error from Hornby?

 

 

[Stentor]

I agree with you, it looks like Hornby have misread that B12s were used on the Southend services and taken it that they were allocated there too. 61576 appears on the shedbash UK website as being at Southend in January 1956 but it is shown as being allocated to Stratford. RCTS vol 2b also talks about B12s monopolising fast and semi fast trains to Southend but makes no references to allocation to 30D.

 

//Simon

[AHW]

23 hours ago, Stentor said:

I agree with you, it looks like Hornby have misread that B12s were used on the Southend services and taken it that they were allocated there too. 61576 appears on the shedbash UK website as being at Southend in January 1956 but it is shown as being allocated to Stratford. RCTS vol 2b also talks about B12s monopolising fast and semi fast trains to Southend but makes no references to allocation to 30D.

 

//Simon

Thanks for this. You would think that Hornby could research this a little better - the BRD database has a raft of information on where locos were allocated and the subsequent movements. I was hoping it would have the Ipswich or Cambridge plate as that would suit my Fenland modelling.

[Stentor]

There is a lot of information out there so I don’t know why manufacturers still get it wrong nowadays. 
For me, and probably many of us, to get paid to research and curate this kind of detail would be a dream job.

So it strikes me as odd that a “dynamic and passionate team, striving to be the FIRST choice in models and hobbies” aren’t passionate about the detail here.

//Simon

[PaulG]

Hornby could well be correct.

 

The allocation of B12's were for the Southend Victoria to Liverpool Street semi fasts and as such shedded at Southend Victora with allocated Southend shed crew.

 

I know a former driver from Southend and will ask him.

 

This loco appears to have Southend shed plate.

 

Paul 

Edited February 20, 2021 by PaulG
Photo from Stratford shed added

[Butler Henderson]

Photo of 61576 with a 30D shed plate on page 33 of Locomotives Illustrated 77, dated 8 May 1955.

[PaulG]

On 18/02/2021 at 15:34, AHW said:

Thanks for this. You would think that Hornby could research this a little better - the BRD database has a raft of information on where locos were allocated and the subsequent movements. I was hoping it would have the Ipswich or Cambridge plate as that would suit my Fenland modelling.

This data doesn't always reflect what happened. The issue regarding Southend Victoria is the locos although under 30A they were allocated to Southend and crewed by Southend men.  F5 were allocated to Colchester but sub-shedded to Braintree and Maldon and fitters sent from Colchester for any running requirements. 

 

Paul

[Butler Henderson]

The tender on the model might need topping up with coal given this photo

[Stentor]

17 hours ago, PaulG said:

This data doesn't always reflect what happened. The issue regarding Southend Victoria is the locos although under 30A they were allocated to Southend and crewed by Southend men.  F5 were allocated to Colchester but sub-shedded to Braintree and Maldon and fitters sent from Colchester for any running requirements. 

 

Paul

Paul, if I understand you correctly then although these B12s were “on the books” as being under 30A the Southend fitters removed the 30A shed plate and replaced it with a 30D one. Was this a common activity within each shed pool for the locos working from an outlying shed?

[PaulG]

On 21/02/2021 at 12:17, Stentor said:

Paul, if I understand you correctly then although these B12s were “on the books” as being under 30A the Southend fitters removed the 30A shed plate and replaced it with a 30D one. Was this a common activity within each shed pool for the locos working from an outlying shed?

Certainly at Southend Victoria and there are photos of B1's with Southend Victoria plates.  e.g. 25 Sep 1955 Stratford station 30D 61370 see https://spottinglogs.co.uk/1955-2/

 

The N7 for the Southminster branch first up train of the day was maintained over night at Southminster shed by a young fireman from Southend  nice job for a 16 year old! See David Butchers book or GERS Journal articles.

 

Paul 

Edited February 23, 2021 by PaulG
info B1 carrying a 30D shed plate

[Butler Henderson]

If an outlying shed had its own shed code then surely it would be normal practice to give the loco the correct shed code; if you look at photos Southends B12s were typically well turned out and shed staff would no doubt give that little more attention to their "own" locos.

[Stentor]

2 hours ago, Butler Henderson said:

If an outlying shed had its own shed code then surely it would be normal practice to give the loco the correct shed code; if you look at photos Southends B12s were typically well turned out and shed staff would no doubt give that little more attention to their "own" locos.

Yes, this fits in with the philosophy of Dick Hardy and John Bellwood of pairing  crews to locomotives to encourage pride in their “own loco”.