Helston Revisited

[magmouse]

1 hour ago, Andy Keane said:

no doubt all the third class compartments were the same.

That’s right, as shown by the plan view which has the internal compartment dimension between partitions.

 

Nick.

[Penrhos1920]

On 17/04/2024 at 07:42, Andy Keane said:

Does anyone have a photo of an E19 to confirm the drawing that shows the narrow window on the the 5th compartment from the left hand end?

https://gwrcoaches.org.uk/LowRoofs.shtml#E19

It leads to a very shallow seat in that compartment.

Sorry that’s a scanning error.  Most of the Jack Slinn drawings had to be scanned in 2 or 3 sections and then stitched together.  If you look at the compartment widths you’ll see it’s the same as the adjacent compartments.  Most Dean era coaches had the same width windows regardless of compartment width or class.  The exceptions are some Metro coaches, saloons and some corridor coaches.

[Andy Keane]

A nice visit to the WSR with a mogul and Witherslack Hall running. And having never been there before I thought Blue Anchor station was lovely:

But Watchet was nice too:

 

 

Edited April 19 by Andy Keane

[Andy Keane]

The today in Romsey. Not GWR but at least a shade of green:

[Andy Keane]

As has been mentioned earlier on this thread I am assuming Helston did not have a metalled station road in my time period and so am planning an old fashioned macadam finish that will be slightly rough and a very pale fawn in colour as still seen on some farm roads around the country and particularly in the US. The same will be true for Godolphin road which was the road into Helston from the station area. Both roads had pavements and those I am planning to be a very pale grey asphalt, except right next to the station which was paved in stone.

But I am now pondering the road into the goods yard and the yard itself. I don't think a goods yard would ever have had a rolled macadam surface, so I am planning a pale ash / cinder finish for the yard, made dirty where coal is handled etc. This will be a very light grey. So were to make the change. Perhaps macadam up to the goods yard gates and then ash / cinder beyond. Or maybe the macadam would have gone a bit further up the road into the yard. Any thoughts much appreciated.

[57xx]

On 18/03/2024 at 06:32, Mikkel said:

 

Yes, they are all from the Shire scenes range. Although number three has been cut up and rebuilt for a different pose.

 

Shergar?

[Mikkel]

Just looked it up, hadn't heard about it. 🙂 But no it is just good old Daisy.

[57xx]

I did wonder after posting if it might be a bit of an obscure reference.

[Andy Keane]

Not if you have a wife who is into horse racing though.

[Simond]

I heard that they found Shergar in France.

 

in Cannes…

[BWsTrains]

2 hours ago, Andy Keane said:

Not if you have a wife who is into horse racing though.

 

Which brings a whole new twist to the oldie about "Fast women and Slow Horses", not that I'm implying anything about either.

[Andy Keane]

I am now laying down all the ground cover and so was looking again at the pictures showing the carriage shed. Paying more attention this time I see one of them shows a small bunker or staithe just to the right of the carriage shed entrance with what look likes coal or rocks in a black and white photo. Perhaps this is the remnants of a small coaling facility for the steam railmotors. Anyway I thought yes lets add that while I am about things and then I find my embankment is too narrow just where it needs to go! The photos show all I can do with the current embankment and its way to close to the track. So back to foam and hill building to add enough of a bulge there to get the darn thing in. Such is the life of a modeller.

Edited April 26 by Andy Keane

[Andy Keane]

So after some foam, epoxy, filler, glass fibre and water based resin I now have added a bulge to accommodate the little coal staithe. And now I look more closely at the large scale OS map there actually is a bulge there in real life!

Edited May 1 by Andy Keane

[Andy Keane]

I have also been working on the colour of the macadam roadway and the asphalt / cinder footpaths up to the station. Its hard to judge the colour and I would appreciate comments on how it currently looks. Here is the station forecourt:

And this is the bottom of station road:

They are in fact the same colour and this just shows how lighting and photography impact on what a photo seems to show. I am happy with the slightly rough texture and once the base colour is finished I plan to add some weathering / dirt / cart tracks to make it less bland. I will also touch up the kerb stones and add some gutter dirt.

Edited April 27 by Andy Keane

[Andy Keane]

@Brassey has pointed out the WTT for 1911 at http://www.michaelclemensrailways.co.uk/?atk=631 This is all new to me so great to have been made aware of this.

This covers Helston and shows that when required, on Mondays a “Pig Train” ran from Helston up the branch in place of the normal goods working. I assume this must have been a run of Micas filled from the abattoir that was adjacent to the goods platform. Although I guess it could have been live pigs - not sure what wagon types would be used for live pigs. Why it ran at 1:20pm on Mondays I have no idea. Also since it would probably have needed specialist trucks it is not clear how they got to Helston as there is no mention of a down pig train in the WTT.

Edited April 28 by Andy Keane

[Harlequin]

Hi Andy,

 

Do you think that a coal bin in that position is the correct interpretation? Most coaling installations used a raised platform and I suspect that’s more likely what you’re seeing in the photos.

 

And specifically with the railmotors, we know that coaling platforms were used in other locations.

 

[Andy Keane]

3 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

Hi Andy,

 

Do you think that a coal bin in that position is the correct interpretation? Most coaling installations used a raised platform and I suspect that’s more likely what you’re seeing in the photos.

 

And specifically with the railmotors, we know that coaling platforms were used in other locations.

 

Phil, I agree a non raised staithe is not obvious, but that’s what the photo from about 1960 shows: something pretty close to the model I have shown in my photos, containing rocks, ballast or coal. The photo also shows a wheeled set of steps , presumably for getting into carriages etc. I am guessing that since for a Railmotor you have to load the coal in buckets, quite where you fill them prior to loading could allow for this staithe? I am not sure what else it could have been for.

Andy

[Harlequin]

1 hour ago, Andy Keane said:

Phil, I agree a non raised staithe is not obvious, but that’s what the photo from about 1960 shows: something pretty close to the model I have shown in my photos, containing rocks, ballast or coal. The photo also shows a wheeled set of steps , presumably for getting into carriages etc. I am guessing that since for a Railmotor you have to load the coal in buckets, quite where you fill them prior to loading could allow for this staithe? I am not sure what else it could have been for.

Andy

Hmmm, it’s difficult isn’t it.

 

Maybe in the railmotor era and for some time afterwards there was a coal bin and a coaling platform alongside each other? And by the 60s the timber platform was gone, leaving only the bin?

 

Or the bin could be an ash bin and the coaling process was all done form the lost platform?

 

[BWsTrains]

1 hour ago, Harlequin said:

Or the bin could be an ash bin and the coaling process was all done form the lost platform?

 

I like that idea. the location is elevated with land falling away to the road so constraining ash makes lots of sense. Ash blowing away in the wind would be a real pain in more ways than one.

[Brassey]

9 hours ago, Andy Keane said:

...when required, on Mondays a “Pig Train” ran from Helston up the branch in place of the normal goods working. I assume this must have been a run of Micas filled from the abattoir that was adjacent to the goods platform. Although I guess it could have been live pigs - not sure what wagon types would be used for live pigs. Why it ran at 1:20pm on Mondays I have no idea. Also since it would probably have needed specialist trucks it is not clear how they got to Helston as there is no mention of a down pig train in the WTT.

Likely to be live pigs otherwise it would be described as a meat train.  In the absence of any other ideas, I guess they would have travelled in cattle wagons.  In 1911 these would still be disinfected with a lime wash.  Anyway an excuse for some cattle wagons.

 

But could it be pig iron?  was Helston known to produce either?

[Andy Keane]

8 hours ago, Harlequin said:

Hmmm, it’s difficult isn’t it.

 

Maybe in the railmotor era and for some time afterwards there was a coal bin and a coaling platform alongside each other? And by the 60s the timber platform was gone, leaving only the bin?

 

Or the bin could be an ash bin and the coaling process was all done form the lost platform?

 

Phil, Indeed an ash bin might have been more likely, though there is no sign of the pit usually used with ash bins. But perhaps that got filled in. I could certainly add another little coaling platform down there of course.

[Andy Keane]

1 hour ago, Brassey said:

Likely to be live pigs otherwise it would be described as a meat train.  In the absence of any other ideas, I guess they would have travelled in cattle wagons.  In 1911 these would still be disinfected with a lime wash.  Anyway an excuse for some cattle wagons.

 

But could it be pig iron?  was Helston known to produce either?

Doubt it was pig iron. So probably live pigs, interesting that it was important enough to figure in the WTT while cattle, broccoli and other traffic we know was handled does not. It rather suggests a special wagon formation so maybe a whole run of cattle wagons?

[Pete Haitch]

Penzance had a pig market across the way from the cattle market.  It is unlikely that pigs would be kept at slaughterhouses over weekends, so a Monday market that included fat pigs would make sense as it would get the meat production going for the week. If it was on a different day to the cattle and other livestock market, it would also provide fuller employment for the auctioneer and market staff. I guess the question to be answered is; What day of the week was the pig market in Penzance in 1911.

 

One of my late relatives started working for Harris' of Calne in Totnes immediately after the war He eventually became the head accounts person and was based at Calne and possibly Brierley Hill.  IIRC, many years ago I remember him narrating a tale he had been told about Harris' buying an abattoir in Camborne to get more pig meet for Totnes. I've done no research so cannot vouch for the information or whether it was pre or post war.  If the Camborne site was rail linked (or near enough) like Totnes; then for me it raises the question of whether the live pigs were going into Camborne for slaughter and then shipped to Totnes for processing. Likewise I'm not sure when Harris' set up or took over Totnes.

 

www.picturepenzance.com/media/the-cattle-market.5899/ 

 

 

Edited April 29 by Pete Haitch
I think I should have put Redruth rather than Camborne

[Brassey]

2 hours ago, Andy Keane said:

Doubt it was pig iron. So probably live pigs, interesting that it was important enough to figure in the WTT while cattle, broccoli and other traffic we know was handled does not. It rather suggests a special wagon formation so maybe a whole run of cattle wagons?

It might be worth following it in the WTT to see where it went onward from the junction. 

[Pete Haitch]

Redruth it was.

 

 

epw009893 ENGLAND (1924). The West of England Bacon Co Factory, Redruth, 1924 | Britain From Above 

 

Edited April 29 by Pete Haitch