Horwich Loco Works 1960's

[Possy92]

Welcome to my layout topic on Horwich Loco Works

Hi all,

(WAR AND PEACE WARNING, SCROLL TO BOTTOM FOR PICS)

In this thread, I'll be documenting my building, bodging and lacklustre skills in building my first proper layout in about 7 years.

What are the requirements for the Layout:

-Must be built "Exhibitable" (if I'm lucky enough to be invited to one!)
-Must use fine scale track
-Must fit in the back bedroom
-Must have inspiration from a real place
-Must fit in a MK1 Ford Focus

Why Horwich Loco Works?

First off, I'm a Lancastrian.

The story begins with my inglenook shunting "plank" built on the longest shelf that B&Q stocked, this featured bullhead rail and my first attempt at wiring up electrofrog points, as well as my first foray into kadees and uncouplings.
This plank has worked well, and not so well, but I learnt plenty that I'll take forward to this new layout.

For my new layout, I wanted to continue the inglenook puzzle, but add a couple of bits on for added interest, which you'll see in the track plan in a bit. I wanted to still use bullhead, but with limited space, and not having skills to build my own, nor wait for Peco Medium bullhead points, I've decided on finescale FB rail instead.

"But Horwich was a loco works! You even said it earlier on in your war and peace essay"

You are correct. However, in the 60's, Horwich started to also build and repair wagons, as well as the refurbishment of DMUs and EMUs. This is the era I will be basing my layout on. I would also like to be able to run a bit of L&Y stock should the mood take me there, but that's for a later date. I build a lot of wagon kits, so the next challenge will be building wagons in various states of repair, eg, bits cut out ready to be welded, fresh planked vent vans for repainting etc

"Why didn't you just model Newton Heath, the actual Wagon works of the L&Y?"

Another good question, and I did consider it. The only thing that stopped me was it was closed as a wagon works in the 30s I believe (I could have done a 'what if it didn't close') the 2nd to last nail in the coffin was there doesn't appear to be anything left of it!

(The final nail was that Newton Heath L&Y FC became Manchester United, and I'm a Leeds fan for my sins)

I've been throwing the idea for this layout in my head for about a year or so, give or take, looking on Google maps has images of Horwich Works, and the buildings there..... until recently. I hadn't realised they'd torn down the huge building that was left earlier this year. I was gutted. I quickly took screenshots before they were updated and removed from Google earth. From the satellite images above, it appeared to have a small building left. Unable to decide what it was, I thought "f**k it" and drove there.

Alas, the huge building was gone and is a site for new housing estate I believe. However, there was a building left, of similar design to the 'biggun' and it was being used to store various roadwork equipment (signs, portacabins, flatbeds etc)

I wasn't sure if I should be there, but decided to test my luck and just go and take pictures, plus measure up some of the building, like windows, bricks, distances etc. I was left alone and got back in the car and drove off with my photos and measurements.

 

I find it hugely ironic that the sign going into Horwich says "Welcome to Horwich, a Famous Railway Town" - which has just demolished a large part of that history.

I wanted the building measurements to use as a low relief for the backscene of the yard, and for a couple of smaller buildings I've moved around from the original plans.

I calculated I needed about 50 window modules, Rather than go insane and build 50 modules and a second mortgage to buy the brick plastic card, I figured I can 3D design it once, and get it printed 50 times - far cheaper in time and money! - More on this later.
A member of the model club owns a 3d printer and has helped with the printing and advice on how to proceed, he has a stunning N-Gauge layout, "Coke town" which you should absolutely see if you get the chance. (I think he's on here, but not sure!)

 

Here is the 3d work I've been designing on sketchup, it's been through a few iterations to get the mortar tolerances right, needs a bit more work, but it's getting there:

 

 

 

The track plan is a bit fictitious. the buildings did exist, but "not necessarily in the right order" , but allows for operational interest, essentially, it's a "hidden" inglenook, with a couple of kickback sidings for operational interest, and to add extra challenges. It'll consist of 2 standalone buildings, the Paint shop, and the wagon repair shop. The fiddle yard will technically also be a building, but will be to bring stock on and off the layout.

 

 

Right now, I have the baseboards built from 9mm Ply, each board being 40inchx17inch

 

First job was to PVA the ply and apply the 6mm* cork to the top. I've used every single weight I could find to ensure that it sticks to the board, and short of me sleeping on it, did the job.

 

*6mm Cork, are you mad?!

Unrelated yes, but the reason is for kadee magnet uncouplers. Rather than me have to mill out some of the ply board to fit them in, I've made the Cork thicker so no baseboard modification is required. Seems the simplest solution to the problem. I could have used neodymium magnets, but I find them fiddley and can physically pull your wagon off the track via the kadee tail.

The track was ordered from a combination of places, roxley models, who had every point/fishplates I needed at a very competitive price, and shipped very quickly, and Hattons, for the code 75 flexitrack as they were the only place I could find that did them individually, rather than in a big box.

I'll also be using Lanarkshire Models buffer kits of the L&Y design. From scale model scenery, I've bought dummy fishplates to use on my track for that jointed feel!

I've also ordered a piece of Z-Scale track for the representation of the small gauge track that went around the site, and "Wren" (now in the NRM) that was there until '62. It used to drive around with wage packets in a dedicated wagon! Whether I can build a working model of Wren is yet to be seen, but a static one should be possible.

 

 

Here's a pic of 1 of 2 jinty's that will be the main shunters for the layout, as they were they last ones there until '65 (They'll need renumbering, and the earlier emblem, and shed code, 99H) You can see the prototype windows in the background, I think will look quite effective when I have a few more printed up and painted.

I'll also be using my modellers license and using a few other exL&Y/LNWR/LMS locos shunting the yard. There's a pic of 1008 in L&Y livery there either in the 60's or 70's, and I will absolutely be putting my model on there amongst the stock.

 

 

You'll notice I've painted the cork in a matt grey colour, and cut the cork out for the kadee magnets. I haven't fixed them down yet as I need to tinker with their position. I've been wiring up the rest of layout, mainly the points, and am happy to say they work - I'm using seep point motors and am using the "seep peg method" and they're working well! My control panel isn't permanent, I want to make a proper one, but his will do for testing. It was important to make the wiring loom long enough so the panel can in theory be hung from the front or the back. I've probably overdone it with wiring in general and should have used busbars on each board and linked them with one wire, rather than dragging looms of wires over to the other board. It works for now and is relatively neat, so will leave until I show everyone at the model club and they laugh in my face at my longwinded wiring, and am forced out of embarrassment to change.

 

I've been running no.19 (L&Y pug) up and down the Layout Playing trains to work out the kinks - more playing testing will be needed before I commit to scenics.

 

Speaking of scenics, I'm unsure of where to go next - there will be small concreted sections around where the buildings are, but other than that, from pics I've seen, it really was just a "yard" mostly ballasted from ash, but the whole area wouldn't have been ash would it? I was thinking ash scatter around the tracks, and das clay in the 6ft between tracks, if that makes sense?  Advice would be appreciated

 

I mentioned earlier about using the lanakshire buffer stops - these have been completed and weathered, which you'll see below. The were superglued together, and then painted with rust coloured enamels, coated in hairspray, then painted with white acrylics , once dry, I wet the paint with a brush and peeled away the paint to reveal the rusty undertones, and further weathered with sleeper grime and weathering powders. The only one I'm not sold on is the wooden buffer in L&Y Red (right), as I've tried to show it as "old" wood - which if you look, goes a whitish/grey shade, but because the grain isn't on the casting, doesn't quite look right. It may grow on me yet, or 'll chnage it out for a metal buffer stop instead.

 

 

(pic taken from "Horwich Locomotive works" by M.D.Smith)

 

Thank you for taking the time to read, apologies for the war and peace, but needed to get this posted now before I made too much progress on the layout!

 

Cheers,

 

Andy

[SteveyDee68]

You may not be aware, but “Enterprise House” off Brunel Street (off Chorley New Road) was the old canteen for the Horwich Loco Works, and as such it has the tallest gable end in Horwich at its far end (due to the slope). Now in use as a doggy daycare centre!

 

How do I know about this place? My ex-wife’s family business G Dalton Engineering Ltd was based there for many years until a fire forced their relocation to another site in Horwich (off Chorley Old Road). Dalton Engineering was (is?) one of the last traditional coppersmiths, and some of the bending hoops (I have no idea of the proper terminology!) they had were from the loco works. I think some of those were irreparably damaged in the fire.
 

 

[5BarVT]

5 hours ago, Possy92 said:

*6mm Cork, are you mad?!

I am too - 2x 3mm in the scenic area for exactly the same reason.

Paul.

[Possy92]

7 hours ago, SteveyDee68 said:

You may not be aware, but “Enterprise House” off Brunel Street (off Chorley New Road) was the old canteen for the Horwich Loco Works, and as such it has the tallest gable end in Horwich at its far end (due to the slope). Now in use as a doggy daycare centre!

 

How do I know about this place? My ex-wife’s family business G Dalton Engineering Ltd was based there for many years until a fire forced their relocation to another site in Horwich (off Chorley Old Road). Dalton Engineering was (is?) one of the last traditional coppersmiths, and some of the bending hoops (I have no idea of the proper terminology!) they had were from the loco works. I think some of those were irreparably damaged in the fire.
 

 

 

I think I know which building you mean! I saw it on the way to Horwich Works and thought "That's very industrial, I'll go have a look!" unfortunately the light was fading, and traffic was building up at the time so couldn't get a decent picture, but Google earth to the rescue! I had no idea it used to be a canteen/coppersmiths/dodgy daycare! Thanks for sharing

 

 

  

 

 

4 hours ago, 5BarVT said:

I am too - 2x 3mm in the scenic area for exactly the same reason.

Paul.

 

Am Glad to see I'm in good company! (Great minds and all that!)

 

Cheers

 

Andy

 

[SteveyDee68]

1 hour ago, Possy92 said:

dodgy daycare! Thanks for sharing

Well, it is actually “doggy daycare” but perhaps that is a Freudian slip?!

 

I’d forgotten about the street side of the building with all the windows - the other side has various doors into it as it was divided up into multiple industrial units, the largest of which (doggy daycare) used to be the engineering company.

 

As a railway-related aside, about a year after separating from my wife, I was chatting with the fireman on one of the locos at the ELR about how her company were proper industrial coppersmiths, and ended up speaking to her sister suggesting they got in touch with the ELR to talk about outsourcing boiler tube repairs etc to them as part of the ELR’s ongoing and expanding locomotive restoration programme. Always keen to pursue an alternative revenue opportunity (sarcasm mode off), she promptly sat on that and completely ignored it for several years until COVID came along and interrupt every man and his dog in their daily lives. A lost opportunity - she didn’t even bother speaking to them! My (to be) ex-wife actually told me off for suggesting possible work opportunities for their family business, as it no longer having anything to do with me! 
 

Ah well, their loss.
 

 

[Possy92]

On 31/12/2021 at 15:59, SteveyDee68 said:

Well, it is actually “doggy daycare” but perhaps that is a Freudian slip?!

 

Ha! I must have misread it! 

 

Happy New Year Everyone!

 

I've been experimenting with ballast covering, and I'll be the first to admit I'm not entirely happy with what I've done. I've followed Chris Nevard's (the gold standard of modelling) guide, but haven't been able to replicate his work yet!

 

I started with scrap wood, cork and spare bits of track.

 

I forgot to take a pic of just before I applied paint, but I did get a WIP!

 

 

I've tried to do the following:

Top right track - Das Clay

Bottom right - Das Clay on shallow ballast, Shallow Ballast and finally just ballast

Left track - Das Clay on fine shallow ballast, Shallow fine Ballast, and fine ballast

 

I sprayed the track with roof dirt, with a splash of sleeper grime, I've dry brushed with a bit of white, and then used weathering powder, "smoke" and black" - again, I don't think I've got the colouring right, but I do like the shallow fine Ballast. I don't want to use real ash as it's quite corrosive. I think I need to use some specific ash ballast from one of the manufacturers, - I quite like the look of Peco's cinders and ash ballast:

 

 

 

Above you can see my "Attempts" above, mine is definitely too light  - any comments/criticism/suggestions welcome!

 

Finally, shunting with Number 19 has been rather fun! I need to "reset" the kadees on the wagons, and add some weight to them as they tend to "stick" together a bit!

 

 

Finally, a link to No.19 crossing 3 points in a row without stalling, I love electrofrogs!

 

https://imgur.com/a/f4KZWk7

 

Cheers

 

Andy

 

 

[Possy92]

Whilst I wait on the new ballast to arrive, I figured I may as well work out how the backscene is going to work.

 

Originally, I was going to have a diagonal track from the fiddle yard come out of the middle of the low relief "Horwich slices" I've made, but could not find any real life examples I could justify my diagonal track.

 

I've decided instead to split the low relief in half, and have it as 2 parts of the works, double to fun! (I think)

 

What I want to do with the backscene is have it stick out of the middle of the works, but that would block the track as the trains go through the middle, as per the real life example.

 

My solution, create a "shelf" for the backscene to sit on, over the works, which will hide the fiddle yard.

 

As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words, so I have some pics of mockups, both physical and 3d designed (in reality, each building will have 12 or 13 window slices, not the 4 depicted in the sketchup render!

 

 

The cardboard and tape mockup whilst I couldn't sleep, based on part of the real works (pic below)

 

3D render of how the backscene will incorporate into the works and visa versa. (Will have about 12 or 13 windows each will the 2 buildings!)

 

Finally an overview of how it'll look from the side - I'll probably end up adding an extra piece of backscene along the width anyway, which will help keep the board rigid

 

 

 

As always, comments and criticism welcome

 

Cheers

 

Andy

 

 

Edited January 5, 2022 by Possy92
forgot pic of Horwich!