Tyneside Central Freight Depot

[SHerr]

Hi there, I wonder if anyone can help.

 

I’m looking for a bit more info/photos of TCFD as I’m planning out a new layout based around the North East and am looking at whether something inspired by the depot would work on a smaller scale.

 

I can’t really find much on Google other than a few photos of an 08 shunting some tanks.

 

I’m particularly looking at what types of traffic did it handle, what sort of workings did it receive and from where? I’m looking at circa 1986/.

 

Many Thanks

[Fat Controller]

34 minutes ago, SHerr said:

Hi there, I wonder if anyone can help.

 

I’m looking for a bit more info/photos of TCFD as I’m planning out a new layout based around the North East and am looking at whether something inspired by the depot would work on a smaller scale.

 

I can’t really find much on Google other than a few photos of an 08 shunting some tanks.

 

I’m particularly looking at what types of traffic did it handle, what sort of workings did it receive and from where? I’m looking at circa 1986/.

 

Many Thanks

I used to look after some office blocks that had a bird's eye view of the place, a couple of years before the period you mention. At that time, the traffic I remember included the following:

Inbound

Guinness in VGA and VDA

Steel plate in SPAs

Insulaton (rolls) in Bogie ferry bans

Bricks from Butterley in OBA and OCA

 

Outbound Aluminium slabs in Cargowaggon hooded flats

There was also traffic that was staged here, but loaded elsewhere. This included roof tiles for Redland in OAA,  trade cars (Ford)  on Cartic 4, Army trailers from Birtley, in SPA, Fruit and veg in Transfesa vans to Team Valley Greenmarket. 

Chocolate from Fawdon, explosives to Black Callerton, scrap from various yards.

 

Yard shunting was by an 08, with an 03 that covered local trips to Blaydon and Dunston.

Hope this is of some use.

 

Edited April 11, 2023 by Fat Controller

[Fat Controller]

I forgot the Bullion train; it's imminent arrival signalled by the arrival of a couple of Granadas conveying Tyneside's finest.

[SHerr]

Thanks, very informative. That possibly explains some of the more random/eclectic things there if it was also used for staging/holding. I just wish you hadn’t mentioned the Cartic4 as that might get expensive!

 

Also interesting that the 08 shunted the yard and the 03 ran the trip.

 

Seems enough variety for a bit of licence as well!

[Fat Controller]

The reason for the 03 working the trips was the extra speed in comparison with the 08. One job was taking the Cartics through Central Station if they'd arrived facing the 'wrong way round' Easier than having to pay warranties after the 'jockeys' had tried reversing the cars off.

 

[Rivercider]

Freight Only Vol 1 : Northern England, by Rhodes and Shannon has some info.

It lists the Tyne Yard trip summary from January 1987, though not details of wagons or traffic.

 

The relevant trips departure times, (and booked loco) are:-

 

9P04 06.45 to TCFD, Cl.31

9P10 11.00 to Simonside & TCFD, Cl.31

9P11 11.30 to Heaton & Coxlodge, & TCFD, Cl.31

9P02 13.50 to Southwick (Austin & Pickersgill) and TCFD,  Cl.31

 

cheers

[Ken.W]

The TCFD pilot was, as far as l knew, always an 03 turn. Maybe an 08 was used occasionally if an 03 was unavailable, or in its last couple of years when they were being withdrawn.

 

Regarding working of the yard, the through sidings, between the main running lines and the NCL shed were reception / departure roads, and used for making trains up ready for departure.

Loading and unloading was done in the shed, and in further sidings beyond the shed.

 

For the Cartics, there was an unloading dock, on the same side of the main lines, to the north of the A184 (Felling By-pass) road overbridge, with a large storage compound for the unloaded cars alongside. Conversation with a colleague confirms it wasn't just Ford's, Datsuns which came in via Tyne Dock, and Vauxhalls were also mentioned (and probably others too). Maybe your cartics could disappear off scene, being hauled by the pilot out under the roadbridge, to reappear later being propelled back in empty!

 

On the other side of the main lines opposite the car unloading dock was a 2-road coal drops for household coal, the wagons shunted across by the yard pilot.

 

Another traffic at TCFD was the fuel tanks for Gateshead Depot, which were tripped there by the yard pilot (without brakevan) which returned with the empties.

 

The so called 'Factories Pilot' - the trip working to Dunston and Blaydon previously mentioned, unusually although a Gateshead turn, ran from Tyne Yard not the TCFD. Also, it was worked by an 03 off Gateshead depot not the TCFD pilot, and by this period traffic on this was down to the Greenmarket (TVTE), Thompson's scrapyard (Dunston riverside) - 16t mineral wagons, loaded out, and Blaydon coalyard, also 16t minerals. Not all were daily though.

Use of an 03 for this turn had little to do with speed though, it was only an appprox 5 mile trip even when it did need to go to Blaydon on what was then still a freight only line. The sidings at the back of Blaydon coal yard were very sharply curved and l recall being told when learning this turn they couldn't be shunted by an 08.

 

Edited April 13, 2023 by Ken.W
Correcting Thompson's location

[Ken.W]

On 11/04/2023 at 17:03, Rivercider said:

Freight Only Vol 1 : Northern England, by Rhodes and Shannon has some info.

It lists the Tyne Yard trip summary from January 1987, though not details of wagons or traffic.

 

The relevant trips departure times, (and booked loco) are:-

 

9P04 06.45 to TCFD, Cl.31

9P10 11.00 to Simonside & TCFD, Cl.31

9P11 11.30 to Heaton & Coxlodge, & TCFD, Cl.31

9P02 13.50 to Southwick (Austin & Pickersgill) and TCFD,  Cl.31

 

cheers

 

The destinations give a good clue as to the traffic for those workings;

 

TCFD, the traffic handled in the yard as mentioned above

 

Simonside, 'cripples', this was the local wagon repair shops, so anything going for repair and repaired vehicles on return.

 

Heaton North Yard, had a coal yard and Blue Cicle cement depot. Would also handle fuel oil and stores for Heaton Depot.

 

Coxlodge, Rowntree at Fawdon and explosives at Callerton as mentioned above

 

Southwick, Austin & Pickersgill was a shipyard on the Wear

 

As well as freight to and from the yard there'd be a considerable amount of passing freight on the main lines during this period.

Principally frequent trip workings of coal and returning empties between the Durham Coast collieries and Stella South (Blaydon), Stella North (Newburn), and Cambois (Blyth) power stations. Initially in the 80s still Cl.37 hauled 21 & 24 ton unfitted hoppers, with double-headed 37 trains of HBA (the Railfreight non-MGR type) taking over, later giving way to Cl.56 haulage.

 

While Follingsby Freightliner terminal at Wardley on the Leamside line was operating, as the connection with the terminal faced North, all departing trains were routed via Gateshead, so passing TCFD. Arriving trains from the south though were routed via the Leamside and propelled back into the terminal.

 

Similarly,  the connection from Tyne Dock faced North so traffic to or from there would be routed via Gateshead.

(The South facing connection with the coast line at Pontop was a late addition)

[SHerr]

8 hours ago, Ken.W said:

The TCFD pilot was, as far as l knew, always an 03 turn. Maybe an 08 was used occasionally if an 03 was unavailable, or in its last couple of years when they were being withdrawn.

 

Regarding working of the yard, the through sidings, between the main running lines and the NCL shed were reception / departure roads, and used for making trains up ready for departure.

Loading and unloading was done in the shed, and in further sidings beyond the shed.

 

For the Cartics, there was an unloading dock, on the same side of the main lines, to the north of the A184 (Felling By-pass) road overbridge, with a large storage compound for the unloaded cars alongside. Conversation with a colleague confirms it wasn't just Ford's, Datsuns which came in via Tyne Dock, and Vauxhalls were also mentioned (and probably others too). Maybe your cartics could disappear off scene, being hauled by the pilot out under the roadbridge, to reappear later being propelled back in empty!

 

On the other side of the main lines opposite the car unloading dock was a 2-road coal drops for household coal, the wagons shunted across by the yard pilot.

 

Another traffic at TCFD was the fuel tanks for Gateshead Depot, which were tripped there by the yard pilot (without brakevan) which returned with the empties.

 

The so called 'Factories Pilot' - the trip working to Dunston and Blaydon previously mentioned, unusually although a Gateshead turn, ran from Tyne Yard not the TCFD. Also, it was worked by an 03 off Gateshead depot not the TCFD pilot, and by this period traffic on this was down to the Greenmarket (TVTE), Thompson's scrapyard (Bladon riverside) - 16t mineral wagons, loaded out, and Blaydon coalyard, also 16t minerals. Not all were daily though.

Use of an 03 for this turn had little to do with speed though, it was only an appprox 5 mile trip even when it did need to go to Blaydon on what was then still a freight only line. The sidings at the back of Blaydon coal yard were very sharply curved and l recall being told when learning this turn they couldn't be shunted by an 08.

 

Brilliant, thank you for both replies, very insightful. Interesting that the Gateshead fuel tanks came from TCFD, did they come there directly from the terminals around Jarrow or did the Freight depot have fuel storage?

 

Many Thanks

[Fat Controller]

2 hours ago, SHerr said:

Brilliant, thank you for both replies, very insightful. Interesting that the Gateshead fuel tanks came from TCFD, did they come there directly from the terminals around Jarrow or did the Freight depot have fuel storage?

 

Many Thanks

They were staged at TCFD, before being worked south (or north, if they were going to Grangemouth). The only fuel storage at TCFD was diesel-powered plant, such as the Coles' Crane and the forklifts.

[Fat Controller]

Mention of Blaydon Yard reminded me of a traffic worked to and from there after the Miners' Strike. This was of various air-braked vehicles for internal cleaning before going off-lease; amongst the types seen were the 'Clyde Cement' bogie hoppers. I've no idea why Blaydon was chosen.

[Ken.W]

8 hours ago, SHerr said:

Brilliant, thank you for both replies, very insightful. Interesting that the Gateshead fuel tanks came from TCFD, did they come there directly from the terminals around Jarrow or did the Freight depot have fuel storage?

 

Many Thanks

 

Not sure where the fuel tanks for Gateshead came from, they either could have arrived at TCFD on a Speedlink service that served the yard, or in a trip working from Tyne Yd.

Also, it was always TTA type tanks for this period.

 

The oil tanks from Jarrow were a block train working to wherever they were for, and were bogie tanks.

This was another working that would have passed by TCFD, they were staged at Tyne Yd for onward journey.

[Mark Saunders]

12 hours ago, Ken.W said:

 

Not sure where the fuel tanks for Gateshead came from, they either could have arrived at TCFD on a Speedlink service that served the yard, or in a trip working from Tyne Yd.

Also, it was always TTA type tanks for this period.

 

The oil tanks from Jarrow were a block train working to wherever they were for, and were bogie tanks.

This was another working that would have passed by TCFD, they were staged at Tyne Yd for onward journey.

I think Stanlow was doing Traction Gas Oil and we’re also supplying lube oil for Gateshead, Heaton and Cambois. 
 

CM&EE stores such as sand would come in air braked vans for the depots, Heaton had a dedicated road with platform access next to the stores when rebuilt for HST’s.

[Trestrol]

Two other departmental workings for you. S&T stores vans and opens once a week from York Central S&T stores for Newcastle S&T stores. This was transhipted to lorry's for delivery to the stores. 

Also TCFD was a central collection point for all rubbish and waste in the Newcastle area. This was worked to Etherley tip Durham for disposal. I assume this was an old ballast quarry. Not sure what wagons were used for this. 

[Fat Controller]

3 hours ago, Trestrol said:

Two other departmental workings for you. S&T stores vans and opens once a week from York Central S&T stores for Newcastle S&T stores. This was transhipted to lorry's for delivery to the stores. 

Also TCFD was a central collection point for all rubbish and waste in the Newcastle area. This was worked to Etherley tip Durham for disposal. I assume this was an old ballast quarry. Not sure what wagons were used for this. 

There was a regular traffic to Gateshead, containing stores and spares, ranging from brake shoes to loco bogies, diesel engines, and generators. It was always good for a wide selection of 'Specials', from Lowmacs to bogie Flatrols; most would have wagon sheets covering the more delicate bits. It started at Crewe Works, then went by Derby Works, before heading north.

I don't know what had been at Etherley, but from the photos I've seen, it looked as though they were trying to bury a viaduct!

[Mark Saunders]

There was a Modern Railways article on TCFD not long after it opened!

[Enterprisingwestern]

On 13/04/2023 at 00:34, Ken.W said:

The TCFD pilot was, as far as l knew, always an 03 turn. Maybe an 08 was used occasionally if an 03 was unavailable, or in its last couple of years when they were being withdrawn.

 

That confirms my memories of the 60's/70's that I spotted 2 or 3 03's there.

 

Mike.

[SHerr]

Thanks again for all the info, this is starting to throw up more than I'd expected. Especially the use of the reception lines for staging/onward movements and departmental workings.

 

I'm still evolving thoughts for my own layout which may well see a scaled down version as I don't have space and me move the depot to the Team Valley area as was originally hoping for something based on the Newcastle to Carlisle line (excuse to run the odd 25, 26 and 27 in the mid 80's) and I've not got room for full length freights on the main lines.

 

The receptions could then be used for staging moves for the Blaydon/Prudhoe working as well as call off for the Hexham trip and plenty of industry in Team Valley in the 80's plus the start of the Metro Centre.

 

That said the more posted on here I'm thinking if there was space this would make quite an impressive exhibition layout with the main line traffic behind.

[Fat Controller]

One thing I remember, after the Miners' Strike, were the long rows of 21t fitted hoppers at TCFD. They were being held before being sent for total/ partial rebuilding as ballast/ spoil carriers to replace the remaining unfitted wagons in the CCE fleet.

[Trestrol]

During the electrification of the ECML S&T cable and concrete troughing trains were loaded and unloaded there. The cable carriers were ex lowfits and conflats. Troughing was carried in pipe and tube wagons but also lowmacs and Weltrols. The latter were also used for scrap recovery as well. Scrap skips were kept there for the scrap. There was a road crane based there that did the loading. Wagons with new signal posts as well.

Don't forget the two exGWR full Brakes that were  internal users at TCFD. They were painted BR Blue. 

Edited April 15, 2023 by Trestrol

[8K77]

TCFD Also sent out locally brewed Ale (Newcastle Brown Ale) and Newcastle Steamed Bitter to a variety of destinations again via the Speedlink Network and this traffic along with the Redland Roof Tiles lasted up to the demise of the Speedlink Network.

 

Cheers, 

K77

[hmrspaul]

Redland PNA https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/raileasetioxide/e2dca815e

MoD Ramp https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/modaramp/e28397255

ZDA ex ODA https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/oda/e28dc027d

ZDV https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brpipe/e15602b7c

Cable drum https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brconflata/e7a8af02

Internal user conflat https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brconflata/e64027b3f

Grounded containers https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/paulbartlettsrailwaywagonphotographs/e65b1af67   https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/paulbartlettsrailwaywagonphotographs/e604fd2ef

Internal user GWR B https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/gwrnpccs/e24eaf63f

TTA https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/paulbartlettsrailwaywagonphotographs/e1eac0ff2

Cargowaggon flat https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/paulbartlettsrailwaywagonphotographs/e16aef988

Carflat https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/paulbartlettsrailwaywagonphotographs/e24ef40c5

VTG Van https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/vtgbr/e1f87d4fb 

 

Paul

 

 

Edited April 15, 2023 by hmrspaul

[hmrspaul]

Note there may be duplication with my earlier entry

 

August 1985 

 

No photo B786459  as IU 041563  B785609 as IU 041562   B755543 as IU 041564  

 

https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/modawarwell/e2515728e

 

Another GWR B internal https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/internal04xxxxer/e3bf0b0ef

 

Conflat and container https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/internal04xxxxer/e64027b3f

 

HTV https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/br21thopperweld/e351814dc     https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/br21thopperweldrebody/eb833a60

 

HTO https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lnerrebodyhopper/e30a7c584

 

Van https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/gwrvans/e1579d2b0

 

VAnwide https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/internal04xxxxer/e379ceba9 - note was in Full loads in 1985 with 041704 B783719 041705  B783734 

 

[SHerr]

That's fantastic thank you Paul, some real interesting stuff coming out here although I think I might have to extend my garage to make room for a big enough fiddle yard to hold everything!

 

I'm wondering, were the Warwell's etc loaded there or did they just lay over? I'm assuming they were probably for new build from Vickers or was it closed by the mid 80's.

 

Also intrigued by the description Newcastle Full Loads, was this a local name or some other reference?

 

[hmrspaul]

22 minutes ago, SHerr said:

 

 

Also intrigued by the description Newcastle Full Loads, was this a local name or some other reference?

 

I'm not local, where is Mark Saunders when you need him? But this was a depot developed in the later 1950s when the idea was of concentrating on larger freight depots to road deliver to a much larger area, with the closure of the numerous small station yards. Peterborough was another noticeable on the ECML. 

 

Paul