Epoch 1 Goods Trains – Brakemen and Brakemen’s Cabins Questions

[BillB]

Hi, I am asking this here rather than on the prototype board because it is about getting my modelling practice right. I have several questions and even if some have been asked before I thought it might be handy to have all the answers in the same place!

 

1. Were brakeman’s cabins glazed, and the un-glazed models just a cost-cut?

 

2. Did each cabin just control the brakes on that wagon?

 

3. Was every brake cabin in a train manned? Or was there a mandatory number than had to be manned when a train was moving?

 

4. Did the brakemen on a train have to be from the same Landerbahn as the engine crew? Or could they inter-operate?

 

5. Did the brakeman on a train need to be in a cabin on a vehicle belonging to his own employing Landerbahn, or could he use the cabin of a “visiting” wagon?

 

To put the above in context, if a goods train ran from Berlin to Dresden did responsibility for braking the train change at the border between Prussia and Saxony? Or could a Prussian brakeman in a Prussian wagon with brakeman’s cabin control the train for the whole journey? I have used Prussia and Saxony as the example, but the question applies more widely.

 

And could you have a train running entirely within Saxony, say from Dresden to Leipzig, where the only wagon(s) on the train with a brakeman’s cabin was a Prussian wagon, with the cabin manned by a Saxon brakeman, or would the train need to have a Saxon wagon with brakeman’s cabin for the Saxon brakeman to use?

 

6. Would a branch-line train always have a wagon with brakeman’s cabin from the home company, or could the brakeman occupy any convenient cabin?

 

7. Did there have to be a wagon with brakeman’s cabin at the end of the train (e.g. to prevent runaway if a coupling broke mid-train).

 

8. Where the brakeman’s cabin is lower than the height of it's van and so has no commanding view, would that be manned in a journey or just used to brake the wagon when stationary, and thus that wagon could not act as the brake on a running train? (example, Fleischmann 5853 K).

 

I'd be grateful for any relevant info,

Thanks,

Bill.

 

Edited October 29, 2023 by BillB
Grammar

[BillB]

I forgot to ask, what is the role of the brakeman's cabins when the train has a proper Gepackwagen at the back? And in special reference to short goods trains on branchlines, did a train need to have a gepackwagen too if it had a van with a brakeman's cabin?

 

Thanks,

Bill.

[rekoboy]

In answer to the first two questions: - a brakeman's cabin was glazed, it is Piko's (and others') cost-saving and simplification that have made those windows glazing-free! And the brakeman applied the brakes just on that vehicle.

[Klaus ojo]

Bill,

(Well- and I´ve seen that there is something on Wikipedia as well sounding very similar) I´m not an expert in this topic, however, some reasonable assumptions based on habits on Bavarian railways - which might be better than nothing:

 

1-2   see rekoboy    (although with the vast variety of different manufacturers, countries and railway companies for glazing everything is possible: see 6. )

 

3.  Was there a mandatory number that had to be manned ?:  The companies ordered braked wagons in a ratio between of about 1:2 or 1:5 (braked/unbraked) in their rolling stock and used them according to topographic needs spread over the length of the train which were shorter these days. If there happened to be more braked wagons than needed, why should the surplus be manned with cost? 

I´ve read (but do not know the source right now) that for very steep sections (like the Schiefe Ebene - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schiefe_Ebene ) there were additional brakesmen which only did service there, left the train at next post and returned to repeat the procedure. These trains would need some more braked vans than average.

edit: there was a directive "later on in 1892", see §13:

https://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Bekanntmachung,_betreffend_die_Betriebsordnung_für_die_Haupteisenbahnen_Deutschlands#§._33._Bildung_der_Züge. 

 

4. Did the brakemen on a train have to be from the same Landerbahn as the engine crew?: The wagons were inter-operatable, but I´d assume the staff wouldn´t as the rolling stock in many cases was wide spread. Not the locos and staff.  AFAIK typically staff and loco changed at borders.

 

6. Would a branch-line train always have a wagon with brakeman’s cabin from the home company, or could the brakeman occupy any convenient cabin?  I´d say yes, any  "convenient" cabin. There were wagons even without any cabin.  It was a dangerous job and many were injured and some even died e.g. with frost in winter and summers was not better I´d suppose. Life was not worth much these days. Brachlines were different in different countries(=Ländern). Some were operated by the larger companies, some only by own staff depending on the rather individual legal and economic background. 

 

7. Did there have to be a wagon with brakeman’s cabin at the end of the train (e.g. to prevent runaway if a coupling broke  mid-train). It is reasonable to always have a braked at the end for that purpose.

 

8. Where the brakeman’s cabin is lower than the height of it's van and so has no commanding view.. The commands were typically given by piping from the loco so view was not essential.  The very early braked wagons did not have a cabin, then there were open covers (e.g. see: www.laenderbahn-forum.de/journal/die_steintransportwagen_der_BOB/die_steintransportwagen_der_BOB.html ) followed by closed and elevated cabins. These were lowered again when electrification was more widespread beginning after 1900, well: first lines. After introduction of air brakes after 1920 the cabins were broken down step by step (leaving a simple brake stand ).

 

9. A Gepäckwagen is for luggage in a passenger train. Typically it was behind the loco as protection and not at the end. You are thinking of a "Güterzug-Begleitwagen" (Pwg) which was for marchalling personnel, guard/train manager and- yes- to warm up the brakesmen at stops- not when the train was running. And yes- these were braked as well. The early trains did not have Pwg, this came up after about 1880 and was more widespread after about 1900.

 

Hope this does help. If I happen to come across further information I might add. Please correct me if some details are wrong

 

Klaus

Edited March 4 by Klaus ojo
some little additions and corrections

[BillB]

Dear Klaus and Rekoboy, thank you very much for your replies, which are very helpful. My branch line will definitely be before 1920 and air-brakes. As to which company, that will depend on which loco is on the tracks at the time. I have a selection of interesting small tank engines, essentially one goods loco and one passenger loco for each railway, and all from traders stands at train shows or ebay, so not a new one amongst them!

Thanks again,

Bill.

[Michael Hodgson]

I don't know about German practice, but North of the Artic Circle the Malmban from Kiruna (Sweden) to Narvik (Norway) had brakemen's cabins on the heavy iron ore trains before continuous brakes because the line was so steeply graded.  These were staffed by Sami (previously referred to as Lapps), they dressed in thick furs (usually reindeer skins) in winter as temperatures of -40 degrees were common and they applied the brakes on both their own wagon and on the adjacent one.   It is hardly suprising that this line was a very early convert to electric traction and continuous brakes,

[Keith Addenbrooke]

I also have a couple of examples of coaches with brakeman’s cabins too:

 

 

 

I’m afraid my knowledge of the period is really minimal, so I’d welcome any more insights from others, but it seemed relevant to this thread to show it’s not just freight wagons.  Hope that’s Ok, Keith.

[Klaus ojo]

Yes Keith,

nice coaches! You might have seen that these coaches are some of the older prototypes. Before having air pressure brakes in coaches these had manually operated brakes as well, including cabin. German railway companies relatively early took over the Westinghouse air pressur brakes for premium passenger service, especially after a better operating Knorr brake was available which could be loosened and fastened repeatedly. Freight rolling stock was fitted much later because of higher more quantity and costs consequently. There were other attempts for e.g. mechanical brake installations to replace the need for brakemen. e.g. Heberlein brakes  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heberlein_brake  

As railway companies often were scarce of money older rolling stock from mainline and premium service very often was reused on seconday services so these coaches may have had a longer second live later.

(You might have noticed stripes at the edges of German freigth stock of the era 2 between the wars? Thats for discriminating between unfitted and fitted rolling stock and the ones with just a pipe through to be able to run in air braked trains without itself having a brake.)

By the way: The wagon for Ansbach on your photo is not a Bavarian prototype (seems to be a Prussian one. This is of course more probable than the other way round a Bavarian wagon in the north . Fleischmann did many funny things with these prototypes., which are indeed nice. Of course on a model raiway everything is allowed.)

cheers

Klaus

Edited November 17, 2023 by Klaus ojo
removed surplus link

[Keith Addenbrooke]

Thank you @Klaus ojo, I expect I will have a lot of questions about Epoche 1 railways where I will appreciate your knowledge.  I will make a lot of mistakes, but the trains are quite beautiful to watch, Keith.

 

Edited November 17, 2023 by Keith Addenbrooke