johnd Posted December 29, 2010 Share Posted December 29, 2010 Glad to see that the Observation car is being released in Maroon with a Scottish carriage number. I believe that before it went to Scotland it operated in North Wales on the Land cruise trains. Can anybody supply the carriage number ( possible renumber) it operated whilst there and the carriage formation/livery of the rest of the train & loco's likely to have been used. I am aware of the North Wales Land cruise but my departed father always refered to a Cambrian Radio Cruise, which from memory I would have travelled on in the late 50's. Having seen pictures of the interior of the Observation car they tie in with memories ( some what vague) I have of travelling in this type of coach. Also if to renumber who produces the best numbering sheets to do the job. Thx in advance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Chris Chewter Posted December 29, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 29, 2010 Don't know if it helps, but these are two discussion on the old thread. One runs to ten pages of information which might give a few useful pointers: http://www.rmweb.co....php?f=5&t=50091 http://www.rmweb.co....hp?f=11&t=49149 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 This is No 14. It Didn't run in North Wales, going straight to Scotland for use on the Glasgow-Oban service. The year before it was withdrawn (1967) it replaced No 13 (SC280M) on the Inverness-Kyle of Lochalsh line. The SC281 number is accurate for that period of its existence. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnd Posted December 30, 2010 Author Share Posted December 30, 2010 This is No 14. It Didn't run in North Wales, going straight to Scotland for use on the Glasgow-Oban service. The year before it was withdrawn (1967) it replaced No 13 (SC280M) on the Inverness-Kyle of Lochalsh line. The SC281 number is accurate for that period of its existence. Thank you John but were there any differences between no 13 & 14. Going back to the Cambrian Radio cruise does anybody know of its coach formation and loco's used on it? Anybody got any pics of it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 Thank you John but were there any differences between no 13 & 14. They were identical when first converted in 1947, apart from upholstry colours: 13 had blue seats and 14 had red seats. When repainted for British Rail use, no 13 was given a very stylish maroon version of the Pullman art deco lining (as pictured in my avatar), while no 14 was plain maroon (as pictured in Hornby's new production). Also, no 13 was given opening toplights in the two end windows. Hope that helps, johnd Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnd Posted December 31, 2010 Author Share Posted December 31, 2010 They were identical when first converted in 1947, apart from upholstry colours: 13 had blue seats and 14 had red seats. When repainted for British Rail use, no 13 was given a very stylish maroon version of the Pullman art deco lining (as pictured in my avatar), while no 14 was plain maroon (as pictured in Hornby's new production). Also, no 13 was given opening toplights in the two end windows. Hope that helps, johnd thx again it looks like a paint job or wait till Hornby bring out the correct version if I want to represent the Cambrian Radio cruise Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 thx again it looks like a paint job or wait till Hornby bring out the correct version if I want to represent the Cambrian Radio cruise It would be a VERY fiddly paint job, I'm afraid. I want that particular coach for my Kyle Line memories. Going by the output form Hornby, I'll stick my neck out and say SC280M will be in the 2012 catalogue Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 I think the North Wales car looked something like this apart from the lettering.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 I think the North Wales car looked something like this apart from the lettering.... That was it! Numbered M280M before it moved to Scotland, and with NO lettering in the white waist band. I remember it well Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnd Posted December 31, 2010 Author Share Posted December 31, 2010 I think the North Wales car looked something like this apart from the lettering.... Shall we start a petition to Hornby for this version. Do you know the rest of the coaches required for the Cambrian Radio Cruise Coachman? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 Do you know the rest of the coaches required for the Cambrian Radio Cruise Coachman? Going off photos, the various land cruises changed their consist. The 'Welsh Chieftain' in 1960 had the Pullman Observaton Saloon on the rear of maroon Stanier coaches. The leading in the Up direction was a D1946 Open brake Third, D1999 Open Third, D1999 Open Third, D2195 ex-Sleeping Car then Ambulance coach converted at Eastleigh to Cafeteria Car, and I presume the remiang three vehicles were also open stock. The Down Cambrian Radio Cruise of the same year had a blood & custard brake coach off the wartime 'Coronation', a blood & custard ex-Midland Railway clerestory 'Royal' coach, a maroon1935 Stanier corridor brake third, a blood & custard LMS Period II open third, a blood & custard Stanier open third and a blood & custard ex-LNWR coach of some description. The latter must have been one of the last LNWR corridor coaches left in service and its a fair bet the MR clerestory was too by quite a big margin. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Scottish Modeller Posted December 31, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 31, 2010 Shall we start a petition to Hornby for this version. Do you know the rest of the coaches required for the Cambrian Radio Cruise Coachman? Hi all, A mix of internet and Dad's diary info.... Internet:- http://www.6g.nwrail.org.uk/welshmetals.html and http://www.nwrail.org.uk/nw1006c.htm Gives some info. Were there different North Wales Radio Tours? Notes from 1961 diary give some different information to the websites. Loco - STD4 Coaches - ex LMS open saloons with Mk1 Restaurant coach From the notes we joined the train at Chester after a run in a Standard 8 from Holmfirth, having set off the evening before. Don't remember much of that bit! I do remember more of the return car trip though - someone having to walk up to Holme Moss in front the car as the mist was that thick. Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 Some lovely photos of the land cruise; interestingly, nowhere does No 13 feature. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Scottish Modeller Posted December 31, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 31, 2010 Some lovely photos of the land cruise; interestingly, nowhere does No 13 feature. Here's one to get you started.... http://www.flickr.co...ill/2406906865/ No sooner do you find one... http://philhughesaintreeandbootlerailphotos.fotopic.net/p47333147.html Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 Superb shots, especially the one at the buffers on Platform 2. So they DO exist if you but search. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted January 1, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 1, 2011 See what you make of the opening sequence of Marsden Rail 32 (included in the taster available on Youtube).... B) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnd Posted January 1, 2011 Author Share Posted January 1, 2011 Going off photos, the various land cruises changed their consist. The 'Welsh Chieftain' in 1960 had the Pullman Observaton Saloon on the rear of maroon Stanier coaches. The leading in the Up direction was a D1946 Open brake Third, D1999 Open Third, D1999 Open Third, D2195 ex-Sleeping Car then Ambulance coach converted at Eastleigh to Cafeteria Car, and I presume the remiang three vehicles were also open stock. The Down Cambrian Radio Cruise of the same year had a blood & custard brake coach off the wartime 'Coronation', a blood & custard ex-Midland Railway clerestory 'Royal' coach, a maroon1935 Stanier corridor brake third, a blood & custard LMS Period II open third, a blood & custard Stanier open third and a blood & custard ex-LNWR coach of some description. The latter must have been one of the last LNWR corridor coaches left in service and its a fair bet the MR clerestory was too by quite a big margin. Great pics. Thx coachman, do you know if any of the coaches for the Cambrian Radio Cruise are available in any form ? Seems like the Observation car might not be needed but might like one anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted January 1, 2011 Share Posted January 1, 2011 See what you make of the opening sequence of Marsden Rail 32 (included in the taster available on Youtube).... B) Hey, well done!! I've seen a couple of pics of No 13 on this run, but this sequence CLEARLY shows No 14 (in Hornby's new production)! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaakko Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Mr. W. G. Rear's book "Caernarvon and the lines from Afonwen and Llanberis" (Foxline Publishing) gives two nice images in page 49 revealing the coach formation of North Wales Land Cruise train in Groeslon in 7th of July 1960. By the way, this is the maroon observation car 280M by OO Works: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Mr. W. G. Rear's book "Caernarvon and the lines from Afonwen and Llanberis" (Foxline Publishing) gives two nice images in page 49 revealing the coach formation of North Wales Land Cruise train in Groeslon in 7th of July 1960. By the way, this is the maroon observation car 280M by OO Works: It's a LOVELY model. Roderick produced one for me, with blue seats. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold papagolfjuliet Posted January 6, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6, 2011 Going off photos, the various land cruises changed their consist. The 'Welsh Chieftain' in 1960 had the Pullman Observaton Saloon on the rear of maroon Stanier coaches. The leading in the Up direction was a D1946 Open brake Third, D1999 Open Third, D1999 Open Third, D2195 ex-Sleeping Car then Ambulance coach converted at Eastleigh to Cafeteria Car, and I presume the remiang three vehicles were also open stock. The Down Cambrian Radio Cruise of the same year had a blood & custard brake coach off the wartime 'Coronation', a blood & custard ex-Midland Railway clerestory 'Royal' coach, a maroon1935 Stanier corridor brake third, a blood & custard LMS Period II open third, a blood & custard Stanier open third and a blood & custard ex-LNWR coach of some description. The latter must have been one of the last LNWR corridor coaches left in service and its a fair bet the MR clerestory was too by quite a big margin. Am I right in thinking that the LNWR coach in question was M15843M, now on the Bluebell? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibber25 Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Shall we start a petition to Hornby for this version. Do you know the rest of the coaches required for the Cambrian Radio Cruise Coachman? I asked, last year, about doing this livery as a limited edition and the answer was 'No'. It's likely to be in the range next year, I guess. CHRIS LEIGH Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 papagolfjuliet : Am I right in thinking that the LNWR coach in question was M15843M, now on the Bluebell? Yes. Car M15843M was sold to the Bluebell Railway in 1962 for preservation. It was officially a push pull coach, which might seem odd seeing as it was rarely part of a motor fitted train. This and the other two Saloons could be used as propelled route-learning vehicles. Only two were required for service, leaving one spare. Whilst in route-learning 'mode', one of the saloons was photographed at Blackpool! The 'Driving Gear' as such was portable and consisted of a simple lever for destroying the vacuum in case brakes needed to be applied in an emergency whilst being propelled. There was no regulator control and so messages were relayed to the fireman, who remained the on the loco footplate, via bell pushes. This portable gear could be plugged into either end of the LNWR saloon and was removed before the coach returned to normal service. As an aside, a modeller would find more use for an LNWR M50 Observation Saloon than a Deven Belle Observation Car.... Larry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 These have finally arrived!! I'll be MOST interested to see which tooling Hornby has used; it SHOULD be the same as the USA Flying Scotsman Tour set. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted October 2, 2011 Share Posted October 2, 2011 These have finally arrived!! I'll be MOST interested to see which tooling Hornby has used; it SHOULD be the same as the USA Flying Scotsman Tour set. It IS!! Once again another BIG HATS OFF to Hornby. This is an excellent model of a car I remember so well in Inverness in 1967. The livery lining is SPOT ON. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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