RMweb Gold tractionman Posted January 21, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 21, 2011 hi, I'm picking up on railway modelling after a break of some 25 years - I've (slightly) more money now than I had back then but (much) less time, so I have scaled back my plans from a loft layout to a one foot by four foot OO Midlands TMD, circa 1979! Yes, BR Blue diesels, an oily fuelling area, a modern shed building, urban setting, rather scruffy, etc etc... I know, there are a lot of them about - I guess it's an age thing for us 40-somethings - but it's small enough in size to allow me to work on it sociably at home, and if the big one ever happens it can be made to fit in as an add-on. Anyway, my question: I am about to secure my track to the board (finally!) and wanted to try and convey a fairly run down scene of partly buried sleepers, especially around the shed and sidings, and one thought I have had is to lay the (Peco code 100) track directly into Polyfilla, and then ballast this before it dries, then paint and weather. Is this is sensible plan, or will the Polyfilla clog my points and turn the whole thing into a right old mess? According to the B&Q web site their "Multi-Purpose Polyfilla mixes to a smooth, creamy consistency. Special binders give guaranteed adhesion and a fill which will not shrink or crack. It is the ideal versatile filler suitable for a variety of jobs, even large areas." So it sounds ok - but is it? Anyone tried it? Any advice most welcome! I've attached a pic to show folks the current state of play of what will become the scenic section - still a long way to go... but it's a start. Many thanks, Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HLT 0109 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Hi Keith. I'm far from an expert and I have not tried what you are suggesting but it seems like quite a difficult way to approach the problem. I have read about using polyfilla to represent paved areas (ie built up to the level of the top of the rails but leaving flangeways) but this would normally be done after fixing the track. If you did get any into the pointwork I think it would be very difficult to clear without lifting the point and it would dry quite quickly but perhaps you could lay everything else in the way you suggest(putting the points in place but not fixing them) and then "decorate" the points last. Adding ballast while the polyfilla is still wet seems complicated. You could use ballast without the polyfilla but I guess polyfilla is cheaper, and you might with a bit of artisitic skill get away with polyfilla only. You could however, fix the track in the way you suggest and add a thin layer of ballast after the polyfilla has dried by painting it with PVA glue and sprinkling the ballast on like scatter. Others may have better advice! Harold. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenny Emily Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 I would recommend against laying your track directly into Polyfilla, as it will gum up your points, and unless you fix your track by conventional means also, it will tend to crack back out of the Polyfilla. To represent infilled and grotty track I lay track normally, ballast with a thin layer of chippings, then paint over the top with thinned mixes of houshold emulsion in the right colours (mud brown and oily dark grey) a little sand sprinkled into the paint whilst wet gives a variety of textures. Keeping around the point blades free of paint is a must or you will be plagued with reliability issues at best and U/S points at worst. If you want to use Polyfilla to build up over the track, I recommend using a water based paint mixed in before applying so that the Polyfilla becomes an earth colour. That way chips won't show and you've got a decent coloured base to begin with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 21, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 21, 2011 A very long time ago I used Polyfilla in a loco shed area in order to build up the ground but I did it after I had laid the track. It was not an easy process smoothing and levelling the Polyfilla but the finished effect wasn't too bad after a fair bit of work including careful cleaning of flangeways. But I don't think I'd recommend it as various people's writings (including an article by Chris Nevard in 'Model Rail' not so long back) indicate to me that there are nowadays far better materials which are easier to work, and far cleaner to work with, apart from producing a better looking finish. So my advice is don't Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stuartp Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 I did something similar on my first layout. The track was fixed properly first though then ready mixed Polyfilla from a tube was squirted in between the sleepers. It was smoothed down with my fingers at first then with a damp sponge rinsed thoroughly after each pass, it settles just below sleeper level. You'll find it collects around the chairs though. Terrible pic taken when 0.5 megapixel cameras were still the white hot cutting edge of technology (siding on the right): However, I'd echo the comments that there are much easier ways of doing it - Das modelling clay for a start. If you go to RMweb2 and search for 'Catcott Burtle' I think that's what Chris Nevard used. Welcome to the forum by the way ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HLT 0109 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 However, I'd echo the comments that there are much easier ways of doing it - Das modelling clay for a start. If you go to RMweb2 and search for 'Catcott Burtle' I think that's what Chris Nevard used. Yes, I like DAS modelling clay and have recently used it at level crossings for the run-up of the road to the level of the track. I found it was easy to correct errors and, although it begins to dry quite quickly, it can easily be softened with a wet finger. I have also used it to face stone walls, scribing the stone courses when soft - but that's another story. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tractionman Posted January 22, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 22, 2011 Very many thanks to all of you who responded so quickly and so positively to my query over using Polyfilla. I'm glad I asked. The consensus seems to be "don't do it"! - so I'll try the other methods mentioned, such as the modelling clay. I've not used this before but I guess you have more control of where it ends up? It doesn't seem that expensive either, at least for the small size of my scenic areas. Good idea on blending in paint into the Polyfilla mix, too. So what I think I'll do is build up chippings/ballast around the sleepers, as suggested, using some modelling clay for areas where the sleepers need to be more deeply hidden, while in more open areas, say between sidings, go for the Polyfilla/paint mix to help give the ground some unevenness and provide hollows for puddles etc - keeping the Polyfilla well away from my points! Thanks for giving such friendly advice - I'm sure as I proceed with the layout there'll be more things I need help on, so it's good to know where to come. all the best, Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted January 22, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 22, 2011 Have a look at this one. It's in n rather than 4mm but does show what can be achieved. It's not quite polyfilla but near enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Nevard Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Modelling clay guys (Pollyfilla is no good, it's too much like ice cream) - Humbrol Air Clay - there's a parallel thread here... http://www.rmweb.co....er-ash-ballast/ And there are some snaps of some of the process here (towards bottom) http://www.nevardmedia5.fotopic.net/c1519687.html and here http://www.nevardmedia5.fotopic.net/c1761171.html (towards bottom) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Hale Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Hi, We used a thick Polyfilla mixture for our quarry layout- it was a terrible mistake - trying to control the mixture was like herding cats, it got into everything despite masking all the turnout blades, check rails etc. For the sake of your sanity try something more controllable- Chris Nevard's suggestion- is excellent or look back at Andy York's Keyhaven description- all good ideas and much neater. Keyhaven DesA Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Russ (mines a pint) Posted January 22, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 22, 2011 -try a non-model art/craft shop, and ask for 'non-firing clay' (sets by air alone). Its pretty much the same as DAS or Humbrol. Das was £3.99 last time I looked, the 'non-firing' clay which I bought from a craft shop was a fiver, but the 'lump' was about 3 or 4 times the size! useful for larger areas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertiedog Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 I have use a similar product to Polyfilla for buried tram track, Tetrion filler, the version with loaded filler fibre in it, I assume still made. It set far slower, and you could mix it to a good stiff clay thickness, allowing troweling on, and it was stiff enough to mould sets etc, and carve to represent stones etc. It did not crack, and it was laid in 1976, and is still in one piece , with the layout working. The track is held by the Tetrion, it was tacked into place with staples, which were buried in the covering, which also took stains and paints perfectly. It was also very cheap, and better on walls than Pollyfilla. Stephen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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