RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted November 7, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2011 Ian, if you liked that, take a peek at his first attempt. http://www.semgonlin...ld-park_01.html I really need a 48 hour day and no job to do all the things I'd like to. Apart from "Essex", the club modules, and the first seeds of a shunty-wunty plank, I've still got the station buildings waiting for something nice and Southern to do them justice. So why haven't you finished that layout with all those nice buildings of Sheffield Park then... that would be a quick project to do and i have a few bullied light pacifics to run on it when it is done? Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted November 7, 2011 Author Share Posted November 7, 2011 So why haven't you finished that layout with all those nice buildings of Sheffield Park then... that would be a quick project to do and i have a few bullied light pacifics to run on it when it is done? Ian Got it half way finished before we moved into this place. A winter in the old garage proved to be too much for the experimental baseboards. A few crappy-snaps here. http://s434.photobucket.com/albums/qq67/andrewcocker/layout%20construction/Older%20Layout%20photos/ These days I have enough trouble finding more than a few mins a week to work on the modules which are now a year over due. Essex has a tentative booking for 2013. The earliest I'd even look at rebuilding the Southern layout (still nameless btw) is 18 months from now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Williams Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Thanks Steve. I'll give them a try. I did experiment with the scrubbing pad but found I need to use oil based paint to get any colour to stick. Incidentally, that should be Starley not Staley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted November 7, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2011 Got it half way finished before we moved into this place. A winter in the old garage proved to be too much for the experimental baseboards. A few crappy-snaps here. http://s434.photobuc...ayout%20photos/ These days I have enough trouble finding more than a few mins a week to work on the modules which are now a year over due. Essex has a tentative booking for 2013. The earliest I'd even look at rebuilding the Southern layout (still nameless btw) is 18 months from now. which show is that... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted November 7, 2011 Author Share Posted November 7, 2011 which show is that... That would be the small one near Maidstone. Same one you gave your details to when we were at Moors Valley. Don't hold much hope for confirmation but at least its a date to work to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted November 14, 2011 Author Share Posted November 14, 2011 A bit of a request for some suggestions and feedback. I'm now starting to draw out the staging yard and the corner boards to make the whole layout into a 23' by 7' roundy, which was sort of the original intention. My problem is I can't really decide whether to put the turnouts on the straight boards which will allow for the layout to be viewed from 3 sides, or to put the backscene where the curve reaches 90 degrees and use the back side of the curve for the turnouts giving me a longer staging. However the longer staging will force a much tighter radius curve than I really want. On the other hand keeping the turnouts on the straight boards means a max train length of around 12'. This was just thrown together to give an idea what I'm wittering on about. The actual hope is to get 10 staging tracks, 5 from each of the 2 mainlines with one being connected to both east and westbound. The connection is needed to allow for the helpers to run back and forth on both lines. (See the main Essex module track plan at the beginning of this thread to see what I mean) As usual any thoughts, suggestions, etc most welcomed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gwinnett Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 What minimum radius are you aiming for? I'd say go for longer staging if you can, but its not my train set! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted November 14, 2011 Author Share Posted November 14, 2011 Jon, if I go for the shorter staging I can keep the minimum at 36". If I move the turnouts on to the corners the inside track to the innermost staging track comes down to 30". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gwinnett Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 I'm sure others with more experience will comment, but I think 30" on hidden track shouldn't be a problem unless you are tight for clearance between tracks - even big cars like autoracks should go round 30" without too much trouble. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted November 14, 2011 Author Share Posted November 14, 2011 Thanks again Jon. Psychic that you mentioned autoracks. One of the key elements of what I want to do operation-wise is to have helpers at the end of most trains. After all Essex is mostly a pusher station. Depending on how good or bad the operator is they are going to be either pulling or pushing at least 15 autoracks or 5 sets of 5-well intermodals around these curves. Perhaps I should just grab some track and the staple gun and play on the shed floor with some 30" curves to see if I can get away with it. BTW: I hope you are feeling better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gwinnett Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Good idea, and yes thanks I'm on the mend. I suppose if you cut to 8 staging tracks you could inch the radius out a bit - are 8 longer trains better than 10 shorter ones? If you have a play you'll get a feel for how much the extra length actually gives you - if its only 2 cars probably not worth it, if its 5 or more then it might be very attractive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 Its been a while but things are slowly progressing. I've broken construction down into 3 phases. 1: the original portable 23' by 7' roundy with staging. 2: interchangable modules that will allow the original to be stretched by either 4' or 8' 3: the semi-permanent shed based benchwork that will allow the phase 1 scenic boards to sit above the staging and complete a folded figure 8. All of the wood for the baseboard module frames has been cut with the ends being drilled and countersunk for the alignment dowels. I've made a drilling jig so that all the ends match up nicely. Rather than faff about later I decided to build all the portable frames in one shot. Originally I was just going to build the phase 1 configuration, but doing it this way means I'm more likely to get consistency with the construction. The first 9 frames. I'm short on dowels so the phase2 frames are still without. a pair of framing clamps keeps the frames square. everything is glued and screwed. Once all 17 frames (including the curved corner ones) are complete I'll start bulk producing the cross beams. These actually support the legs in a tab & slot fashion. (pics when I get one done) Doing it this way means any leg and any support can be used on any module. With a bit of luck I should have the phase 1 modules on legs and assembled in a week or so. For my next trick its off to Sheffield Insulation in Tonbridge for a large package ot Styrofoam SM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted April 12, 2012 Author Share Posted April 12, 2012 Well 3 months later and a lot of experimentation with track radius and putting the staging points on the curves. The good news is the minimum radius of 29" works just fine with pushing autoracks and well cars around. The bad news is I need to adjust the scenic curve to be more than 90 degrees before it reaches the hidden module with the points. That means breaking any compatibility with the club's existing modular standards. Here are the first 2 corner modules up. Since the pic I've got the first 4 staging boards up and 2 of the straight scenic boards. One of the things I've always hated about portable layouts is the faffing about when assembling or tearing down the layout. I've spent a lot of extra time and effort to ensure that this thing can be put up or torn down by one person in under an hour. no tools. all module joins are with EMGS dowels and handwheel bolts with T nuts. consistency. apart from 1 short leg on the dropped module all legs are interchangable. There are 2 lengths of leg strut. 1 for the straight boards and a longer one for the curves. Colour coded, They are attached with split pin hinges and long pins. No having to match numbers and letters to put the legs up. Extra leg slots. This allows for any board to become self supporting for working on or if bits of the layout are to be exhibited as a work in progress. sub-assembly. Each pair of corners is self supporting, as are the front scenic section and the staging. That means all 4 sections can be assembled at the same time without having to rely on piggybacked legs. It will also make siting the layout at an exhibition easier. all modules to be jumpered. No dangling wires or connectors. It doubles the number of plugs & sockets but makes life easier and reduces the risk of snagging. It also means that a module can by bypassed for troubleshooting. No crawling. Apart from accessing the operating well, all assembly / disassembly can be done standing up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted April 12, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 12, 2012 Andrew Good to see the progress. I like the idea of interchangeable legs. Also good is being able to put individual boards up by putting a set of legs on each end. I have done that with some of the newer layouts. Only thing about separate jumbers is if you forget to take them with you to a show (which I have seen done) and all the extra soldering. I now put hooks under the boards to take the dangling cables andnow I have installed small timber shelves which hold the plug under the board rather than it dangle - so far has generally worked well with just a few of these timber shelves needing slightly moving to catch the plug. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Tony_S Posted April 12, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 12, 2012 I've also modified the legs on the former Millarville modules to make single handed assembly easier. Modification was a hole to bolt the legs to the frame so they don't drop out as they are lifted. You mentioned something no longer being compatible with club modules. There now seems to be a lot of messages from other Thamesider module builders that include some reference to "adaptor" boards. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Do you have to be a member of the EMGS to order from their stores? Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted April 12, 2012 Author Share Posted April 12, 2012 Do you have to be a member of the EMGS to order from their stores? Best, Pete. Pete, I think you, do but one of the club members gets them in. You can also bulk order them from: http://www.johnburn.co.uk/product.php?grpId=308 (#70 pegs and plates) Ian, I'll take a shifty under your boards next Saturday to see for myself. I do like the idea of jumpering each module though. I kept my club jumpers in the same box as the dcc so If I forget them it wouldn't matter as the whole layout would be powerless. Soldering isn't an issue. I actually find it relaxing. That stems from my ancient telecom days. Then again most of the wiring jumpers will be RJ12 connectors, just crimp and go. Tony may have noticed the modules came with a spare set of power and Expressnet cables. Tony, adaptor boards have been talked about since before either of us joined. So far in the past 3 years only the Ma & Pa, Dan's pair, and one from Mike A have been added to the collective. All built to the spec so no adaptors needed. If I were to build adaptors for Essex it would leave a silly S bend on each end as the curve would start, then straighten out, then turn back to the 7" centering. It would also make the thing 32' long. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
warbonnetuk Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Do you have to be a member of the EMGS to order from their stores? Best, Pete. Pete C&L Finescale and Model Signal Engineering both do exact copies of the EMGS dowels 'over the counter' as it were http://www.finescale.org.uk/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=59 (Prod Code C1191) http://www.modelsignals.com/items_for_all_scales_frame.htm (Product Code 'BAD' half way down screen) Cheers Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted April 12, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 12, 2012 Andrew Good idea to keep the jumpers with the DCC! Yes Roundhouse has the timber shelves on it. These days the layouts have the Loconet wired into the D connectors (along with the rest of the iring)and after testing the looney all seems to run fine. So no extra RJ12 connections to be made bar the command station box to the layouts first board. See you a week on Saturday. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted November 16, 2012 Author Share Posted November 16, 2012 Right. I've been pretty crap at keeping this updated. The story so far..... All the module frames have been completed and test assembled. Track laying of the staging yards is about 50% complete as is the wiring of same. In the end I've gone with 10 storage tracks and one dedicated through road. In its short formation that will give me 13' long storage tracks. That extends to 21' when assembled fully. The through road is needed for the helper operations. Normal scenario will be: helpers run east from Essex (into the staging), run to the back of the train to be "helped". Train is dispatched westbound through Essex. Helpers uncouple in the staging and head back east or just return to Essex. Loads of fun. Hmmm, guess we need a couple of construction photos. These are all crappy snaps from the phone. First up is one of the 4 centre staging boards. These are all identical and in theory can be assembled in any order. I fear my crap track laying and carpentry mean this is only a theory. Why concrete sleepers I hear you ask? Well, I had 50 yards of the stuff from a project that was aborted when we left Canada. Track and around 40 Peco code 100 electrofrogs. That's cut the cost quite a bit. The scenic modules will all be code 83. The one wood sleeper track is the designated through line. First pair of centre modules being aligned. Gotta love pcb clad sleepers. With the staging alone I'll use nearly 300 of them. Before Roundhouse asks, the beer on the left is a Palm Royale. Wiring of the first staging end module. The ribbon cables will all be tied down and tidied up once I connect the frog polarity to each tortoise. Wiring is fairly straightforward. If its in a black cable, its a track bus. Inside rail is blue, outside is brown, green is for frogs (how appropriate) Red & black is for powering stationary decoders. 4 wire ribbon is for connecting tortoise to the stationary decoder, 6 wire ribbon is Loconet, and 8 wire ribbon is for low current module interconnection. Normally the 8 ribbon only carries a low current track power and aux power for the stationary decoders. Where needed it also takes any tortoise wiring, where the point is on a different module than the decoder. Track power is divided into 4 busses. 2 on the scenic section, 2 for the staging. Each with a breaker limiting it to 3 amps. The "MkII Digibox" This contains the command station/booster, second booster, Loconet & throttle panel, and all the connections I could ask for. Each 5 amp booster connects to the layout via a set of xlr sockets and cables. There's also a set of terminals for track power and programming track on the sides. This way I can clip onto a test track quickly. The small containers built into the lid house spare jumpers and a PS3 programmer. The whole thing is air cooled with a built in fan. Amazing what you can do with a £9 B&Q toolbox and a dremel tool. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talltim Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 I noticed that some of the freemo guys had similar toolboxes converted into dcc power/test units. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Yeah, I've done one, and so has Neil from our group - makes for a really easy setup, very user-friendly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 Yeah, I've done one, and so has Neil from our group - makes for a really easy setup, very user-friendly. I wish I could claim credit. The first one I saw was built by Chris Shinn from the Digitrax Yahoo group. The first one I built had the transformer inside. That's why I added the fan to cool things. This one is about 1 1/2 times the size and I've dumped the 110vac transformer for external "laptop" style regulated power supplies. That leaves a lot more space for storage. I did keep the fan since the new one has 2 boosters instead of the one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted November 19, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 19, 2012 Are you using both boosters for track or one for loconet etc? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewC Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 Are you using both boosters for track or one for loconet etc? A bit of both. Each booster will power 2 PM42 outputs. There will also be track signal from one of the boosters directly to the DS54s and DAC20s. That way i don't lose power to the stationary decoders if there is a short on the tracks. One of the limitations of using the older DS54 is that it can only get its commands from the track and not from Loconet. Loconet is powered separately through the jack on the UP5 panels. Since there will be a max of 20 devices attached to Loconet, that's more than adequate to prevent voltage problems. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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