60526 Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 Had a boys day out down the Bluebell today. Lovely place, it's still like a living museum with some of it's period locos and stock, although today we had Archie Sinclair and the Std 4 tank 80151 running the public trains, the E4 on a Pullman wedding special and the C class on an afternoon wedding special with the blood and custard Mk1's, and a grubby looking Mk1 green brake. Interesting though that the LNWR semi-royal saloon 806 is for sale. Who owns this? One of the volunteers believed that the price was around £65k? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Neal Ball Posted August 7, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 7, 2011 Apparently there are now "For Sale" signs on it. The (private) owner wants it to go to another railway. - News from the Bluebell Yahoo group Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60526 Posted August 9, 2011 Author Share Posted August 9, 2011 Thanks. I saw the for sale sign on it and you've confirmed that it is privately owned. I know the Bluebell did a fair bit of work on it when it arrived, but again it is one of those vehicles that really needs to be kept undercover, it was looking a bit tatty, perhaps the hire agreement had come to an end. They seem to have enough to be getting on with at the moment, I noticed that the Pullman Fingall was in the works and had all the panelling off of one side at least, and there is quite a list of other coaches on the west side of Horsted Keynes waiting for attention/rebuilding. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Neal Ball Posted August 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 9, 2011 Thanks. I saw the for sale sign on it and you've confirmed that it is privately owned. I know the Bluebell did a fair bit of work on it when it arrived, but again it is one of those vehicles that really needs to be kept undercover, it was looking a bit tatty, perhaps the hire agreement had come to an end. They seem to have enough to be getting on with at the moment, I noticed that the Pullman Fingall was in the works and had all the panelling off of one side at least, and there is quite a list of other coaches on the west side of Horsted Keynes waiting for attention/rebuilding. Last time I saw Fingall it was in a stripped down state - but will be back in the Golden Arrow set very soon. With regard to the LNWR saloon, I guess it just does not fit in any more. Ineviatebly the railway is all about carrying lots of people as efficiently as possible. Last time I saw it in service, it was on a special train when Princess Michael(?) was on the railway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 Is this the LNWR Diagram M50 saloon we are talking about here of the type that worked the Conway Valley and Llanberis branches? (And would look equally good on the Llangollen Branch.... ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camberwell Green Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 The vehicle for sale is the semi-royal saloon number 806 which came to the Bluebell about ten years ago and has seen intermittent use for mobile dining and static catering purposes. I can't imagine anyone letting go of the observation saloon in a hurry, it has one of the highest annual mileages of the carriage fleet. Incidentally the observation saloon is due for an overhaul soon, probably once Fingall is completed based on information in a recent Bluebell News magazine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 I would doubt if many Bluebell members would be too sorry to see the back of this vehicle. It doesn't fit in at all with the rest of the fleet and doesn't seat enough to make it viable as a revenue earner. I have never understood why this LNWR coach has been preserved when so many others that would be good earners have gone to the breakers. Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 Can anyone post a picture I wonder? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2mm Andy Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 Can anyone post a picture I wonder? Some information (and a photo) here. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Thanks Andy. That's a beautiful coach and should be in the NRM collection. However, seeing as it will probably be a private purchaser who will need to recover his outlay, i suggest the interior be rebuilt as a common open with tables. Sacrelege maybe but commercial considerations also play their part. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jol Wilkinson Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 I would doubt if many Bluebell members would be too sorry to see the back of this vehicle. It doesn't fit in at all with the rest of the fleet and doesn't seat enough to make it viable as a revenue earner. I have never understood why this LNWR coach has been preserved when so many others that would be good earners have gone to the breakers. Regards Hi David, too little of the LNWR has been preserved, especially locos. If seating capacity/ease of maintenance were the only criteria, we would lose many carriages that give a perspective on railway and social history. Jol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Hi David, too little of the LNWR has been preserved, especially locos. If seating capacity/ease of maintenance were the only criteria, we would lose many carriages that give a perspective on railway and social history. Jol Hello Jol, True, but most preserved carriages, by an overwhelming majority, are BR Mk1s particularly the TSO varients. I have always felt that there are far too few pre-nationalisation coaches preserved and even now preservation societies are scrapping coaching vehicles because they require too many man-hours to restore. But preservation itself isn't enough; it costs a fortune and many thousands of man-hours to restore one of these elderly coaches, and the bean-counters want their pound of flesh at the end of the day. It's a pity but there really isn't a place for this carriage at the Bluebell. I think it was once part of the NRM collection and even they didn't want it, because they could show the public all the appropriate lessons with their other vehicles and you might be surprised to see just how severe the interior of this coach actually is. It isn't what the customer expects in a luxury coach no matter how wonderful it looks from the outside. I don't know that there can be a good outcome for this coach. It cannot provide a good enough income for a preserved railway and there aren't enough LNWR or LMS coaches preserved for it to fit in with an existing train. Only the SVR has a full train of LMS coaches; only one preserved railway out of many tens! Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60526 Posted August 10, 2011 Author Share Posted August 10, 2011 I have volunteered down the Bluebell carriage works on a few occasions, but haven't been for quite some time. I found that the problem with volunteering and privately owned coaches is that if you are going to spend your free time on such a vehicle, you expect it to hang around the railway. I remember that the Bluebell had a Pullman coach which many volunteers worked on, it was run for 10 years and was then taken away, some were not amused. This Royal semi is an interesting coach, but it has many competing projects, all you have to do is look at the BBell website. They are currently fundraising to restore the Maunsell catering car they have. There is the Brighton Directors Saloon, needs a lot of money spending on it, but they already have the GN saloon and the LNWR observation coach. Of the higher level coaches I'd like to see the Pullman brake they have restored, but you could be talking of upwards towards £100k, I think that Fingall cost that when it was restored. At the moment the Stove R is acting as the brake coach in the Pullman set, the Pullman brown looks a bit faded on the east side, but it has turned a shade of green on the west side. Perhaps the effect of the sun? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium phil-b259 Posted August 10, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 10, 2011 IIRC the royal saloon came to the railway to fill the gap created by the departure of "Bertha" (the ex 6PUL trailer converted to steam operation) as did the NRMs "Eagle" when "Bertha"s 10 year running agrement came to an end and the owner wished to take it elseware. While the saloon had already had extensive work done on it by its owner, there were a number of below the solebar isues which the Bluebell had to sort out before it could be used in regular service and it remained in front line service on the "Golden Arrow dining train" untill car 64 (aka "Christine") came back from its last overhaul (capacity in the train being maintained due to the arival of car 76 aka "Lillan" before the overhaul started). Since then however the railway has strugled to find a use for it so its not that suprising the owner is looking for somewhere else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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