silverlink Posted October 14, 2012 Share Posted October 14, 2012 Having fitted many loco lamps to my steam stock fitted with the usual decoders (Lenz, TCS, Digitrax etc) when ajusting the lamp brightness I have found it a doddle. Just enter the forward & reverse lights cv drop the value to one I am happy with & thats it, takes around 30 secs. However I now have a steam loco which is fitted with lamps 1.5mm LED's + correct resisters & Loksound V4 decoder which I have no idea on how to ajust the brightness. Can anyone give me details on how to do it? Cheers Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John K Posted October 14, 2012 Share Posted October 14, 2012 Section 12 of the V4 manual covers it pretty well. www.esu.eu/en/downloads/instruction-manuals/digital-decoders/ Best, John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverlink Posted October 16, 2012 Author Share Posted October 16, 2012 Thanks to Dan at Olivias Trains, now have dimmable lamps. The CV's for altering are CV262 (forward) & CV270 (reverse) however you have to first set CV31 to 16 & CV32 to 0. Everything now working fine. Whilst checking out the CV's found the one to get rid of the horrible squeeling brake noise when slowing down! much better now without it. Cheers Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Thanks to Dan at Olivias Trains, now have dimmable lamps. The CV's for altering are CV262 (forward) & CV270 (reverse) however you have to first set CV31 to 16 & CV32 to 0. Everything now working fine. Whilst checking out the CV's found the one to get rid of the horrible squeeling brake noise when slowing down! much better now without it. Cheers Ian Ian, I'm curious. Did your brake 'fix' stop the braking sound completely, change the speed threshold at which brake squeal starts or reduce the sound volume to a more balanced level? Kind regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverlink Posted October 16, 2012 Author Share Posted October 16, 2012 Hi Paul, Found on page 71 of Loksound V4 manual that CV459 ajusts brake sound, you first have to set CV32 to 1 followed by ajusting the CV459 value to what you want within its 0 to 128 volume settings. I tried zero & then tried the loco on the track taking it up to a fast speed & then quickly back to stop with no squeal whats so ever, Hoorah!!! I hate that sqeal. cheers Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Hi Paul, Found on page 71 of Loksound V4 manual that CV459 ajusts brake sound, you first have to set CV32 to 1 followed by ajusting the CV459 value to what you want within its 0 to 128 volume settings. I tried zero & then tried the loco on the track taking it up to a fast speed & then quickly back to stop with no squeal whats so ever, Hoorah!!! I hate that sqeal. cheers Ian Ian, Thanks for the info. There are two questions about steam loco sounds I get asked more than any other - how to turn down (off?) the brake squeal and how to turn down (off?) the coal shovelling. Quite the reverse for diesel, though. 'How can I get the brake squeal louder'? and 'How can I make the flange squeal louder?'. What's important is the amount of control the end user has over such things and it's great that you have found and passed on this info. Kind regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverlink Posted October 17, 2012 Author Share Posted October 17, 2012 Paul, One of the best things about the V4 is many of the individual sounds can be accessed & ajusted. I wasn't sure if what I was doing would work but of course if it didn't I could always put it back to its original setting. If you go to the ESU websight you can download the insrtuction manual where I think somewhere around pages 69-74 it gives you many of the CV's & what they control sound wise. Of course they are for the standard Loksound sounds & not for British uploaded sounds. All you need to do is make a note of what each function number controls on your sound module look up the same number in the instructions where you will find the CV to alter it. I think you will, before ajusting the CV you may need to access CV 32 & I think it's 1 before you start changing the CV volumes. At the side of each sound there is a minimum and maximum level shown as well as the factory setting. Hope this helps. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Ian, Thanks again. I'm sure many people will benefit from your explanation. Kind regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigelcliffe Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 There is one caution to apply to Ian's observations. It assumes that the sound developer has used the standard LokSound pattern when developing their sound. Fortunately most do follow the standard pattern. The Loksound V4 decoder is arranged with a number of sound slots (up to 40). The sound slots can be used for any sound, and can be controlled by any combination of function keys (the control is incredibly flexible). Equally, any output (lights, etc) can be controlled by any combination of keys. But, with this flexibility comes a problem; as its not possible to directly query the content of the sound in a slot, the adjustment of a slot can be somewhat "hit and miss". So long as the sound developer stuck with the standard pattern described in the ESU manual, then the manual works and helps no end. If the developer deviated from this pattern, then its necessary to investigate which slot plays which sound before making changes. If the project deviates from the standard pattern then its not even possible to say that "because FnKey2 controls the sound it must be in Slot-X" nor possible to say "because its FnKey2, it must be CV-xyz". The complexity and flexibility is both breathtaking and frightening ! - Nigel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 There is one caution to apply to Ian's observations. It assumes that the sound developer has used the standard LokSound pattern when developing their sound. Fortunately most do follow the standard pattern. The Loksound V4 decoder is arranged with a number of sound slots (up to 40). The sound slots can be used for any sound, and can be controlled by any combination of function keys (the control is incredibly flexible). Equally, any output (lights, etc) can be controlled by any combination of keys. But, with this flexibility comes a problem; as its not possible to directly query the content of the sound in a slot, the adjustment of a slot can be somewhat "hit and miss". So long as the sound developer stuck with the standard pattern described in the ESU manual, then the manual works and helps no end. If the developer deviated from this pattern, then its necessary to investigate which slot plays which sound before making changes. If the project deviates from the standard pattern then its not even possible to say that "because FnKey2 controls the sound it must be in Slot-X" nor possible to say "because its FnKey2, it must be CV-xyz". The complexity and flexibility is both breathtaking and frightening ! - Nigel Nigel, So you are saying that it's not possible to 'audition' the sounds you wish to alter before doing so? Flying blind, so to speak? Well, that does rather put a different complexion on it. I'll stick to Zimo, then. As you know, I can change any individual sound level and listen to the result in real time as I make the adjustments by using the throttle control as a volume button. (Or by using your handy utility with DecoderPro). Are you going to Peterborough? I'll be there with my sound demo unit. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverlink Posted October 18, 2012 Author Share Posted October 18, 2012 Am I missing something here? when ajusting the sounds on my loco I already know how loud or soft they are and by entering the CV I am able to interigate it and see what level it is set at before making an ajustment. Once done I try out the loco with its new setting & if not happy go back into the CV and re-ajust to a higher or lower setting. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike J Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 I forgot to ask last night Ian, if the D11 has sound? I think what Nigel means is that the process is trial and error and that as there is no try out before setting the levels, you might have to repeat the process a few times before you get the setting to your own preferred level. Is there any way of hearing the sound before setting it? Forgive my ignorance, but you know how I am with anything to do with technology! See you tomorrow for the long trek to Peterborough. Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Am I missing something here? when ajusting the sounds on my loco I already know how loud or soft they are and by entering the CV I am able to interigate it and see what level it is set at before making an ajustment. Once done I try out the loco with its new setting & if not happy go back into the CV and re-ajust to a higher or lower setting. Ian Hi Ian, Where and how you find the sounds is quiet different between these types, as Nigel and my response to him has already highlighted, they can potentially be anywhere within a Lok v4.0 project. On the other hand, with Zimo, there is no need to know which sound slot the author has used as you simply adjust whatever sound has been allocated to any given F key.(or automatic or random generated sounds or external switches). For example, say the coal shovelling sound is on F6. You think it's too loud, too quiet or you would rather have something else allocated to F6. After setting CV300with the appropriate value - in this case 6 - the throttle lever, slider, knob or buttons actually adjusts the volume of the sound allocated to F6 (coal shovelling) whilst it is playing. That's why I used the phrase 'listen in real time'. The 'mode' set by CV 300 allows not only the volume setting of the sound on the specified F key to be adjusted, but also to remove sound altogether fom that F Key, or substitue any other sound from memory. On my A3 project, there are more sounds loaded onto the decoder than there are F keys available to play them. The project includes the Chime whistle fitted for Flying Scotsman's American adventures and a crossing bell. These are inappropriate for any other A3 or 4472 in the UK so they are unallocated by default, hidden if you like. Using the above method anyone with a DCC controller, by definition anyone using DCC Sound, can remove one of the (several) standard whistles and allocate the Chime whistle to that F key, and remove any other sound to substitute the crossing bell. By the same token, you can reverse these changes as often as you wish. You could also, witthout needing to be reprogrammed, Allocate one or other to one of three external switches even if they are not allocated to an F key at all. So, a magnet by the track and a reed switch on board would trigger say a whistle before a crossing or tunnel,or flange squeal at crossovers and tight turns. The main difference, therefore, is that Zimo does not use CVs to make these adjustments, it utilises the controller's throttle mechanism like a volume button, so its done 'by ear'. I am not suggesting one method is better than the other, but I have my own views on relative convenience. (I also prefer Zimo's rather more modest £72 per decoder, ha ha). But I was genuinely interested in your experience with Lok V4.0 and will incorporate that into any advice I give at my sound clinics. Thank you again. Kind regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 I forgot to ask last night Ian, if the D11 has sound? I think what Nigel means is that the process is trial and error and that as there is no try out before setting the levels, you might have to repeat the process a few times before you get the setting to your own preferred level. Is there any way of hearing the sound before setting it? Forgive my ignorance, but you know how I am with anything to do with technology! See you tomorrow for the long trek to Peterborough. Mike Mike, Ian, I've just noticed you are attending the Peterborough show (with a layout?). If you get chance, come and have a chat. I'd be interested to hear the loco you are refering to if you can bring it along. What type is it? Kind regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigelcliffe Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Trying to clarify what is a very complex decoder. If you know the sound slot (or the sound developer stuck to the ESU standard pattern), then you can make an ops-mode change to an ESU Loksound V4 with one CV change. This is probably about "on par" with Zimo's pseudo programming method for ease of use and rapid auditioning of the impact - I could argue either way as to which was better/worse. But, if the sound is not in a known slot, then things get very complicated and it is a fairly long winded process to work out how the sounds were allocated in the project (unless you have the project source files, then its trivial with the LokProgrammer software, don't need the LokProgrammer hardware to work out the structure of the project). I've a long and technical set of notes on how ESU v4 CV's work. I wrote it for myself before the current version of the manual came out by working out what the LokProgrammer did to things. If someone wants a copy, contact me. But only ask if you're already confident about most of the ESU decoder manual because otherwise its a waste of everyones time sending it around. - Nigel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike J Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Mike, Ian, I've just noticed you are attending the Peterborough show (with a layout?). If you get chance, come and have a chat. I'd be interested to hear the loco you are refering to if you can bring it along. What type is it? Kind regards, Paul Hi Paul, We are there with Ian's "Haymarket Cross" layout and with over 80 locos we should have the one in question with us! Hope to see you there, Cheers, Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev T Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Trying to clarify what is a very complex decoder. If you know the sound slot (or the sound developer stuck to the ESU standard pattern), then you can make an ops-mode change to an ESU Loksound V4 with one CV change. This is probably about "on par" with Zimo's pseudo programming method for ease of use and rapid auditioning of the impact - I could argue either way as to which was better/worse. But, if the sound is not in a known slot, then things get very complicated and it is a fairly long winded process to work out how the sounds were allocated in the project (unless you have the project source files, then its trivial with the LokProgrammer software, don't need the LokProgrammer hardware to work out the structure of the project). I've a long and technical set of notes on how ESU v4 CV's work. I wrote it for myself before the current version of the manual came out by working out what the LokProgrammer did to things. If someone wants a copy, contact me. But only ask if you're already confident about most of the ESU decoder manual because otherwise its a waste of everyones time sending it around. - Nigel Nigel I've just bought a Lokprogrammer and I'm trying to get my head around it. There's a lot of complexity in there if you dig even a little. I'd appreciate a copy of your notes please. I'm exhibiting with HasselHarbour Bridge at Peterborough so I could collect if you've one to spare. regards Kev Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Hi Paul, We are there with Ian's "Haymarket Cross" layout and with over 80 locos we should have the one in question with us! Hope to see you there, Cheers, Mike Mike, Great, but which type? A4 perhaps? I only ask so that I can be bring a Zimo version of the same loco (if I have one) and they can go 'head to head'. Kind regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike J Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Mike, Great, but which type? A4 perhaps? I only ask so that I can be bring a Zimo version of the same loco (if I have one) and they can go 'head to head'. Kind regards, Paul Hi Paul, Locomotives on the layout this weekend will be classes A1, A2, A3, A4, B1, V2, L1, D11, standard tanks, Deltics, class 40s, and a few more. See here for a peak at Haymarket Cross. . I can't tell which loco Ian was referring to in the OP. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Hi Paul, Locomotives on the layout this weekend will be classes A1, A2, A3, A4, B1, V2, L1, D11, standard tanks, Deltics, class 40s, and a few more. See here for a peak at Haymarket Cross. . I can't tell which loco Ian was referring to in the OP. Hi Mike, OK, I can cover 4 of those. See you tomorrow. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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