Coal train routes and locomotive changing

[tingleytim]

I am compiling captions for pictures I took at Guide bridge in 1967 that show a mixture of electric and steam power on mineral trains heading through the station, presumably between the Yorkshire coalfield and north-western power stations.  Did they all go to Fiddlers’ Ferry or were there other destinations?  Can anyone help with the routes that these trains took around Manchester and Lancashire/Cheshire and where locomotive changes were made?  Some trains headed to/from Stockport behind steam whilst others came to/from the main line via Fairfield behind steam or electric.  Did some take the Fallowfield route at Fairfield?  Would an eastbound 8F have been replaced at the sidings at Dukinfield which show up on my 1983 OS map?

All help greatly appreciated.

Tim.

[Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71]

Hi Tim,

 

Quoting from LM Region Section U Conditional WTT, May to October 1974 and LM Region Section R Mandatory WTT, May 1971 to April 1972.

 

Much west bound traffic travelled via the Cheshire Lines off the Manchester, Sheffield & Wath DC route. Mottram yard was a common power change point to diesel locos....then via Apethorne jnc, Woodley jnc, Cheadle Heath, Northenden, Skelton jnc and Lymm to Warrington and Fidlers Ferry PS. Under normal circumstances the Fidlers services would not therefore be routed via Guide Bridge.

 

Diesel hauled mineral services routed via Diggle and Stalybridge are candidates to run via Guide Bridge and Stockport....Healey Mills to Oakleigh trains being one example.

 

Wath to Glazebrook services would have passed through Guide Bridge before heading through Fairfield to take the Fallowfield route past Reddish depot towards Levenshulme and Trafford Park. The power change point is shown as Godley for these services. 

 

Mansfield to Garston, Toton to Edge Hill or Garston and Wath to Birkenhead workings are shown over the MSW too with a power change at Godley...then via the same route as the Fidlers traffic. 

 

There are Wath yard to Ashburys yard services with no power change point indicated...these are likely to have been 76s throughout. 

 

Wath yard to Dewsnap yard (Guide Bridge) workings are also shown with no power change point and are likely to have been 76s throughout.

 

Similarly, there is a Tinsley yard to Ashburys working with no indicated power change point which is also likely to have passed through Guide Bridge behind 76s.

 

Agecroft colliery supplied Fidlers with coal and these trains ran via Ashton Moss, Denton jnc, Stockport and Northenden.  

 

There are some pictures on this thread   http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/56808-the-clc-through-stockport/

 

Google Stewart Blencowe of Gloucester...he'll fix you up with the WTTs of your choice for pinning down the details which you seek.

 

Cheers

 

Dave

[woodenhead]

In the early 60s most westbound electric freights operating via the Fallowfield loop line changed traction at Hyde Rd, others changed at Ashton Junction leaving Godley Junction for any other freight traffic routed elsewhere.

 

I don't have a record of how the eastbound return workings altered traction.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

As Fiddlers Ferry didn't come into full operation until 1973 (according to WIKI), then that wouldn't have been the destination for your 1967 coal trains.

 

Peter

[Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71]

Peter,

 

The power station was receiving coal in other than MGR wagons before that.

 

Dave

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Peter,

 

The power station was receiving coal in other than MGR wagons before that.

 

Dave

Thanks Dave. So was there another power station on that site before the large baseload one was built in the early 1970s?

[Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71]

Peter,

 

The Railway Magazine for June 1970 reports stockpiling of coal at Fidlers Ferry, in anticipation of the opening of the new power station. I've also seen pictures of non-MGR coal trains being worked into the brand new power station around this time. No knowledge of any other power station on this site previously. 

 

Dave

[Fat Controller]

Might a lot of the coal traffic have been destined for Carrington/Partington power station, trains for which would have followed the same route (via Northenden)as those for Fiddler's Ferry?

[Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71]

Mornin' Brian,

 

Could that have been the coal initially destined for Glazebrook? Maybe there was an alteration in traffic patterns when the new Fidlers PS opened.

 

Dave

[Fat Controller]

Mornin' Brian,

 

Could that have been the coal initially destined for Glazebrook? Maybe there was an alteration in traffic patterns when the new Fidlers PS opened.

 

Dave

It may have been, Dave- Carrington was on the other side of the MSC to Glazebrook. Another possibility might have been coking coal for Irlam, Dallam or Shotton, or export coal for Garston.

[Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71]

Brian,

 

The Glazebrook to Partington rail bridge over the MSC must have been open at this time because some of the Glazebrook coal/coke trains off of the MSW are routed that way in the WTT.

 

Closer inspection of the 1974 Conditional WTT shows 'empties' for Rotherwood being worked away from Partington jnc via Northenden and Cheadle Heath towards the MSW. No specific mention is made of the Power station but these would seem to be the most likely to be Carrington PS workings. The Glazebrook coal/coke traffic seemingly just for the steelworks there.

 

Dave

[Peter Kazmierczak]

The Winter 1970/71 WTT shows paths for Cl.6 air-braked trains to Fiddlers Ferry from Wath Exchange via Woodhead at the following times:

02.50, 04.50, 06.42, 08.31, 10.46, 12.40, 14.46, 16.46

 

All could start from either Wombwell or Barnsley Jn (Penistone) when required.

 

Most were shown as suspended, so in anticipation of new flows to Fiddlers Ferry (or as Dave suggests, coal stockpiling prior to commissioning of the power station).

[Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71]

Peter,

 

The full operation that you referred to above is probably the MGR operation of the Power Station starting in 1973.

 

Cheers

 

Dave

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Dave,

Another (more official) website gives 1971 as when generation of electricity began at FF power station.

[tingleytim]

Thanks for all responses to my original post.  Sounds like a lot of Woodhead coal traffic would have turned off at Godley and gone through Stockport Tiviot Dale, missing Guide Bridge. (Have now appreciated the previous importance of routes which I cycled on a couple of years ago when doing the Trans Pennine Trail.)  The trains I saw taking the Stockport line at Guide Bridge could have been going via Edgeley and Northenden to Carrington power station, or to the several other possible destinations mentioned.  Thanks for pointing out that Fiddlers Ferry was not opened for another four years - in 1971.  I will resist trying to be too specific in the photo captions.

Tim.