RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted December 6, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 6, 2013 Hi all Could I beg advice from those with greater experience of various DCC systems than me please? When I took Abbotswood Junction - with our ECoS system - to the recent 85A Open Day I was approached by a very pleasant gentleman and asked to help with his DCC issues In summary he has invested significant cash in 5 O gauge sound fitted steam locos - awesome models - but has struggled to run them. He has NCC powercab but only 1 loco - with an older non railcom chip - will run with this system. The other 4 generate an immediate short circuit when placed on the track However with my ECoS no problems - railcom chips immediately detected and no short circuits. Seems the Powercab didn't like Railcom - is that a common experience? Additionally for someone in advanced years there are a lot of buttons to push on Powercab which aint easy! bear in mind that all is required is the ability to trundle a sound loco up and down a few metres of test track, no need for accessory control . A spec would be - Easy use Works with Railcom Few buttons as possible to push Sufficient power for 2 or 3 locos Ideally up to £300 Any advice please folks? Would like to get him sorted ASAP Cheers Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnb Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Just a thought, maybe it's that the Powercab is not powerful enough, it is only rated at 2amp max. 'O' Sound locos can take considerably more than that. What is the rating of your ECoS? I'm a Powercab user myself but only on 'OO' and for small layouts with only a couple of locos and it's fine. I very rarely get the Powercab to even register 1amp. Sorry but can't help with alternatives. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted December 6, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 6, 2013 Hi John ECoS is 4 amps - did have that thought myself Could suggest he gets a booster - will investigate Many thanks Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil S Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Although the current limit is probably the most likely reason - the 2A is probably totally inadequate for actually 'running' more than 1 of the 0 gauge sound locos - possibly even simply having them on the track - with their sound on .... but there might be simply an 'initial' problem of the sudden current draw whenever power is applied or re-applied to the track ... due to the capacitors usually found on sound decoders ! If you have the opportunity to try a PSX inbetween his exisiting Controller and the track, it may moderate the start up current sufficiently to allow 2 or more locos to be on the track ... but the 4A solution is likely ro be the best - and even that might benefit from the PSX - which provides 'intelligent' control of start-up surges, and can be configured to different current settings suited to differing scales. Search on the web to find various suppliers and more product information. A Roco Multimaus System can be bought for anything from 60GBP - to 120GBP on Ebay when split from sets; and used to include a 4A transformer and 3.5A Power Stage 'Amplifier' for the track dcc output [but current digital starter sets often include a lower rating Plug-Top SMPS - However; a standard 18V 3.5A-4A 'computer' SMPS 'brick' can be bought quite cheaply and used instead - which is what I recommend anyway instead of the 'traditional' transformer]. We use thes for multiple 'small' LGB G-Scale locos without problem indoors - where the layout is flat. So 0 Gauge shouldn't be a problem. A 'style' decision needs to be made between 'Console' style - as with the ESU ECoS - or 'Walkabout' as with the Roco Multimaus etc .... or perhaps using a Smart Phone as add-on Wireless controller with some base stations. For 300GBP you could get the Wireless Version MultimausPro and MultiCentralePro or the new Z21 ...for smartphones Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted December 8, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 8, 2013 Thanks for those thoughts Phil I think a win win might be emerging here Brian likes the look of my ECoS - wireless and smart phones are not of any import in his application - particularly as railcom works well and he hasn't got to worry about programming with that and we know it has sufficient grunt for the 0 gauge sound locos. So the win win may be for me to sell him my black and white ECoS and upgrade Abbotswood to the new colour version. Means reprogramming for me but was contemplating that anyway as not sure that the way I have done it originally is easy enough for the plethora of helpers we now have - and current set up wont allow for phase 2 either - more loops and routes Cheers Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
corax67 Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 I would add my vote to that of Phil in suggesting a Roco Multimaus set. I am a Lenz owner of many years and it sees service on a lot of layouts other than my own, N through to O, which I love and would recommend without hesitation but you point out that multiple buttons are not preferred in this case so I wouldn't recommend it in this instance. However I do have 2 Multimaus sets (amongst other systems) as backups and additional throttles for the Lenz and they are a joy to use - plenty powerful enough for an O sound layout, which they have run in the past, simple to operate with few buttons + a nice big centre-off rotary knob for speed control. The value for money on this product is great too if you can find one on eBay split from a set or buy a full set & sell on the loco and extras on eBay whereas the ECoS, as lovely as it is, is a lot more expensive and may be a bit of overkill of a simple layout. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 For the ultimate in power at 5 amps, the Digitrax command station is the choice for power consumption. I do believe the NCE has a power upgrade option but it is not cheap or apparently readily available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil S Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 There are several options from various manufacturers of 5A boosters which will work with any DCC system: eg Hornby, Bachmann - which has adjustable settings for N to G Scale This method has the 'advantage' of 'reusing' a 'low-current starter-set' - by using it for the Accessory Bus (control only, with power from 16Vac to decoders), and the booster for the Track Bus. Upto 4 Roco Multimaus Amplifiers (3.2-3.5A max) can also be used as Boosters [with 1 Amplifier/Multimaus as Master] - without either internal modification or requiring anything other than an off-the-shelf parallelling RG connector - in this way, particiularly the H0 / HOe /TT /N continental modelller seeking Roco/Fleischmann has a very cost effective entry method via Digital Start sets in which nothing need be wasted or sold on. - But I make great use of them for our 00 loft layout ( 3 boosters), and H0 and G Scale Portable layouts. More Power is available (at a price) from Massoth - better known for use with G Scale, but adustable down in voltage and current limits if desired... from 12A. 8A or less. DO NOT FORGET: that when a HIGHER CURRENT Central Unit or Booster is used: the basic wiring bus needs to be able to handle the extra current: both the FULL current continuously (no fault condition) and then to TRIP (by having a low enough impedance) when SHORT CIRCUIT occurs at ANY part of the layout [unless furhter protected by local PSX or similar breakers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modelling Martin Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 With my layout i use NCE power cab system. When running multiple engines with sound on 00 they would sometimes cut out and stop or jerk. To solve this i bought a cheap second hand laptop charger off ebay and now it works fine although I'm not sure whether this would work in your case, Gary Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted December 15, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 15, 2013 Going to give Brian another tutorial on ECoS this week then its up to him I think Its a colour ECoS for us any way I think - does any one have any idea what I should value my second hand B&W ECoS at? Thanks for all the help and advice - the big plus with ECoS for an elderly gentleman has to be the lack of button pushing with railcom chips Cheers Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibushe Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Post your price for the ECoS, you never someone may buy it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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