Beatty 139 Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Hi, I have been looking To build some CR stock for a while to run with one of my dads CR 439 class that he has almost finished. I came across an article from Model railways from May 1975 bit since looking I have also found some very detailed period drawings from the Railway Enginner for the same, I presume they are early in the bulid because they are for 11' 7 1/2" high and have 2'2" wide doors to the first class compartments. The specific coach drawn is a brake comp where the brake is in the centre, also a special family saloon, all the detail is there as needed for a Gauge 1 model but I would also like some others to make a typical set up, so I am looking to where I can find drawings of the other types, history etc. These are well out of my modelling comfort zone of the Midland and North Eastern so all help in pointing me in the right direction will be appreciated. Thanks Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Alder Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Hi, I would look in the first place -here- or -here- , which might be of use. HTH Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beatty 139 Posted October 4, 2014 Author Share Posted October 4, 2014 Many thanks, are the reproduction diagram books still available? I noticed they were mentioned in the various posts but couldn't see any reference to any CRA publications on their web site. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Alder Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Afraid most matters Caley are a mystery to me, but Londontram has a good knowledge of these things, and I am sure will help you out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wheatley Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Still available, scroll down a bit and you'll find 'Diagrams of Carriages' (A5) and 'LMS Carriage Diagram Book' (A4). http://www.crassoc.org.uk/cra/node/22 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flubrush Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 You want to beg, borrow or steal a copy of "The True Line" No. 38 (the magazine of the Caledonian Railway Association) where the late Duncan Burton had an article on the 45ft stock with drawings of all the types. The scale of the drawings is a bit peculiar - about 5mm:ft to fit the page no doubt - but the drawings are well dimensioned with a good scale, so re-drawing or copying accurately to a known scale should be fairly straightforward. Also, if you can hold your breath, Mike Williams is bringing out a book on Caledonian coaches - probably some time next year, and that book will surely have details of these coaches which were one of the most numerous types in use. As far as I knowm there are no drawings of the 45ft stock available in the NRM archive. There are some of the 48ft stock which is very similar - i.e. the compartment details are the same but at wider pitch and there are two widths of 8' 0" and 8' 6". The larger LMS diagram book is probably the best one to get for modelling purposes since it gives well drawn floor plans of all the vehicles with the main dimensions shown, and also has fairly good drawings of end views. It also has a list of all numbers of all coaches and also quotes the St.Rollox order numbers for some which can be handy when searching archives like the NRM. The smaller diagram book has only representational drawings and not so much other information. But it is worth having both if only for reference purposes since the diagram numbers for all coach types bar one are different in the two books!!! Jim. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Hello Andy Ben Alders right its worth having a good look through the Caley forum as there's articles scattered all over the site If you send me an email by pm I can send you a few bits and pieces that might help. Apart from the dimensions there's only plans for the 6 wheelers but working with pictures its not hard to work out the panel style but be careful when looking at these plans as some are for ex WCJS coaches The West Coach joint stock was a joint venture between the LNWR and the Caledonian to have a shared coach for the London Scotland trains so the passengers wouldn't have to change trains at Carlisle, these coaches were built by the LNWR at Wolverrhampton in there distinct LNWR style of paneling and underframes where as Caledonian coaches were built in the general Drummond style. To keep abreast with technical advances and to keep the stock looking modern these coaches were only used for this service for a short while some time only ten to fifteen years and were then while still fairly new and in tip top condition were shared out between the two company's and used on lesser local services. As a rule Caledonian 6 wheel coaches were mostly 35ft and ex WCJS 6 wheel coaches were 32ft so looking at the plans its possible to work out which was which. Most WCJC in Caledonian use had the centers luggage compartments converted to guards compartments but as always there was exceptions. First generation Caledonian bogie coaches were 45ft later as Jim has said built to 48ft these are coaches from the period 1885 to about 1905 and lasted in service until the late 1920s early 1930s. like the 6 wheelers these were mostly Gas lite. I can send you some side on plans for these but you will need to rescale them. Next came the 8 wheel bogie 57ft coaches which along with the 65ft 12 wheel "Grampian stock" became the main Caledonian coach into and through the grouping some lasting into BR days. From the grouping standard LMS stock quickly made inroads into Caley coaching stock. I can send you some information on these too but if its to pull behind a 439 class 6 wheel and 45ft bogie coaches would most likely look the best. As with the six wheelers ex WCJS bogie coaches would have been mixed in with Caledonian coaches at all time. Looking at the panel size and layout of the 45ft coaches its easy to work out how the 6 wheelers looked which were for all intense and purposes just shorter versions. In the pre war period its very common to see 6 wheel and bogie stock in mixed rakes. One anomaly was the Balerno 4 wheel stock being some of the last 4 wheel passenger carrying stock built for main line use in the UK. Built as late as the early 1920s for the sharp curves on the Edinborough Balerno branch. As I say pm me an email and I can send you some stuff. Regards Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beatty 139 Posted October 5, 2014 Author Share Posted October 5, 2014 Many thanks for that gents, the period drawings I have cover most of the detailed construction and even include interior details but they are for just the two types of 45' one being a special family saloon, but I hope armed with that information and detail the rest can soon be worked out for the more common types to make an approprate set up. I will post as I make progress with them, but for the first I am tempted to build one in laminated Rowmak from laser cut sections, if that does not work out I will go back to laminating them out of cut layers of ply. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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