For those who dislike Yodel

[Ian Kirk]

Hi,

When I had my little factory in the village of St Monans the local buses, Alexanders Fife, had a very reliable parcels service. The bus stop was next to the local garage and the owner was the agent. You could leave or collect parcels at the filling station office. He was often his own best customer as the spare parts he needed for car repairs could be put on the bus in Kirkcaldy (20 miles away) and be with him in an hour or so.

In those days we also had British Rail's Red Star parcel service.  Getting small quantities of plastic material has always been a problem for a small business like mine and for a time I got supplies from a firm called Napex in London.  They used to drive two or three bags of material to Kings Cross in time for a morning train and phone me. I then drove in to Kirkcaldy to meet the Aberdeen train that arrived just before the red star office closed at 6. An expensive way to get material but the alternative was to order by the tonne.   Only once had a problem when I collected one bag, a leaking half bag and an empty bag with a label on. There must have been a colourful carpet of plastic granules on the floor of a Brake compartment somewhere. IIRC red Star were very good about paying for the lost material. Napex then went on to double bag the material, putting the sack of plastic into another heavy gauge plastic bag. These had been part of an order for fertiliser bags and had "Ammonium Nitrate" printed on them no problem and it stopped  leakage in transit.  The Red Star cost was almost as much as the cost of the material so one Summer I thought I could save money by collecting some on my way back from holiday. Thirty odd years ago you could still contemplate driving through London.  I had a Talbot Alpine at the time, one of the first hatchbacks, and I folded up the back seats and loaded up with plastic at Napex. We had friends who had recently moved to London and we stopped off for tea at their house in Finsbury Park. Just before we were due to leave I noticed a bit of commotion in the street outside and found my car surrounded by police. Ammonium Nitrate was apparently the main ingredient of IRA home made explosive. Had to talk my way out of that.

 

best wishes,

 

Ian

[Classsix T]

Over in Eastern Counties lands (Cambs/Norfolk/Suffolk) we used to have this:

 

20_08_01_0002_AAH735J..jpg

 

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Used to be able to send your parcels anywhere that ECOC ran buses. A bit strange when you think about it really, a nationalised bus company competing with a nationalised Royal Mail, in the days when competion was taboo.

 

Even stranger thing, in those days, we had bus routes that went everywhere. Not any more. We have Grumpy Old Git bus passes to use on non-existent buses now though!

The bus was delivered in that livery and I believe lasted all its service life in the livery.

 

Stewart

HA! It's a do not bendy bus!

 

I shall shew them to my owd chap, see if 'e can recall such. Ta.

 

C6T.

[SM42]

I love the way that these companies always want 'the Government' to sort out the problems of their own making! It's simple, if you want a skilled workforce, put your hand in your pocket and train them. Oh, and treat them well - that way you'll hang on to them.

 

Unfortunatley, according to a recent report I saw in Mrs SM42's paper, this isn't likely to happen. 

 

It seems that  the self employed van owner/ driver is used deliver to an area and is paid per item delivered around 50p and 0p for a failed delivery and no guarantee of work .

 

Out of this the driver has to pay fuel, national insurance, van insurance and all the other costs of being self employed.

 

Is it any wonder that that in some cases  doors go unknocked and parcels get left in bizarre places. Maybe enough owner/drivers just can't see the point of even bothering with multli drop parcels work (just at the time when these companies need all the help they can get to meet the promises they make,) to cause the problems we see now

 

The problems are created by the companies themselves and their need to keep cost down to the bare minimum to compete and no amount of government backed training in driving LG / HG vehicles will make the slightest difference in this sector.

 

Say what you want about the Post Office / Royal Mail but they tend to have the capacity to cope and seem to have worked out how to take on casual staff when they need to and expect it to be busy in the run up to Christmas.

 

This is one reason why I prefer to use shops if I can at this time of year..

 

Andy

[johnarcher]

Absolutely, a friend of mine used to do that van delivery work. If he had done extravagant things like sticking to speed limits or taking care over deliveries he'd have completed so few as to be working for nothing.

Probably something to do with what they called 'market forces' which were going to ensure that everything worked really efficiently.

[37114]

I love the way that these companies always want 'the Government' to sort out the problems of their own making! It's simple, if you want a skilled workforce, put your hand in your pocket and train them. Oh, and treat them well - that way you'll hang on to them.

 

Which is what most of the larger logisitics companies are having to do and do it quickly. The recession masked the issue which has been bubbling away since the mid 2000's, the exit from the recession, reduction in unemployment and the Driver CPC's have brought the issue back with a vegenance. The problem is nobody wants to pay for it, the logistics companies on peppercorn margins can't afford to absorb the cost so need to pass it on to their customers who are also getting squeezed financially. We the consumer need to accept we will have to pay more for delivery or look at using alternatives such as click and collect as the current demand of parcel delivery is not environmentally or financially sustainable.

 

I hate Yodel for many reasons but to give them their due my Hattons parcel ordered over the weekend arrived on Tuesday which was when I was expecting it so can't knock them on this occasion. I would also say Yodel are one of the cheapest out there, retailers know this and as a number of retaillers subsidise delivery costs within product price then the cheaper the delivery, the more margin for the retailer, hence why they are so popular.

[Joseph_Pestell]

With some of the courrier firms, the self-employed drivers can earn very good money - although they work hard for it! Yodel seem to operate a slightly different model and I am not convinced that it works. DPD has a mix of employed and self-employed drivers and that seems to work well as there is a reserve of experienced drivers to cover for any sudden absences.

 

I think though that Yodel's main problem currently is not the drivers but an inadequate depot network relative to the rapidly increasing volume of parcels that they are doing (partly through undercutting other firms).

 

We had a Yodel delivery today (on time). I asked the driver if all is now sorted and he says that it is still fairly chaotic.

[Pugsley]

Which is what most of the larger logisitics companies are having to do and do it quickly. The recession masked the issue which has been bubbling away since the mid 2000's, the exit from the recession, reduction in unemployment and the Driver CPC's have brought the issue back with a vegenance. The problem is nobody wants to pay for it, the logistics companies on peppercorn margins can't afford to absorb the cost so need to pass it on to their customers who are also getting squeezed financially. We the consumer need to accept we will have to pay more for delivery or look at using alternatives such as click and collect as the current demand of parcel delivery is not environmentally or financially sustainable.

Absolutely - I work in the industry and have also seen this unfolding over the past 10 years.

 

The slim margins are not sustainable, but as you say, everyone is under pressure, a lot of which comes from the supermarkets at the large logistics company level, to reduce margins and cost, yet the expected level of service is higher than ever. Something is going to have to give at some point.

 

Click and collect is useful, but I believe that parcel delivery is more environmentally sustainable than click and collect - the marginal distance between drops is far lower than would be made by lots of individuals going to collect their parcel from somewhere, with consequently lower emissions. Whether it is financially sustainable is another matter entirely - the subcontracting 'race to the bottom' with the likes of Yodel and other home delivery companies suggests that it isn't. This race may lower the costs of delivery, but it certainly impacts service - often the trade off against lower cost

 

I think DPD prove that a superb service can be provided, but you'll pay more to ship with them than you will with the likes of Yodel.

[Jonboy]

The other side of the coin is apparently if a "self employed" driver goes sick* they often have to then pay the courier they "provide Services too" a daily rate to pay an agency driver. This can be in the region of £150 a day, from the slim delivery price per parcel alluded to above (or even four times that for some operators) and it can swiftly become unviable for drivers. This then leads to a higher driver turnover, and a further squeeze on margins, leading to a lower incentive to train staff.... 

 

As 37114 says I think there will be major changes in the market in the next few years as reduced driver numbers, and a lower unemployment rate making people more picky about the work they are prepared to do, start to bite.

 

 

*usually backache from spending all day hefting parcels and driving vans.

[Joseph_Pestell]

The other side of the coin is apparently if a "self employed" driver goes sick* they often have to then pay the courier they "provide Services too" a daily rate to pay an agency driver. This can be in the region of £150 a day, from the slim delivery price per parcel alluded to above (or even four times that for some operators) and it can swiftly become unviable for drivers. This then leads to a higher driver turnover, and a further squeeze on margins, leading to a lower incentive to train staff.... 

 

As 37114 says I think there will be major changes in the market in the next few years as reduced driver numbers, and a lower unemployment rate making people more picky about the work they are prepared to do, start to bite.

 

 

*usually backache from spending all day hefting parcels and driving vans.

 

It must be all of £150 a day. It was at that sort of a level eight years ago when I left the industry (where has that time gone to?). That made it very difficult for the self-employed guys to take any leave although they could come to a private arrangement with other drivers in the depot to cover them.

 

It is quite a tough job and I don't think that it is just due to expansion of the industry (even through the recession) that courier firms have struggled to recruit. My old depot manager always said that there were not many people in the working population who would be willing to do the job. That is reflected, I am sure, by the number of EU migrants who have come to work in the industry in recent years. They are taking jobs that the Brits don't want to do.

[phil gollin]

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Well, people may not like Yodel, but anyone who has been using "City Link" has an even bigger problem ;

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/city-link-goes-into-administration-with-substantial-redundancies-expected-among-2727-staff-members-9945120.html

 

City Link goes into administration, with 'substantial redundancies' expected among 2,727 staff members.

 

 

Operations have been suspended at all its depots until Monday, when customers and recipients will be able to collect their parcels

 

 

 

 

Parcel delivery company City Link, which employs 2,727 workers, has gone into administration.

 

The Coventry-based company, which is owned by investment firm Better Capital, called in administrators from professional services firm EY on Christmas Eve after years of "substantial losses".

EY said it expected "substantial redundancies" over the coming days because no buyer had been found to save the troubled company.

 

Operations have been suspended at all its depots until Monday, when customers and recipients will be able to collect their parcels.

 

Hunter Kelly, joint administrator to City Link, said: "City Link Limited has incurred substantial losses over several years.

 

"These losses reflect a combination of intense competition in the sector, changing customer and parcel recipient preferences, and difficulties for the company in reducing its cost base.

 

"The strain of these losses became too great and all but used up Better Capital's £40 million investment, which was made in 2013 and intended to help to turn around the company.

 

"Despite the best efforts to save City Link Limited, including marketing the company for sale, it could not continue to operate as a going concern and administrators were appointed.

 

"We have temporarily suspended operations at all transport hubs and depots until Monday December 29 2014, when we intend to reopen depots to the public to enable customers and intended recipients to collect their parcels.

"We will also provide support to employees relating to potential redundancies. We are now beginning the process of realising the company's assets."

 

Mick Cash, general secretary of the RMT union, said: "This is the bitterest blow any group of workers could receive on Christmas Day and it is absolutely shocking that the company have sprung this announcement once all the Christmas deliveries have been completed.

 

"RMT will do everything within its power to mobilise a political and industrial fight to save the thousands of jobs that have been put at risk as a result of this shock announcement."

 

A number of staff will be retained to help return parcels to customers and help with winding down the company, EY said.

 

Customers who had placed parcels with the company on Christmas Eve and intended recipients who have been notified of a failed or pending delivery are urged to retrieve their parcels as soon as possible on or after December 29.

 

They can do so at the company's 53 depots throughout the UK, which will remain open for a short period of time to enable people to collect their parcels.

 

The firm's online parcel tracking system remains live and a help phone will be open on Saturday December 27 and from December 29.

 

Founded in 1969, City Link said on its website that it had annual revenues of approximately £300 million, a fleet of 1,700 vehicles and delivered 60 million items across the UK and worldwide each year.

 

The RMT told its members yesterday that it understood that wages owed up to December 31 would be paid, but any further payments are not guaranteed.

 

It described the news in a circular as a "massive body blow to all our members at City Link who have made great efforts and sacrifices to their pay and terms and conditions in order to make the company a success since its current owners took control in 2013".

 

PA

 

 

See also, the BBC's story (basically the same ;

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-30602326

 

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