Henley-on-Thames - GWR in the 1930's

[MrWolf]

Already thinking which of my locos those figures would fit, a Manor is too big and too modern for my layout I'm afraid!

[Neal Ball]

57 minutes ago, alanbuttler said:

 

Morning everyone, thanks for the comments and thoughts about the new Accurascale crews!  The final GWR fireman figure which we'll be producing will have the GWR style grease top.   Here are the pre-production samples:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks very much for showing the crew Alan.

 

They will look great pre-coloured. Thanks again, Neal.

[MrWolf]

It's definitely a bonus to see them in place on a locomotive, not only does it show how good they look and fit, it's an excellent piece of marketing visual.

[Siberian Snooper]

I believe that knotted hankies were also acceptable headwear for firemen.  ISTR in one of the GW firing days books, that a train on the relief lines was being overtaken by an express on the main and the driver and fireman swapped sides, the driver took his cap off and donned a knotted hankie, passed his cap to the fireman and and told him to flog the driver with it, as the express passed. There were apparently a number of complaints from the passengers, about the "driver " beating the elderly "fireman ", much to their amusement.

 

 

[Neal Ball]

1 hour ago, Siberian Snooper said:

I believe that knotted hankies were also acceptable headwear for firemen.  ISTR in one of the GW firing days books, that a train on the relief lines was being overtaken by an express on the main and the driver and fireman swapped sides, the driver took his cap off and donned a knotted hankie, passed his cap to the fireman and and told him to flog the driver with it, as the express passed. There were apparently a number of complaints from the passengers, about the "driver " beating the elderly "fireman ", much to their amusement.

 

 

I’ve not heard that one before, thank you.

[Coach bogie]

My grandfather wore a beret as a firemen and a peaked cap when made up to driver, as here, not sure it is a grease top as it appears a bit bigger. He wears the same hat in other views I have of him, on the footplate.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Neal Ball]

1 hour ago, Coach bogie said:

My grandfather wore a beret as a firemen and a peaked cap when made up to driver, as here, not sure it is a grease top as it appears a bit bigger. He wears the same hat in other views I have of him, on the footplate.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Very on topic Mike thank you…. Not only the hat, but the open cab Metro tank.

 

Thanks.

[Jon Harbour]

4 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

My grandfather wore a beret as a firemen and a peaked cap when made up to driver, as here, not sure it is a grease top as it appears a bit bigger. He wears the same hat in other views I have of him, on the footplate.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

You really have to model  14xx class number 1415, don't you!

[checkrail]

Cracking photo Mike.  Would be nice to see what Modelu could do with it!  So that was your grandfather?

[checkrail]

On 25/04/2023 at 15:53, Neal Ball said:

I have looked across the MJT webpages as well as Worsley Works and can not see the correct style bogies.

 

If anyone has any suggestions they would be gratefully received.

Unfortunately I have now used up my last white metal 9 foot fishbelly and 8 foot American bogies, but I think that Shapeways now do both types. 

[Neal Ball]

56 minutes ago, checkrail said:

Unfortunately I have now used up my last white metal 9 foot fishbelly and 8 foot American bogies, but I think that Shapeways now do both types. 

My hesitation about shapeways is around their quality…. Are the products any good?

[Harlequin]

37 minutes ago, Neal Ball said:

My hesitation about shapeways is around their quality…. Are the products any good?

You know what I think... 😉

 

[The Stationmaster]

15 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

My grandfather wore a beret as a firemen and a peaked cap when made up to driver, as here, not sure it is a grease top as it appears a bit bigger. He wears the same hat in other views I have of him, on the footplate.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Judging by photos that appears t be teh standard GWR headgear for drivers - soft top and a shiny shade material.  In later pre-war photos Firemen also appear in that style of cap.

[checkrail]

1 hour ago, Neal Ball said:

My hesitation about shapeways is around their quality…. Are the products any good?

When painted and provided with steps I think they look as good as wm ones.  But the material is a little brittle, and my biggest bugbear is that with the 'Hornby fit' ones, once you've pressed the bogie spigot into the hole on the underside of the body you can't get it off without breaking the spigot head.  So I have a couple of coaches which ride on the vestiges of the spigot, and when you lift the coach body off the layout the bogies stay on the track! 

Edited April 27, 2023 by checkrail
typo

[The Stationmaster]

On 25/04/2023 at 19:06, Nick Gough said:

 

Going by the carriage livery that looks, to me, to be one of the 1987 Swindon-Gloucester runs?

 

I seem to remember it poured with rain for much of the journey!

 

 

 

Indeed it was.  when we were cleaning the fire the prec vious evening we noticed a leaking tube si o had to call down the Boilersmith from Tyseley.  He asked us to drop  the rest of the fire - which we did for most of it - laving us with a warm engine with some steam on the clock and when he finished at 03.30 -04.00 we had to basically build a new fire from scratch, albeit with a still pretty hot boiler etc, as there was just a little left in the firebox.  And it had to be a quick fire building and steam raising but we got there more or less in time going off shed only a few minutes late with a fully built up, and nicely burning through, fire and about two thirds of a glass of water.  Fortunately my fast fire raising didn't cause any further problems with tubes and in any case Dave - the Boilersmith, who was far from well at that time - had given them all a good look and no doubt had made sure they were all tight.

 

So we had a good day but it was rather spoilt by the late evening by the Fireman who worked the engine to Didcot.  i'd got the fire nicely running down by then but he was shovel happy and kept on chucking on ever more coal which wasn't needed.  He was. still firing after we'd passed Steventon which was downright dumb and when the fire should really be on the way to being well rundown - he'd probably never had to dispose an engine in his life (or he just liked making work for someone else or maybe he simply didn't understand how to rundown a fire and get most of it knocked out up the chimney).

[Neal Ball]

On 27/04/2023 at 05:21, Coach bogie said:

My grandfather wore a beret as a firemen and a peaked cap when made up to driver, as here, not sure it is a grease top as it appears a bit bigger. He wears the same hat in other views I have of him, on the footplate.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Interestingly 455 class Metro tank 2-4-0T was built in 1878, with Auto gear added in 1930 and finally withdrawn in April 1938. I can’t see any allocation details for the loco in the “Four coupled” engines book.

 

The other loco to use that number; no 4815 was built in 1933 and finally withdrawn from Southall in 1957 by which time it had been numbered 1415.

[Coach bogie]

On 28/04/2023 at 02:43, checkrail said:

Cracking photo Mike.  Would be nice to see what Modelu could do with it!  So that was your grandfather?

Yes. Bert Wiltshire. Passed out as a driver at Canton before moving back to Swindon, where he started his GWR life. Not many family pics but several of him on the footplate. My favourite is him on Saint class Ivanhoe.

 

Back down under. Having a Manchester theme weekend. I am in NSW where Gorton built 6029 Garratt is in steam.

[Star-rider]

On 27/04/2023 at 18:44, Neal Ball said:

My hesitation about shapeways is around their quality…. Are the products any good?

 

It's perhaps "in the eye of the beholder".

 

I compare them to my own ability to build a coach and in that respect they suffice - they look like they should from a distance.

 

The beauty of them for me is that they will take a standard Hornby 14.2mm coach wheel - easily available and fairly cheap - they are designed with an NEM pocket and run very well.

 

They are a bit pricy, the postage inflates this even more so better to wait until you are ready to order a couple of pairs at a time to get better value.

[Neal Ball]

It wasn’t the intention for today, but I have stripped the brass items off the Slaters C28 all Third.

 

At the same time, I have eased the bogies… they are better, but still not great.

 

I have some 9ft American bogie whitemetal overlays, so might try that onto a brass comet 9ft frame.

 

 

 

The fittings were eased out after applying some brake fluid. It has all been cleaned up with some IPA.

[Coach bogie]

You have done well with the Slaters. I have never got on with the plastic sides. I only have one Slaters compo on the layout. Personally, I prefer metal and find brass sides much less work. I am not adverse to making a hybrid. Here is a Worsley Works C32 shell on a Hornby recent C54 underframe with a Slaters roof. It didn't survive the journey south totally intact but I think I have straightened most of it now. 

 

There were many bogie changes over the years. I could have used Bachmann 9ft but opted for the 7ft as I could use a cheap Hornby coach as a donor. The 7ft should be moved inwards 4mm but............I cannot be bothered.

 

I look forward to seeing the finished Slaters. Really impressed with your Metro. I have just seen the ultimate shunter having watched a 4-6-4/4-6-4 Garratt shunting empty stock, yesterday.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Neal Ball]

5 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

You have done well with the Slaters. I have never got on with the plastic sides. I only have one Slaters compo on the layout. Personally, I prefer metal and find brass sides much less work. I am not adverse to making a hybrid. Here is a Worsley Works C32 shell on a Hornby recent C54 underframe with a Slaters roof. It didn't survive the journey south totally intact but I think I have straightened most of it now. 

 

There were many bogie changes over the years. I could have used Bachmann 9ft but opted for the 7ft as I could use a cheap Hornby coach as a donor. The 7ft should be moved inwards 4mm but............I cannot be bothered.

 

I look forward to seeing the finished Slaters. Really impressed with your Metro. I have just seen the ultimate shunter having watched a 4-6-4/4-6-4 Garratt shunting empty stock, yesterday.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Thanks for this Mike.

 

The issue I have with the Slaters carriages are getting the roofline and body to join without a gap.

 

Now that this one is stripped down I will do the Brake 3rd and then I can get a decent sprayed finish on them.

 

They don’t look tidy inside, there is so much “liquid lead” in there it’s not true!

 

Then it will be a case of what I’m going to do with the bogies…. Persevere or replace.

 

By comparison, I also looked at my Blacksmiths model of the J5 sleeper and that bogie runs like a dream….. although at the moment it looks a bit on the basic side. For such an expensive kit, it came with a naff floor, but it’s almost finished, so will be sprayed at the same time. 
 

The roof is odd with this one as the Clerestory, has windows at an angle to the roofline, rather than square.

 

Ive seen the preserved carriage at the WSR and the roof is indeed unusual, Somewhere, I have a photo of the preserved carriages roof as well.

 

Thanks again, Neal.

[The Fatadder]

2 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

The issue I have with the Slaters carriages are getting the roofline and body to join without a gap.

I found it a real pain with mine, I think in the end I found that the partition walls were part of the problem and chopped down the height so that the roof wasnt touching them.  For the second Slaters build I then completely binned the Slaters underframe and built the coach as a full body/roof Comet style,  before fitting to a modified Comet underframe 

[Neal Ball]

Back in October 2008 we visited the Gauge museum at Bishops Lydeard and took some photos of the J5 sleeper carriage inside.

 

The carriage is described on the Vintage carriages register here: http://www.cs.rhrp.org.uk/se/CarriageInfo.asp?Ref=57

 

And at the West Somerset railway stock pages here: https://www.wsrht.co.uk/gwr-sleeping-car-no-9038/

 

 

The unusual roof arrangements can be seen here:

 

 

 

This is one of only 2 sleeping carriages built under Diagram J5 in 1896 and lasted in service on the Paddington to Fishguard route until 1931.

 

 

The carriage is seen here in 1933 in Bridgewater, Somerset, when it had been bought to build into a bungalow.

 

 

It's likely that the carriage will not run very often, but given I am going to spray the Slaters carriages then I might as well get the J5 to a decent standard, so that can be sprayed at the same time.

[Neal Ball]

6 minutes ago, The Fatadder said:

I found it a real pain with mine, I think in the end I found that the partition walls were part of the problem and chopped down the height so that the roof wasnt touching them.  For the second Slaters build I then completely binned the Slaters underframe and built the coach as a full body/roof Comet style,  before fitting to a modified Comet underframe 

 

I also found that the interior partitions were too wide for the carriage as well 😒

 

Do you remember what you did with the bogies Rich? @The Fatadder Thanks

Edited May 2, 2023 by Neal Ball
Bogie question

[Nick Gough]

The clerestory on the sleeper is similar to that on the surviving Dean H7 diner at Didcot:

https://didcotrailwaycentre.org.uk/article.php/166/no-9520-dean-composite-diner