Hayfield Branch line

[pod909]

I'm doing some research on the Hayfield branch line with a view to creating a simple shelf layout.

 

My research is throwing up conflicting information on who operated service on the branch. Ownership of the line also seems to be confused.

 

Was it formally part of the CG&MJR or just in MS&JR/GCR ownership and operation?

 

I'm looking at 3 era's before settling on one.

1) 1868 - 1897 : MS&&LR merging with Midland express main line services at Mew Mils Central

2) 1908 - 1911 : covering the existence of the Kinder Railway, Great Central Railway, unsure of what Midland service would of remained on the New Mills Central line after express passenger services where switched to the line through the Dissley tunnel

3) April 1932 : LNER/LMS ownership, but who ran service?

 

Any help greatly appreciated.

[Poggy1165]

As far as I know it was owned by the Sheffield and Midland, later the Great Central and Midland Joint Committee. I don't think the latter ever changed its name.

 

The GCR certainly ran the passenger trains to Hayfield, and I believe the goods trains also. Later the LNER. I have seen a photo of a Midland engine and inspection saloon at Hayfield though.

 

On the other hand the signalling of this part of the GC&M was pure Midland, and I rather think the permanent way was too. 

 

Although the Midland expresses were diverted from the New Mills-Romiley section in 1902, local Midland/LMS trains continued on that section, and I think there were also a few through carriages to Manchester Victoria that ran all the way via Ashburys. There was of course a huge amount of Midland/LMS goods traffic over this section to the main Midland yard at Ancoats, which survived well into the BR era. Indeed, I suspect a model of New Mills Central would need far more Midland/LMS goods trains than Great Central/LNER, the latter being purely local.

Edited January 8, 2016 by Poggy1165

[pod909]

Thanks for the speedy reply. That was really helpful.

 

So...

 

Loco's - it looks like the same 0-6-2 tanks providing the bulk of service gradually changing livery from MS&LR to GCR, LNER and finally black when BR

Wagons - cold be a mix of pretty much anything demanded locally (calico and paper printing, coal, livestock)

Coaches - looks like a set of 4 commuter with a break wagon

 

On the coaches cold you help with livery. I have seen it mentioned that the GCR change coach livery form brown and cream to wooden around 1914?

 

Station colors: Midland crimson lake even though the service is GCR?

Edited January 8, 2016 by pod909

[65179]

Have you got the Foxline publishing (now Booklaw) book on the Hayfield branch? It mainly focuses on BR days but from memory it has one or two photos from earlier days. The BR era started with C13 4-4-2Ts working the passenger services on the branch, giving way to C14s, A5s and L1s in due course. F1s and F2s 2-4-2Ts may have preceded the C13s. Freight, and Sunday passenger, was mostly J11s contemporaneously with the C13s. I'm sure I've read that new B1s turned up when running-in in late LNER days.

 

I've just found a photo of a J11 at Hayfield alongside a train of close-coupled 6-wheel stock in 1926 (it's in LMS & LNER in Manchester by R.E. Rose. A fascinating overview of the pre-war scene in the Manchester area).

Edited January 9, 2016 by 65179

[Poggy1165]

The GCR changed its coach livery twice. Originally French grey and brown, then brown and cream, and finally, from 1908, teak. The coaches you would need for the era would be 6 and 4 wheelers, almost exclusively, as bogie stock was not generally used on Manchester area suburbans until circa 1935. The coaches, ex MS&L, were varnished teak when new, then painted in the two early GC schemes. I can't promise this, but I'd not be that surprised if they were painted teak after 1908, rather than stripped down to bare wood and revarnished. The Great Central Rolling Stock Trust at Ruddington might be able to advise on this. I don't know what scale you're working in but in 4mm Bill Bedford does the 4 wheelers and in 7mm Quainton Road the 6 wheelers. (I am not sure when the 4 wheelers were withdrawn. I have evidence of a full train of them in use on the Manchester Central-Fairfield route in 1909, but opinion seems to be that they were out of front line use by the Grouping.)

 

In GC days the most likely passenger engines would be F1 (and possibly F2). There are quite a few photos of A5s working in the Manchester area, although all were allocated to Neasden. I suspect they were run in on local trains. C13s probably the same, although in GC days Gorton did not apparently have any allocated. (Trafford Park did, for the CLC.) The RCTS green book states that D12 Sacre 4-4-0s were used on the Hayfield pick-up in late GC days. Otherwise I would expect N5/J9/J10. Given the proximity of Gorton works I would not rule out anything, up to and including Valour on the occasional running-in turn. I have seen a photo of a B17 at Marple in LNER days, and remember being told that it was not unknown for a Director to be put on a Glossop train.

 

I think the station colours would be whatever the Midland's were. I seem to recall the Midland painted its signal posts in funny colours too. 

 

BTW in BR days trains were often surprisingly long, especially in rush hours, and often included GCR Robinson bogie stock and Gresley and Thompson coaches. 

 

There is a Foxline book on the Hayfield branch which would help you - you may need to look at the second hand market. From memory the photos in it are mostly, but not wholly, BR era. The other Foxline books about Woodhead west of the tunnel and the various Manchester lines and stations might give you an idea of what the local trains looked like.

[pod909]

Thanks for the tip off on the book. I'll definitely have to hunt that down.

 

Scale: 2mm/N-Gauge due to space constraints

 

From photo and 1922 ordinance survey it looks like the track plan is something like this.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 10, 2016 by pod909

[Argos]

I've often thought Heyfield would make a great model (it's just the wrong company for me) so will watch with interest.

I've often parked in the station site to go mountain biking.

 

I have doodled an LNWR station in that vicinity, earthworks were started as a negotiation tactic to get running rights over Woodhead by threating a competing route over the Pennines. The route would have run via Heyfield (I think).

 

I seem to recall the Midland were obliged to run a few trains annually to maintain their running rights (but might have dreamt that bit!)

 

If you are modelling one of the earlier periods you will need a turntable in front of the engine shed to be totally accurate.

 

Are you building in 2mm Finescale?

[pod909]

2FS? Now that's a question.

 

My parents is round the corner, my toddler years where spent in Bugsworth. I went to school in Chinley and New Mills. But there's no way I have room for a 5 platform exchange so Hayfield makes sense to me size wise. No idea if I have the skill to pull it off -- buildings, scenery, wagons and coaches I think so, track laying and locos? we'll see -- but how ever long it takes to get there I like to have an eventual target in mind and enjoy the research for it's own sake.

 

Looks like hardly any of the loco and stock mentioned above are available in n-gauge RTR (or even kit form??), so the only way to get there will be with kit bashing and scratch building.

 

So I think I'm going to start by laying the track in Pico 55 Finescale and late LNER and what ever approximate tank loco's I can find. Scratch building the scenery in 2mm and then work my way back to the GCR and 1908 - 1911.

 

... then the Kinder Railway .... and finally New Mills Central, the Midland and LMS

 

The layout above isn't prototypical anyway as it's squashed into 18inches and the entry and exit points are aligned as the whole modular thing sounds a giggle.

 

...

 

Turn table I'm not sure about. There's one shown late 1890s but by the 1922 OS it's gone. Not sure about size?

 

...just made an enquiry about 2fs point work. Lets see...

Edited January 11, 2016 by pod909

[pod909]

Revised track plan based on some photos I found earlier today...

 

 

Edited January 11, 2016 by pod909

[pod909]

Some general notes:

 

Lines

 

·         Hayfield branch line

·         Great Central and Midland Joint Committee (GC&MJC) connection at New Mills Central

·         Kinder Railway

 

All standard gauge

 

Interesting Dates

 

1)      1868 - 1897 – MS&LR and Midland main line era

2)      1908 – 1911 - pre-merger era - during construction of Kinder Damn

3)      April 1932 big 4 era – The Mass Trespass

 

Operators

 

Hayfield branch – 1) MS&LR, 2) Great Central Railway, 3) LNER

GC&MJC – 1) MS&LR and Midland Railway (Manchester – London main line), 2) Great Central Railway and Midland Railways (local and trans-Pennine service), 3) Joint LMS and LNER

Kinder Railway – Private

 

Timeline for Railway Development in the area

 

1861 – Agreement between MS&LR and Midland Railway to form GC&MJC (known as the Marple, New Mills and Hayfield Junction Line prior to 1897)

1865 – Midland joins the Cheshire Lines Committee

1867 – Midland main line from Millers Dale via the Dove Holes tunnel and Chinley connects with the GC&MJR at New Mills Central, GC&MJR joins the MS&LR mainline at Hyde Junction.

1868 – Branch line to Hayfield opens

1875 – Direct route into Manchester London Road from Romley via Bredbury opens

1880 – Midland switches to Manchester Central for its main line service, initially diverts on the Manchester side of Romley to connect through Stockport Tiviot Dale.

1894 – Dore to Chinely line opened by Midland Railway to provide a direct connection from Sheffield to Manchester

1^st August 1897 – MS&LR changes name to Great Central Railway.

1902 – Midland diverts its main line service to Manchester at the New Mills South junction switching it away from New Mills Central.

1908 –Kinder Railway starts operation, change of GCR coach livery from brown and cream to teak

1911 – Kinder Railway stops operation

1^st January 1923 – Great Central Railway grouped into LNER, Midland Railway grouped into LMS

1930 – Hourly Sunday service carrying upward of 5,000 hikers a weekend into Hayfield to access the moors

c. 1935 – Bogey coaches become operational on LNER local services

1948 – Nationalisation

1968 – Goods service withdrawn from Hayfield

1970 – Hayfield branch line closes

 

Local Industry

 

Craft woollen weaving

Cotton weaving - calico

Fabric dying and printing

Paper printing

 

Rail operations

 

1 & 2) Coal and raw cotton to local industry, mixed freight finished goods to markets

Each goods siding shown in photographs carrying mixed freight on 15-20 cars

 

3) Post WWI large numbers of tourist passengers accessing the moors for walking at weekends

Passenger trains 4 standard coaches and a break. 4-6 wheel close coupled coaches

 

Kinder Railway operations show short mixed freight sets and a 4 car 4 wheel carriage set hauled by 0-6-0ST locomotives

Edited January 13, 2016 by pod909

[pod909]

Some useful photos showing the buildings and track layout. Mostly circa 1950/60 but older photos show the same track plan for rest of the 20th century.

 

Between the double track serving the platform and the northern sidings is a ramp. The Kinder Railway ran up this and over Station Street

hayfield railway phot notes.pdf

[pod909]

Turns out a 2FS layout to scale fits the 2000 x 460mm base board that's now propped up in the spare room. Here's the Templot kindly produced by Keith Armes.

 

 

[Argos]

Hi pod,

 

The plan looks great!

If you are planning 2mm finescale it might be worth asking one of the mods to transfer this topic to the 2mm section.

There is lots of great advice and support for the 2mm FS newcomer there from experienced hands who have been there and done it.

 

Regards

 

Angus

[pod909]

I was thinking of leaving the general info here for anyone who happens to look for it and start a new thread in the 2mm subforum for the layout its self

[Argos]

Hi Pod,

 

Either way works! I just thought it would save reposting track plans etc.

 

If you are interested Worsley works do a Scratch aid C13 kit in 2mm, however they are more "scratch" then "kit" so a bit of experience would help.

It would provide a useful start though.

[pod909]

Ooo i didn't see that on their website. Thanks for the tip off.

 

An F1/F2 kit would be top of the list. 3 of those would probably be all that was needed. All the photos of the branch feature them.

 

I think and a D12 would be next, while converting a J11 from n-gauge looks to be the most reasonable starting point to get going.

 

... but before all that there's a piece of Easitrack track and a wagon kit!

 

Ric

[Guest bri.s]

Hi Ric

I've just gone 2mm myself after years of doing N ,it looks a good plan you got there

 

I'll be looking forward to how you get on with the wagon kit

 

Brian

Edited January 19, 2016 by bri.s

[ricardian1]

Rough sketch of Hayfield track diagram by my Uncle James Fletcher (son of Herbert Fletcher, a signalman at Hayfield for many years)

[ricardian1]

Rough sketch of lever layout in Hayfield box by my uncle James Fletcher.

 

[colin.divall]

Thanks, very interesting to see this diagram etc. (although there seems to be some confusion of the spare levers!). Any idea of the date? There are clearly changes from that below (also undated, but I'd assume from the C20th heyday of the line, after the box was moved to the west of the level crossing in the 1920s):

 

The diagram is by R.D. Foster, and was published in the MRC (Feb. 1979), p.82.

 

Colin

[colin.divall]

And for those thinking modelling Hayfield (or anywhere else on the branch for that matter) in 1880, evidence from the Board of Trade's report on the railway companies progress (or lack thereof) on interlocking!....

 

Colin