Static grass fibres

[Re6/6]

Ever since the announcement of the new longer fibres (Heki 10mm and Faller? 12mm) at the Nürnburg Toy Fair I've been looking forward to their arrival. The Heki ones have become available in the UK.

 

My Heki XL (spring & summer) ones arrived today from Blackwells of Hawkwell via excellent 'by return' service (usual disclaimer).

 

I'll be trying them out later with the GrasMaster & GrassTech. I'll post some snaps up later to see how they are after some trials.

 

They look ideal for that long grass (2' 6" in 4mm scale) without having to 'double layer'

 

 

 

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[Andy Y]

They'll certainly be useful for larger modellers John; 7mm+, rather than FBs like me.

[buffalo]

Now, at last, I can think about modelling my back garden...

 

Nick

[Re6/6]

A quick experiment shows that the Heki stuff works well. It is on the left is the new 10mm stuff. This is the 'summer' variety. Much lighter in colour than the MiniNatur stuff (6.5mm) on the right, which is their interpretation of the same shade.

Both were applied with a 'GrassTech/Flockit' type machine on a base of 50/50 mix of PVA and latex type glue. I've yet to try it out with the old Noch machine with the cone attachment for fine areas.

 

 

 

 

An interesting effect on the right when there was a few of the longer fibres left in the machine.

 

 

 

 

An experiment beckons with a proper mixture of the two.

 

 

This snap gives a comparison in 4mm. Please ignore abysmal 'weathering'!

[Eggesford box]

Hi,

 

a couple of shots of the longer Heki static grass, one close up and one a little further away.

[coachmann]

Point rodding looks interesting.

[Eggesford box]

Hi,

just some brass rod and offcuts of plasticard. In reality the base is just a placeholder for an American interlocking tower as much to protect the steps and walway and give me a bit of scenery practise until when and if I get around to building a layout.

[Tim Hale]

John wrote,

 

A quick experiment shows that the Heki stuff works well. It is on the left is the new 10mm stuff. This is the 'summer' variety. Much lighter in colour than the MiniNatur stuff (6.5mm) on the left, which is their interpretation of the same shade.

 

Sorry, but the above is a bit confusing as both varieties of grass appear to be 'on the left'

 

Which mixture of Heki 10mm grass are you using in the photos, is it the Heki 3377 summer? I ask because I need to blend with their 3367 Wisengruen - meadow grass.

 

Many thanks

 

Tim

[Oldddudders]

This certainly looks interesting for modelling long summer grasses. I note that both the machines used are the "proper" jobs, which are known to have more power. Can anyone say if there is a problem using the cheap-and-nasty tea-strainer type solution with longer fibres?

[Re6/6]

Apologies Tim. A.D. I'm afraid. I have to think briefly sometimes about port from starboard now it's left and right!

 

Yes it is 'Nr. 3377 Sommer'

 

The spring colour '3376 Frühling' is, as usual, of a more yellow hue.

 

There are quite large differences in interpretation of spring/summer shades by various firms.

[alant]

This certainly looks interesting for modelling long summer grasses. I note that both the machines used are the "proper" jobs, which are known to have more power. Can anyone say if there is a problem using the cheap-and-nasty tea-strainer type solution with longer fibres?

 

I email FMR yesterday and asked if their grass applicator would handle the newly released longer fibres (although I wasn't specific on make and lengths) and received a positive response stating that their Maxi model will handle all fibres available. I have not yet bought an applicator but am planning to do so shortly and model in 0 gauge so interested in using the longer fibres.

 

Alan.

[Tim Hale]

John,

 

I am having no-much-fun trying to use the new Heki xtra long grass, it defies the use of my GrassTech static grass applicator and the stuff just flops about on the PVA like a wet weekend in Bognor. The longer fibres seem much stiffer than the shorter Heki grass and very unco-operative.

 

Absolutely no chance of an erect bit of grass - do you have a Valium-like cure for this affliction?

 

Tim

[buffalo]

Tim,

 

My brief experience with the Noch 12mm stuff is similar. It does seem to be thicker and stiffer than most of the shorter fibres. These photos show my initial results using a home-made static machine made with an ion generator and a tea strainer. It is, I think much better than the average 'fly swatter' device, though not as good as the Noch GrasMaster.

 

The long grass behind the fence is a blend of two colours of Noch 12mm with two of MiniNatur 6.5mm. The latter on its own stands up very well. In front of the fence is Noch 2.5mm. The PW gang will be along shortly to remove the stray material that has fallen on their side of the fence. The first photo doesn't look too bad to me:

 

 

Looking from a higher angle tells a rather different story with many flattened fibres...

 

 

Nick

[Re6/6]

John,

 

I am having no-much-fun trying to use the new Heki xtra long grass, it defies the use of my GrassTech static grass applicator and the stuff just flops about on the PVA like a wet weekend in Bognor. The longer fibres seem much stiffer than the shorter Heki grass and very unco-operative.

 

Absolutely no chance of an erect bit of grass - do you have a Valium-like cure for this affliction?

 

Tim

 

Tim, you could try using 12v as Grass Tech/Green Scene do/did sell a 12v adaptor for added electrostatic effect.

[Tim Hale]

Just cranking up the Van der Graff as I write - should be interesting but painful.

 

Tim

[AndrewC]

Just to add my 2p worth. I find even the 6mm grass tend to flop about if the humidity is very high during application. Running the a/c in the shed for half an hour or so to suck moisture out of the air seems to make quite a difference.

[Oldddudders]

Just cranking up the Van der Graff as I write - should be interesting but painful.

Lovely! Reminded me of bumping into a former boss in the Euston House lift during Rail Privatisation. He was totally disaffected with the concept, never mind the process, and had been given a "just" job to keep him out of harm's way. "Hello, Peter! How's the Psychometric Testing going?" I asked. "Very well" came the reply "The way I do it - I attach electrodes to the Chief Executive's b****cks!"

[Tim Hale]

Just to add my 2p worth. I find even the 6mm grass tend to flop about if the humidity is very high during application. Running the a/c in the shed for half an hour or so to suck moisture out of the air seems to make quite a difference.

Nill humidity in the workshop, thanks to Bill&Ben the dehumidifier men.Tim

[buffalo]

Just to add my 2p worth. I find even the 6mm grass tend to flop about if the humidity is very high during application. Running the a/c in the shed for half an hour or so to suck moisture out of the air seems to make quite a difference.

I would have thought the main reason for that is that it helps the glue dry, or at least become tacky, more quickly. Indoors, my 6mm and shorter fibres usually stand up quite well, but only a few of the 12mm ones do and I'm already running my home-made machine at 12-14V (I wonder how much more it will take...).

 

Nick

[AndrewC]

Nill humidity in the workshop, thanks to Bill&Ben the dehumidifier men.Tim

Well then its time to open the roof raise the lightning rod and wait for a good storm. I guess I'll have to up the voltage on my Grass Master II when I need to go with the 12mm fibres.

[Tim Hale]

 

 

Not as good as John or Nick but it is different from the shorter Heki grass and I will persist.

 

Thanks for the feedback, the discussion is very helpful

 

Tim

[AndrewC]

Looking good Tim. Much better than trying to double stack the 6mm fibres. Also better looking than hanging basket liner.

[buffalo]

That looks a promising start, Tim. Is it just the long fibres? If so, I'd recommend trying a blend with some 4mm or 6mm fibres to give the grass more 'body' at ground level. I haven't worked out the best proportions for this and they may vary according to the effect required, but my earlier photos were roughly equal volumes of the medium and long fibres. I imagine that equal volumes probably means a higher number of the shorter fibres. My main concern now is whether it is more difficult to get the long fibres to stand up when using this approach. Next, I'm going try removing most of the really flat fibres with tweezers to see if what is left looks better...

 

Nick

[Tim Hale]

Nick,

 

Started with 10mm, then I emptied the GrassTech and refilled with 6mm. I tend to remove excess fibres as soon as the PVA has begun to really 'grab' and a close pass with the Dustbuster makes a real difference to the end result.

 

It may sound pedantic but I try to replicate the fields that the workshop overlook, I see very little variation* in texture/colour across one field hence I tend to use just one specific blend (Heki Meadow 3367 in 6mm and 3377 in 10mm).

 

The new Heki 10mm grass is realistic and I think that new techniques and tools will be needed to release the full potential of this excellent product - this thread is providing a great deal of pooled information, well done.

 

Tim

 

 

*Where I introduce variation is at the edges where the weeds tend to thrive and although the fields on my blog may look somewhat uniform, they have not received the finer detail of weeds etc.