Die cast "play" loco

[melmerby]

Hi all

 

When I was a lad in shorts,( back in Victorian times I think,) I had a die cast 0-6-0 tank loco which IIRC looked like a Jinty.

It was all metal, including the wheels and looked like it might have been 00 gauge.

The body was painted a fairly bright red, but I can't remember any lettering, although there may have been some. The wheels were silver.

It wasn't motorised or even clockwork.

 

Any ideas of make? Mettoy maybe?

 

Cheers

 

Keith

Edited October 12, 2013 by melmerby

[Coach bogie]

There was a 'Budgie' toy that fits that description.Still have mine packed up with the Dinkies in the attic

 

Example here

 

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/BUDGIE-NO-224-0-6-0-TANK-LOCO-RARE-/350578780149

 

 

Mike Wiltshire

[melmerby]

There was a 'Budgie' toy that fits that description.Still have mine packed up with the Dinkies in the attic

 

Example here

 

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/BUDGIE-NO-224-0-6-0-TANK-LOCO-RARE-/350578780149

 

 

Mike Wiltshire

Could be!

Thanks for that.

 

Keith

[roythebus]

I've got one somewhere. It has "British Railways" on the side tanks. Gotta be Budgie!

 

They done a very nice Midland Red C5 motorway coach model. when the electrics started from Euston to Brum, we went on a cheap day trip from Camden Road to Brum in an AM10 (still got the ticket too), and in the Digbeth coach station selling the C5 models for 10/6d. I bought quite a few for my model bus collection!

[Il Grifone]

There are two* versions of the Budgie 0-6-0T. One with raised 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' and number and a (later?) one with a paper sticker with the same on a raised panel. The one I acquired* lately has a yellow sticker and the (incorrect) number '7118'**. She's all red with unpainted wheels and rods, though apparently other colours were available (I've only ever seen red ones). She won't run on 00 track as the wheels are set too close together. The coupling rods still manage to catch on the steps on mine.

 

* possibly more?

**AFAIK they are all 7118.

 

They may be rare in Australia, but not here. There were at least two where I bought mine. I didn't pay anything like AU $19 for her either.

Edited October 14, 2013 by Il Grifone

[Il Grifone]

I found this site:

 

http://www.87thscale.info/budgie.htm

 

It would appear that the model first appeared as 'Modern Products', changing to 'Morestone' in 1949* and again to 'Budgie' in 1959, with manufacture ceasing in 1966. Since the model was rather crude (and not cheap) it is likely that stocks were still available for years afterwards.

 

The scale is rather hybrid - certainly 00 in side view, but H0 in width, which explains the necessity of the narrow gauge (around 15mm).

 

*This accounts for the 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' and the LMS number series.

 

This other page is useful (not only for the rather nice 'Herpa' vehicles)

 

http://www.87thscale.info/restoration.htm

 

However amend the "oven cleaner can damage the skin" to "oven cleaner will damage the skin".  Oven cleaner contains caustic soda, which causes nasty burns. (Soap is made by dissolving sheep fat in the stuff!) That is why I prefer brake fluid (still bad for the skin, but less so.) It also doesn't usually strip plastichrome.

Edited October 14, 2013 by Il Grifone

[andyman7]

I found this site:

 

http://www.87thscale.info/budgie.htm

 

It would appear that the model first appeared as 'Modern Products', changing to 'Morestone' in 1949* and again to 'Budgie' in 1959, with manufacture ceasing in 1966. Since the model was rather crude (and not cheap) it is likely that stocks were still available for years afterwards.

 

The scale is rather hybrid - certainly 00 in side view, but H0 in width, which explains the necessity of the narrow gauge (around 15mm).

 

*This accounts for the 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' and the LMS number series.

 

This other page is useful (not only for the rather nice 'Herpa' vehicles)

 

http://www.87thscale.info/restoration.htm

 

However amend the "oven cleaner can damage the skin" to "oven cleaner will damage the skin".  Oven cleaner contains caustic soda, which causes nasty burns. (Soap is made by dissolving sheep fat in the stuff!) That is why I prefer brake fluid (still bad for the skin, but less so.) It also doesn't usually strip plastichrome.

A limited number of Budgie models continued in production into the 1980s for the London tourist market, and the 0-6-0 loco was one of them - I remember them on sale in London then (and they were not 20 year old stock). The boxes were closed picture boxes and the small print stated 'Made in England by Budgie Models for H Seener Ltd'. Although the standard issue was red, a few other colours appeared to including a browny-bronze colour! 

[dublorunner]

 

I am pretty sure that this is Budgie. Repainted black but with LMS and number cast on the sides. Very tall cab, way out of scale. Motorised with a Hornby chassis and then converted to 3 rail. Runs well but with a pronounced wobble.

 

 

[dublorunner]

 

 

Another push along train was made by Dinky Toys. This one is also motorised and converted to 3 rail. 

 

 

[Il Grifone]

IMG_2737.JPG

 

 

Another push along train was made by Dinky Toys. This one is also motorised and converted to 3 rail.

This is a die-cast version of the Dublo 'starter set steam locomotive' (They also messed up their diesel shunter to make an 0-4-0 diesel). She was usually (always?) in blue with GER on the tanks and came with a diecast version of the Dublo open wagon in yellow and a high sided wagon (of Acho origins?) in red.

 

The Gaiety N2 (and the pannier) also appeared in a push along version from time to time. I had a green N2 with a 2-4-0 chassis. This was 00 gauge, but the rigid chassis would not go around Dublo curves.

 

Various models were available in other scales. There was a Dinky A4 with two articulated coaches available in LNER livery and later in BR livery*. We used Izal Toilet paper so that I could collect the train given away, a vehicle at a time, inside the roll - US style loco., tender, box car, tank car and caboose IIRC - I never had enough tenders and was very disappointed when they changed to flat zoo animals - we changed brand soon afterwards!

 

And, of course, there was the Lone Star 000 range.

 

* I had both and would like to replace them. but they are now collectable.... Pre-war there were other items.

 

http://dsa.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313.TR10.TRC0.A0.Xdinky+%28train%2CA4%29&_nkw=dinky+%28train%2CA4%29&_sacat=0&_from=R40

Edited October 18, 2013 by Il Grifone

[sandwich station]

though apparently other colours were available (I've only ever seen red ones). She won't run on 00 track as the wheels are set too close together. The coupling rods still manage to catch on the steps on mine.

They were made in 4 colours that I am aware of. Red, black, green and bronze. I had a bronze one in the toy box.

[andyman7]

This is a die-cast version of the Dublo 'starter set steam locomotive' (They also messed up their diesel shunter to make an 0-4-0 diesel). She was usually (always?) in blue with GER on the tanks and came with a diecast version of the Dublo open wagon in yellow and a high sided wagon (of Acho origins?) in red.

 

 

This was the Dinky Toys 784 Goods Train Set, made from 1973-75 - my brother had one. This must have been the last use of any HD tools at the Binns Road factory - by 1973 Meccano Ltd was under the control of the Airfix Group, whilst the HD intellectual property rights rested with the ex-Triang railway range at Margate under the control of Dunbee-Combex-Marx, and the rest of the HD tools were owned by G&R Wrenn Ltd at Bowlers Croft.  

[Peterpiper]

IMG_2734.JPG

 

I am pretty sure that this is Budgie. Repainted black but with LMS and number cast on the sides. Very tall cab, way out of scale. Motorised with a Hornby chassis and then converted to 3 rail. Runs well but with a pronounced wobble.

That's not the Budgie Jinty, the picture below is of a playworn red Budgie version.

 

 

The LMS casting you have I also have an original but not yet traced the maker but abpout the same size

 

[melmerby]

That red one looks just like what I remember

 

Keith

[dublorunner]

Peterpiper, yes I agree with you that the red loco is a Budgie Jinty and that my one is the same as your black one. So its back to the drawing board as to who made the LMS Jinty

[sagaguy]

It looks very similar to a clockwork jinty that i had as a child in the late 1940s/early 50s.The track consisted of a three part pressed steel or alumnium plates in which the track was embossed into the plates.There was a crossover at each end with a straight portion in the middle.After winding the loco up,it would run forward,clear a crossover & reverse back onto the other track,run to the other end,go forward over the other crossover & repeat until the clockwork ran out.It never worked again after my father took it apart to "repair" it.I would love to know who made it!!.

 

                      Ray.

[Peterpiper]

I thought a few pictures of both the Budgie Jinty and LMS 7217 together would be useful

[Il Grifone]

Looking for something else, I came across this.

 

http://essexmodelsandminiatures.co.uk/blog/category/model-railways/diecast-trains/

 

The Moko 0-4-0T is one I've never seen before.

 

7118 is the original number of one of the first series of LMS 3F 0-6-0Ts (i.e. a Jinty). Her sister 7119 still survives. Morestone presumably choose the number from an early photo or drawing and updated to 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' without realising that she had been renumbered in the meantime. The comment in the above link concerning LNER F3s is therefore not really relevant and I don't see how it can be stated that she is 00 gauge and fits nicely on Hornby track, as all the ones I have seen are narrow gauge (even by 00 standards) and definitely don't. I tried easing out the wheels on one in my youth but there is not enough metal to hold the wheels for 16.5mm gauge. (The axle ends taper slightly.)

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LMS_Fowler_Class_3F

 

 

i found two of the 7217s offered for sale but having better things to spend the available cash on, I didn't get one. (I regret it now, but another will turn up. I can confirm the lack of maker's name on the casting (Didn't want the blame? ) It seems to be an attempt at this, but they didn't quite make it....

 

https://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.britishsteam.com%2Flms%2F0-6-0T%2Fimage%2F41734.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.britishsteam.com%2Flms%2F0-6-0T%2F41734.php&docid=pGcN4AF_8FVZrM&tbnid=V9_8lURp1VM7cM%3A&vet=1&w=1020&h=680&bih=671&biw=1304&q=lms%200-6-0t&ved=0ahUKEwizjomMsfvQAhVCJMAKHVyoByYQMwiEAShhMGE&iact=mrc&uact=8

Edited December 17, 2016 by Il Grifone

[BernardTPM]

The Moko 0-4-0T is one I've never seen before.

P D Hancock used one of those bodies to make No.2 'Ian', building an 0-4-0 outside frame chassis for it powered using a Romford motor on its side, driving through a lay shaft. There's a drawing of it on p.70 of 'Narrow Gauge Adventure'.

[dunwurken]

In addition to the drawing there photographs of 'Ian' in the book.  

There are now a couple of replica's around, my own one is currently in the workshops getting ready for a lick of paint and the adding of handrails etc.   It started as a £0.99 purchase on e-bay [top photo below] and when finished will be similar to Rod Allcock's 'Ian' [lower photo below] though it will be painted in the later, lighter CMR green.

The body of the original 'Ian' still exists.  

The locos do appear now and again on e-bay but I have yet to see any of the open wagons which were also marketed under the MOKO label.  Further photographs can be found if you scroll down the page here  http://www.dream-tintoys.com/index.php?page=moko

Malcolm

 

 

[5050]

Thanks for the website link to Moko.  They made one heck of a range didn't they.  I wonder if they were to a constant scale? I'm sure I remember seeing examples of the construction and farm models in the shops at the time but probably didn't take to much notice as they weren't 'trains'.  Moses Kohnstam, I presume, was a relative of Richard Kohnstam who was an importer and agent for a lot of foreign manufacturers later on. 

 

As far as I can recall, I've never seen one of the Moko locos.  If I ever do and buy it I reckon I would do a PDH - but with a modern motor and gearbox.

[Flying Pig]

Nobody has yet mentioned the most significant fact about the Budgie Jinty, which is that it was an extra in every episode of Bagpuss:

 

[melmerby]

 

 

 

I assume that was bought on e-bay from one of the usual suspects as in "mint" condition?

 

Keith

[5050]

Looks like it's covered in powdered mint!

 

Extra Strong anyone?

 

Just give it a quick lick................................

[Il Grifone]

Looks like it's covered in powdered mint!

 

Extra Strong anyone?

 

Just give it a quick lick................................

 

I know it's intended as a joke (and quite funny ), but the white powder is likely to contain Aluminium oxide, which is rather nasty stuff.

 

http://nj.gov/health/eoh/rtkweb/documents/fs/2891.pdf

 

https://www.dermaglide.com/aluminum-oxide/

 

It is rather difficult to stop mazak  producing this white powder.  My second (ex eBay) 'Bristol Castle' had several white spots on the body. Cleaning them off produced only a temporary cure. I think I've solved the problem by sealing them with paint, but....

Edited December 30, 2016 by Il Grifone