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Thanks Bill. I have used that site a few times and it has some wonderful views. As you say, a bit early for me and there were some big changes in that period, but fascinating nonetheless. Thanks, Iain

Thanks a lot Jason. The glazing improves it a lot, and much more effective than the SE Finecast variety I've used on a Replica BG. Is the Shawplan glazing for the Bachmann mk1 suburban just as good? I will need a good pile of suburbans of various types and these old Airfix ones do provide a reasonable basis for some of the LMS ones. I've heard that the Dapol ones aren't so good as one of the roof moulds was beyond repair so you do have to redo the roof. Tim has done some cut'n'shut conversions to different diagram numbers as well. I'd like to do more etched sides and fully etched coaches but the number of hinges, handles, stops and rails is prohibitive for the number of vehicles I'll need to end up doing. I'm happy doing some of the corridor stock that way, and will need to to provide particular vehicles for the different formations. John Kendall's article here gave me a load of really useful information too: http://bmrcm.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/LMS-Suburban-Coaches.pdf - especially for the underframe mods. Here too: http://britishmodelrailwayclubofmontreal.blogspot.co.uk/2012/03/upgrading-dapols-ex-lms-suburban.html I've started a coaching stock thread too. Not your favourite topic I know! But I can't get away from coaches if I choose to model Camden. Iain Edited to correct link

Hi Chris Indeed - the fictitious 64'6" BG with the wrong roof for anything at all, sides 3" thick and eccentric plastic wheels....... Step1 Accept it's totally useless and throw it away. Step 2 Retrieve it from the bin and measure the sides against some Comet etched ones (I'd added door hinges, stops and handles, then primed and painted these. Grab handles will go on after lining out). Get slightly more enthusiastic. Step 3 Attack it with a saw disc in the mini drill Step 4 Remove all useless ventilator detail and superfluous rain strips for a mk1 corridor second, Mark and drill new ventilator and toilet filler positions, then attach the skeletal sides to the roof. Step 5 Leave to dry and think about how much of the underframe needs butchery. Quick answer is all of it..... Iain

There is a big fiddle yard to fill, eventually, and many different trains to represent passing Camden Shed in both directions. Most of them are passenger, with a few parcels and very few goods trains. I'm just beginning this bit of the journey so, as with the layout build and the detailing and modification of locos, expect some slow progress. How to turn this: which I've had for about 100 years and left it in a box, into something useful? Iain

Do share some of your turd-polishing exploits Jason, even if only the results. I've got a few cheaply acquired examples of these to do as well, in part inspired by John Kendall (brossard I think?) who wrote an article on detailing the old Airfix ex-LMS suburbans. I'm just about to order some Shawplan glazing and Comet underframe components if it's worth it. Thanks, Iain

Thanks Arthur. I seemed to remember a general opinion of McGowan kits along those lines. A big thank you to Andy Y for pinning this thread. I'd better get on and do something worthwhile! After a busy and tiring 2 days attempting and only partly succeeding to visit people at various UK universities via our national rail network (it's remarkable that I got as much done as I did given the battles that Network Rail have had to fight), I got back this evening and had an hour doing something different. So much so that I may have to start a new thread. Iain

Thanks Ian, I didn't know that. I wonder as you say, how good was it? I'm leaning towards a rebuild of a Hornby Scot or Patriot but will consider anything! It's a way into the future, mind you. Iain

Yes, thanks Gordon, good reminder. That's a great site that I've perused before at length! Iain

I've really enjoyed your modelling here Mark. I'm trying to find out whether 44767 ever visited Camden......! Here is my go at 44687 http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/65335-motive-power-for-camden-shed/?p=1341868 Cheers, Iain

Spurred on by mark axlecounter's efforts at 44767, here is a bit about 44687, one of the Caprotti high running plate Black 5s. This one definitely visited or at least passed Camden in 1959. I did begin an account of this in a blog over 3 years ago now: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/653/entry-5089-caprotti-black-5-44687-hrp/ There is a fair bit of detail in there as to how I attempted this. The tender is a Comet part welded one with Ivatt vents and roller bearing axle boxes. I modified the inner Hornby chassis so that the Comet tender outer frames and body sit on that, which seemed to work pretty well - indeed I might try it for a few more Black 5 or other Stanier tenders. The difference from the flawed Hornby tender body is considerable. I did get around to painting and lining it, but no weathering, coal, lamps or crew yet. Iain

Hi Stanley, Thanks - I'm not going to rebuild it in its current guise, but, if and when we move, I may consider adding more elements in v2 like the beginning of the dive under, the electrification of the slow lines, more of the goods depot etc, but it will depend on the space available. As it stands, it's my first layout to get anywhere near scenic stages and I'm happy both now and in the future to make some sensible compromise in context. I do notice from your previous pic that I didn't quite get the colour of the buildings adjoining the station, and may consider repainting. You're beyond kind to mention me even in the same sentence as Vincent. Take a look at this pic: This is similar to one of the photos in MRJ172. It really is the most spectacular portrayal of the great vista of Camden Bank. Looking here from Parktown, down past Mornington St bridge, to a Granby Terrace, it both looks and works (or will do when complete!) just like Camden Bank of the 1950's. There is Deltic Prototype (weathered by Tim Shackleton) with 9 or 10 on and completely lost in that great expanse of urban mainline. The whole thing is exquisitely crafted. Handbuilt interlocking lever frames, bespoke milled and turned operating mechanisms under the board for the turnouts and signals, etched coaches, beautiful EM track, scratchbuilt signal boxes out of plasticard as good as anything on the signal box thread. It was originally wired for a pioneering type of radio control but Vincent has now rewired it for DCC. There are 3 other sides to the loft too...... The shed area that I am doing occupies around half of one of the long sides. I think it bears comparison with any of the astonishingly good layouts on here or at shows. I've done very little recently, which is a bit frustrating, but there we go. So, for inspiration, a few pics from various freely accessible places on the web and eBay auctions, none of them mine: Good subject matter for the future. Iain

That's kind of you Jeff - I didn't know Camden rated in such company as that! I've not posted much on KL (I've not posted a lot anywhere to be honest!) but I follow every day or so (I'd never keep up if I left it any longer....) I'm really intrigued to see KL2 take shape in due course. At some point soon we hope to build our own place, and a home for Camden Shed is a priority, whether in current form or v2. So there is much to interest me as the RMWeb equivalent of War and Peace racks up the pages. Iain

That pic is off the charts Stanley! Thank you - I've never seen even that angle before - looks as if the photographer was on the shed roof? But to have that bright sunshine and all the details that are normally obscured is wonderful. It makes me realise that the compromises that I had to make in the background - with the station building and associated structures - are quite significant, if ultimately necessary. I start thinking of a rebuild including the dive under of the two slow lines in the centre, plus the 3rd/4th rail.....and the retaining walls and railings...... I wistfully imagine that I could include the goods lines between the station and the up fast....... But I can't! The two leading non-corridor coaches are ex LMS I think? I have just bought a few cheaply to mess around with. I have an article from the Barrowmore site written by John Kendall on upgrading the old Airfix LMS suburbans, including some Comet bits and pieces. http://bmrcm.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/LMS-Suburban-Coaches.pdf The subject of a future post or two I hope.... Holiday? Nice thought if a bit distant..... I'm not complaining in the slightest. I do get thoroughly decent holidays, but only when I'm told. In term time it's 7 days a week and most evenings. I'm taking a school trip in both the next two holidays too. And yes, it is a different school to most! However, after a long weekend I do get 2 hours in the shed this evening.... Iain

Hi Terry and Stanley, Thanks as ever for your kind words and encouragement. I've got a lot to do still, and most of the locos need some significant detailing and weathering. Great recommendation about Rod Steele's book! I hadn't spotted it before, but managed to get a copy quickly. I've got about 5-600 photos now, and many of them are used in the book. But there are many new ones too, and a there are quite a few details clearly visible that I haven't already got. I've done literally nothing in the past two weeks due to work. But here is one thing I'd not mentioned before: Making the wheels for the narrow gauge ashpit wagons. I've got a few z gauge wagon axles, with wheels about 4mm diameter. File down the brass pinpoints and then solder 4mm hand wheels from an MSE etch to the faces. By the time they are covered in ash, they should be ok I hope. Iain

Thanks Brian, that's very kind. I'd love to see any film that you might have, as and when you get the chance. I've got a few clips on various DVDs, but not a huge amount. That pic of Duchess of Norfolk is wonderful, isn't it? I've used it once before, and I ought to try to recreate it again, now that I've got a bit more of the layout done. I've completed and laid the formation I was building a week or two ago. This is while the glue was setting: And then when dry: I won't know for certain how it runs until it's wired and I can run locos under power, but test bogies and loco chassis run through ok without any tight spots. It isn't completely perfect, but the prototype was anything but. No loco will go through the reverse settings and diamonds at anything more than walking pace anyway, so hopefully we will be ok. It is such a characteristic feature of Camden that it makes me feel I'm getting somewhere just to get this bit done. Turntable: A Peco item, significantly modified. This one was bought (badly) built for less than a tenner, so I didn't feel too bad about attacking it. Having said that, it would have been a whole lot easier as components. Brick facing to the pit wall: To accommodate this, the table itself needed shortening. Razor saw to cut a slot: Then solvent to reattach the ends to the shortened girders: Beginning of the operating platform: More to do here..... Signal box getting closer to completion: I haven't done the interior yet, but have decided to make it separately in a detachable box: That way, I can attach the box to its locking room base on the scenic board to the rear, and add the interior later. And finally, a couple of Tony Wright couplings in a parcels rake. These need painting and weathering, but I'm very pleased with the appearance, running qualities and flexibility. And they cost virtually nothing at all. Iain

Not sure how I managed to miss this one, but thanks to gordon s for alerting me! Firmly on the follow list now..... I'm a bit further across North London, but there is a good deal in common, and a huge amount for me to learn from your superb modelling. Thanks, Iain

Hi Phil, Thank you. The turntable begins as a Peco item, but will be modified in several ways. It's a long way from being perfect, but the Metalsmith Cowans and Sheldon 70' turntable isn't available yet, and I need to make a compromise here. I'll post a bit of progress later I hope - as it happens, I have only this morning started work on the turntable. Camden in P4? Wow, I wish you well with the negotiations on space: it will be a great pleasure to watch your progress, if you can keep us updated. I've made several compromises in terms of space and trackwork complexity on the mainlines, not to mention losing the 3rd and 4th rail on the slow lines, and a huge amount of the goods station. An perfect project for me would be the whole area from Regents Park Road bridge to the Goods Depot footbridge - as I have done here - but to scale. I'd thought about it in EM, as I think I might eventually be able to cope with the tolerances, but never allowed myself to dream of doing it in P4. Best wishes, Iain

Thanks to Jeff, Mike, Grimleygrid, Cutler2579, Richard and Jol for their kind words and encouragement. Richard - wonderful picture as ever, of 70033 ascending the bank. If that is without enhancement, it speaks volumes for the quality of the photography originally. Hi Jamie, Yes, I did clock that. To be honest the Bachmann chassis and cab area are so far ahead of the Hornby version that I'm likely to use at least these parts. Having said that, the new Railroad Crosti cab and front spectacles do look considerably better than the old 9F. The side chimney and manifold on those pre-production pics look exceptionally good, so if I were doing an original Crosti, I would definitely use those. The key bit is that the main boiler barrel (the only one on the rebuilt version, obviously) is a smaller diameter than the standard 9F, and sits a little higher. Hence the chimney is very squat and contributes considerably to the look of these. The Crownline conversion kit (I actually have one of each, rebuilt and original Crosti) doesn't quite cut it as it uses the standard boiler, firebox and smokebox. So I'm leaning towards an amalgamation of the Bachmann chassis, running plate and cab, with a Railroad firebox, boiler and smokebox. This won't be the cheapest way to do it, but it will probably be the most accurate available to me. Either way, this is a fairly low priority so I will wait a while and see what the Hornby one looks like. There is a lot else to do before that. Happy New year to you, and all RMwebbers. Iain

Hi Mike, Already watching and will look forward to seeing this develop. Mainline passing MPD.......sounds familiar and very close to home! Hope all is well. Iain

Spent a few hours on the three turnouts and two diamonds with all their associated checkrailing. In progress 1: And in progress 2: And as a Merry Christmas to all followers of Camden Shed, here is a glimpse of what I hope I'm on way way to achieving, given that most of these need a lot of detailing, renumbering and weathering. One of them even needs painting...... Apologies for the picture quality, which seems to diminish as I resize and compress them. I'll try to do better. In no particular order...... No lamps yet. I'm a good way off that stage. And any loco in the S end of the yard would have a good load of coal on...... It's a Sunday with a special excursion on the down fast out of Euston headed by 92220 Evening Star, an up express coasting down the bank with 46256 Sir William A. Stanier F.R.S. in charge, and a full yard. 70008 (picked up slightly damaged and unboxed for £35!) will be renumbered and renamed to 70033 or another, with this tender and these deflectors, which was a regular. 92056 - seen many times so far as a test loco. Single chimney BR1C. 73139 - Caprotti Standard 5. Needs a new number. 44781 - Black 5. Will be renumbered and repainted, or possibly just rebodied and this body sold. I did this one from the Brassmasters detailing kit before I knew much about what I was doing. There weren't any unlined Black 5's in 60-62. 70049 - will probably remain as is but may become 70047 or 70048. Needs a late crest on the tender, and a new loco-tender connection, as the Hornby one is so annoying. 46146 - The Rifle Brigade. There are two of these - will probably renumber and rename both, although I could get away with most Scots here. Brassmasters treatment awaits too. Fairburn tank - as yet unnumbered. There are a couple of possibilities. 44687 - HRP Caprotti Black 5 built from a Hornby donor, an old Crownline conversion kit, a Comet part welded Ivatt tender and a bit of scratchbuilding. Needs weathering. An old Replica/Bachmann Standard 4mt, which has been detailed and weathered, and miraculously still runs. I have a few Hornby bits and pieces to make a better one. I've a couple of nice pics of standard 4's on stopping trains to Bletchley. 92020 - rebuilt Crosti, made from a railroad chassis and half a faulty Golden Arrow body mated to the other half of a damaged Hornby body. I have a pic of 92020 at Bletchley in 1962 so it is only completely fanciful to include this, rather than being a total fabrication...... 92116 - earmarked as a donor loco to make a much better 92020. 92249 - I have two of these and need neither........! 46248 City of Leeds - seen before here, and needs weathering. It needs a new set of valve gear first: this set will not function properly. 46239 City of Chester - as yet unmodified but will probably keep its identity and get the same treatment as 46248 eventually. Hopefully without messing up the valve gear..... 47458 - An old Hornby Jinty, used to practise detailing and weathering. It won't last, and it doesn't work, as the brake gear I applied doesn't clear the rods. It will be replaced. Eventually I should have a couple of Jinties, mainly for moving coal and ash wagons around the yard. 44741 - LRP Caprotti Black 5, seen under construction this summer. Single chimney and lacking roller bearings. I haven't done the tender yet so this is mated to an incorrect Hornby early crest welded tender. 71000 - DoG. A primitive effort that will be consigned to a display cabinet in due course and replaced by a detailed and weathered Hornby one. There are the bits for 3 Rebuilt Scots/Patriots, one Brit, two Black 5's, one Coronation, one Standard 5 and a Standard 4 ready to be built in due course. Thanks for all the advice, support and encouragement, without which I would be struggling a lot more than I am. Wishing all of you a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Iain Edited for spelling....

Hi Richard, Wonderful pics as usual, thank you! I think it must have been harder to get to the NE side to take photos, and since almost all the locos would be facing NW unless they were snapped before turning, most pics will be lhs. The leading bogie wheel carried a speedo at some point in the late 50's, seemingly bracketed on the drain cocks? I don't have the exact dates. By the time I'm modelling, it had the speedo on the trailing driver. Farren - here is a pic of 46256 rhs showing the electric light cabling and generator etc. It is a tiny portion - less than 5% - of a beautiful shot on p. 98-99 of The Book of the Coronation Pacifics by Ian Sixsmith, showing 46256 at Camden in about 1950. The photo was originally taken from the Alec Swain/B.P. Hoper collection. I hope it's ok to post this. I'll remove it if not. Iain

Thanks Jeff and Mike, I'll see what I can make. Bit of a stand back and take stock moment. I'm now 2 years into the project. The shed was built in mid December 2011, and the first job was to insulate and line it. Current state of play is that I've completed almost all the track on the south end of the yard area, to add to the 4 mainlines and the fiddle yard which were already done. I've fully wired and tested it all, and it all works ok. A couple of slightly tight spots mainly attributable to b2b discrepancies on the test locos, but overall I'm pleased with it. It's all been painted and mostly has been ash ballasted, just a bit to go. So I only have the machine shop, the N end of the yard plus the turntable to do. I've started putting some rakes of stock together. Left to right there is: 1. Random rake of mk1s that need b2b checks, couplings and weathering. Not to mention filling with people. Trouble is, I need rakes to represent trains in both up and down directions, plus ecs moves to and from Willesden carriage sidings. So I haven't made a decision on that yet. 2. Complete 12 coach rake of mk1 class A stock. Roughly prototypical, with 1st class at the Euston buffer end, catering facilities in the middle and 2nd class at the north end. These have been checked, wheels cleaned and weathered according to the Tim Shackleton methods. They are coupled using the Bachmann close coupling pipes. It's the only rake I'll do that with, and I may change it to the Tony Wright method anyway. They run well, a 9F can pull them easily, but an unmodified pacific struggles. 3. 5 Hornby Staniers. These are straight from the box and need adding to, plus all the jobs mentioned in 1. above. They may well be mixed in with mk1 stock in particular rakes. I'll need some more, some Porthole coaches, and to do some more via Comet kits no doubt. 4. The start of a parcels rake. 2 mk1 BGs - one Bachmann and one Replica with flush glazing and detail added, plus a Bachmann Thompson BG. I have a Comet mk1 BG and a Stanier pd III BG to add, These all have the TW coupling mechanism which seems to work really well. They've been Kleared but not yet weathered. There are a lot of permutations of stock for top expresses and secondary services to do in due course. But I'm in no rush. It will just be nice to run a few trains. But there is a LOT of space to fill in the FY! Iain

Hi Farren, Hopefully this pic will help: As you say, clearance is tight between the AWS box and the trailing truck. I added injector pipe work from copper wire. The trailing tuck itself needed a little fettling at the front to clear the Hornby chassis block. According to what I've read in several books, the rebuilt Scots and Patriots used the 2A boiler. The two rebuilt Jubilees, (4)5735 Comet and (4)5736 Phoenix, also used the 2A boiler. The boiler on (4)6170 British Legion was a type 2, you're right. 10 11/16" longer than the 2A. I may have to work out a way to make that from scratch, when the time comes... Iain

Good point trustytrev. That's how I located a couple of other books come to think of it... I've been pondering the stop we've been discussing. This pic: which is just blown up from the previous one, seems to show the remnants of an older, normal sized stop? Or am I mistaken? Iain

Thanks very much Mike. I have some very clear views of that type of stop around the turntable. This one appears to have some kind of crosspiece too - is that possible or an illusion? These look like the guard irons would strike the stop before the wheels. I guess that's not the case. Iain