Dava

One of these would be my choice as a shortline steam loco.

This one is being restored by the https://www.industrialrails.org/ also on Facebook. Larger locos of this type were used as switchers by the PRR and B&O (I have a K16a) but some like this one were sold into industrial or shortline service.

Dava

Good to see the return of the Nottingham MRS Spring show in Hucknall.

Dava

I received the Hornby TT Club magazine yesterday and though I'd seen it online, the print version and catalogue are impressive marketing even though some of the details (Duchesses for £118.99) are incorrect. The market response seems to have been strong and its interesting to see from Rekoboy's post the scale of interest from German TT modellers too.

On Facebook there is a https://m.facebook.com/groups/britishtt/ with 1600+ followers. 

As a new scale; gauge combination in the Uk it has a number of strengths. I have modelled in TT-3 but the lack of new development led me into other areas and more recently 7mm scale. I'm actively considering TT:120 with a small project - I'm interested in smaller locos and lines, not roundy-roundy express trains. So the 08 will be a first Hornby purchase with a selection of goods stock. Its curious that the goods wagon offer doesnt really match the locos available & announced. But already we can see 3D print designers offering models rescaled to TT:120 and I hope more will print in the UK rather than being dependent on the very expensive Shapeways service.

I'd like to see someone - not necessarily Hornby - provide an 0-6-0 chassis which (like the TT-3 Jinty) could match a range of bodyshell kits or 3d prints. Even the tender-drive option which Union Mills offer in N gauge could work here. The scale needs the wider aftermarket of kits & add-ons to become viable scale, and hopefully PECO will lead this. I'm surprised they have not announced a few more wagon kits, but they may do this if the market looks attractive.

Dava

On 17/12/2022 at 14:43, F-UnitMad said:

Nostalgia Time.

 

As this year draws to a close, for a bit of a change this post reflects on some articles from 40+ years ago that had possibly the greatest influence on my modelling of anything ever published, even if it took a while for the results to show.

They were all written by Chris Ellis, for Model Trains magazine that he edited in 1980/81. I have the original mags still, but read these articles so much I ended up photocopying them to read the copies instead. I still enjoy looking back at them now.

 

First off from Feb & May '80, & Jan '81, the three articles Chris wrote that opened many UK modeller's eyes to American Short Lines - a whole world away from the 'typical' impression of US trains all being miles long with 5 engines on the point.

 

 

 

The other article, which it took me nearly 20 years to actually put into effect, was this one from May 1981.

An F-Unit & bobber caboose in the heading photo - what's not to like??!! The article also had Chris's Atlas Plymouth switcher in it. Years later he sold me this very loco, which as I have said before, I am very proud of, and named in his honour....

 

 

I remember those Model Trains articles by Chris Ellis on US shortlines, first time I’d heard of them, I bought the mag every month. It took me 40 years to catch up with NAm shortlines in 0 scale! Chris and Mike Andréss were very influential modellers, practical, easy to follow, economic, all plastic projects.
 

Sadly I bought a AHM Plymouth without realising how overscale it is, not sure what to do with it, like a Turkey in the nest!

Offers anyone?

Currently building a GE 25 Tonner which will be ‘right size’ for my shortline.

Dava

My teenage modelling years were much influenced by membership of the Macclesfield Model Railway Group and a number of inspirational and helpful modellers I learned a lot from. One was Ken Ball, building modeller supreme and of the Butley Town layout https://www.macclesfieldmrg.org.uk/2018/03/04/ken-ball-celebrating-60-years-of-model-making/

Another was Howard (Nobby) Clarke who also influenced many 016.5 modellers through the 7mm Narrow Gauge  Association and was always full of stories from his footplate years.Then there was the 3mm Society and 009 Society groups. Latterly, Jim Read with his 0 gauge microlayouts and scratchbuilding cheaply from card.

Dava

On 23/12/2022 at 22:12, F-UnitMad said:

I would dispute that. I just did a quick check - for the UK O gauge section, searching "Minerva" brought up one listing, for a set of 'Minerva' nameplates. "Ixion" showed 4 listings. "Industrial Steam loco" one listing. Even "diesel shunter" only brings up 15 listings, not all of them engines, and all of them at "buy it now/best offer" prices.

Hardly "awash", is it? No, maybe O isn't for everyone, but I doubt very much your speculation on the matter.

It’s easier to buy from Minerva direct, 3 industrial locos available. https://www.minervamodelrailways.co.uk/
 

Heljan industrial liveried 03s are discounted at present by Hattons & Rails. The Dapol Austerity is promised next year.

Dava

7 minutes ago, frobisher said:

 

One way or another, I can see that gap getting filled.  If Hornby have their existing recent suburbans in 00 any of which types would be more than welcome, but if the range gets enough traction to interest the "others" to dip in, the MK1 Subs would be very welcome, ditto the B-Set.

Gresley or Thompson suburban stock ideal, with N2 or N7 tanks!  My membership pack arrived today, without mag , good to see level of interest in TT120. I’ll place an order next month probably.

Dava

1 hour ago, Robin Brasher said:

I hope that the supply of models to foreign countries gets sorted out.  Meanwhile a friend soldered some connecting wires to a controller on my Hornby TT:120 track and I am pleased to report that we were able to run some old Tri-ang TT locomotives.  One example was a kit built BR class 5MT on possibly a Tri-ang 'Windsor Castle' chassis with a Britannia tender.  This ran very well.

Looks like a Britannia loco chassis as well from the valve gear, the Brit has an XT60 motor, the Castle motor is too wide for the Belpaire firebox which is why the Castle was so distorted. 
 

The new Hornby models are a huge advance in modelling fidelity from the original TT-3 of 65 years ago, probably more in the mechanical and electrical design than the body mouldings, where the best - the Brit, DMU, utility van and wagon bodies - have stood the test of time well. I moved away from TT-3 40 years ago because of the crude mechanisms, then used BTTB mechs as the basis for an 0-12 narrow gauge layout!

Dava

Dava

On 17/12/2022 at 18:04, Michanglais said:

 

I throw my hands up in despair!

 

TT is apparently not for me - not yet, anyway...

 

I tried to place a pre-order from France (again), in fact I pre-ordered 4 coaches, but because Hornby hasn't got the stock in and doesn't know in which order/groupings things will arrive, they applied a separate postage charge to each coach. I can see that they can't have hundreds of boxes in a warehouse somewhere with people's partial orders in them awaiting all items before sending. But, come on Hornby - €18 per TT scale coach is really on the steep side - nearly €80 postage for four, small-scale coaches, I don't think so. So all those pre-orders have been cancelled. I'll wait for stock to arrive and, if I miss out, I miss out. My interest in TT is for an eclectic collection of BR blue/Sectorisation locos and coaches so if I miss out on the odd item, it's not the end of the world, my French and Swiss modelling (in HO and N - just so that I can have the 'trio' :) will keep me and my credit card busy enough.

 

However, YET AGAIN, still no confirmation on avoiding double-VAT and added customs fees. Firstly, despite what Hornby's own site indicates, it's difficult to get prices in Euros. Don't know if anyone else has experienced this but, they state that if you set your default address as a Euro-currency country, prices will automatically display in Euros. They don't. It takes quite an amount of furious clicking to get Euro prices. Not the end of the world, just another example of saying "it will do this" and it doesn't, which just makes me doubt other 'claims'.

 

The pre-orders displayed VAT this time, but did not indicate whether this was UK or French VAT. I need this clarification for the French tax authorities should I get charged VAT upon arrival of the goods. No mention whatsoever of the Customs Fees that are claimed to be paid by Hornby. Once more, this information needs to be provided for the relevant authorities should the annoying double-charge occur. I included a request for clarification on this in the same email. As I have requested clarifications in all my emails to customer services. Yet again, it was ignored entirely. 

 

It was a short email (unlike this post) - two paragraphs, each paragraph a question. Okay, so maybe someone was having a bad day and forgot to answer the second question but until I get an email addressed directly to me confirming the 'VAT and Customs Fees paid' claim, I will not place an order (even when stock comes in). Hornby have simply lost my trust. I think I must have tried to place pre-orders four times now. Each time, I have got a different result - undefined VAT included/no VAT included/"you are eligible for free UK postage" (?!) or a plain and simple "order cannot be processed" message.

 

By only allowing ordering through their own website, Hornby need to make sure they have put all the necessary systems in place to provide the information that will be required either by the French/EU authorities, or by Hornby themselves, if I try to make a claim back from them. I have no idea what Hornby would do if I sent them a 'French VAT and Customs Fees charged' document.

 

As I've given up on the idea of pre-orders, there is at least some time for these issues to be sorted. With claims of 'Spring 2023' delivery for the first items I want that leaves - even if things are on time - a few clear months to iron out the order process. I just hope somebody at Hornby is taking note that incoherent things are happening during pre-order placement. Certainly my emails don't seem to be getting the message through and, yes, I could phone but, call me difficult - I want it in writing.

 

I'm vaguely tempted to try placing an order for something in OO to see what info that displays - to see whether it's just the TT ordering process that isn't working correctly or if all orders from EU States are troublesome.

 

Please, I would love to know, has anybody following this topic placed an order from an EU State since the 5th of July 2021, from when Hornby indicates it would be handling the VAT and Customs Fees side of things, and got the necessary information on their order page/an invoice, along with not getting any additional fees slapped on upon arrival/had trouble getting reimbursed by Hornby if this has happened?

 

Maximum frustration levels have been reached...

 

 

 

This does not augure well for Hornby succeeding in European markets with TT120 unless they rethink distribution methods and partners?

Dava

Thanks for sharing, interesting Swiss/Austrian predecessor of TT gauge! Great acceleration too.

Dava

Good luck, SB kits don’t have th best reputation for parts fit & quality.

One way of fitting windscreen & other windows is to trace the outline of the window from the  outside onto a sticky label On the glazing sheet, then cut out with a 0.5mm+ margin and finally trim to exact shape, fit with canopy cement. 
 

Dava

Does anyone know when the MMRS layout Chee Dale (or Chee Tor)  was built and when was this film made?

Thank you,

Dava

The heart & soul of Fleetwood Mac.

5 minutes ago, pH said:

Could it have been a ‘chip van’? That was a nickname given to steam railcars. Some of those, built for the CLC and operated on CLC services by the LNER, ran on local services from Stockport.

 

https://www.lner.info/locos/Railcar/sentinel.php
 

(The reference to CLC cars operating around Stockport is in the ‘Railcar Operations’ of that page.)

 

Dava posted some of this while I was typing.

The Sentinel railcars were also known as ‘camel cars’ in Scotland, my father rode one in Fife and on the Leslie branch in the 1930s. It took a while to work out that the name derived from the coach bodies being built by Metropolitan Cammell! 
Funny things, these names.

Dava

Steam tram locos and later Sentinel shunters of the Y1/Y3 type were sometimes colloquially known as ‘fish and chip vans’. 
 

The Wigtownshire Railway under Thomas Wheatley had some vertical boiler  tram engines in the 1880s, they were not successful. They came from the Manchester area. The Portstewart Tramway ones in County Antrim both survive if you want to see one in Cultra or Hull transport museums.

Dava

I think it’s great but some people dislike the marine firebox.

Looking forward to a gathering of NER H & K classes, or Y7 & Y8 in LNER currency.

Dava

4 hours ago, Pacific231G said:

That's true, tolerances don't scale, but RP25 has always seemed reasonably robust. For TT the NMRA recommended wheel profile is code 79 which has a flange depth of 0.51mm  and a tyre width of 2mm. 

According to their website, Müeller's RP25 wheels have  flange depth of 0.64 mm which is the flange depth (0.635mm)  for RP25 code 110 wheels, That's the type commonly used for H0 and if it's not too fine for that it certainly shouldn't be for the smaller scale.

Tillig do make eight-spoked wheels for H0m but they're 8.5 mm  tread diameter so a bit large for UIC/BR standard 920mm 3ft diameter wagon wheels in 1:120 scale (though didn't spoked wagon wheels tend to be a bit larger) These appear to be the same wheels that I have on my Tillig H0m wagons and, for some reason, they look far more pizza cutterish in photos than when I simply look at them. Those wheels are 2.25mm wide including the flange.

 

I do though also have a bag of Nine Lines 8 mm  diameter six-spoked wheels for 00n3. not far off for diameter though, being narrow gauge, possibly a bit heavy in the rims (as are the Tillig spoked wheels and the Nine-Lines wheel width and flanges look to be about the same as those).  The price label is in French francs so I must have picked them up at Expometrique a good few years ago and I think some of the French H0m kit makers may have used them. Nine Lines is sadly gone but 00n3 sources may still be a good place to look .

Dundas Models do Markits 8 & 9 mm 00n3 disc wheels with the same profile, I use them for 014, pushed out on the axles.

https://dundasmodels.co.uk/webstore/index.php/hikashop-menu-for-module-108/category/542-dundas-models-00n3-wheels-bearings

Dava

There is an Amberley book on MOD Railways by Michael Hitchen, it has details of the RNAD wagons and both ng and sg rail systems.

There is an IRS book, oop, on Army railways which included lots of steam locos, mainly Austerity tanks. 
 

Some Royal IOrdnance munitions depots had steam locos. I started a no longer available RmWeb thread in 2014 on the small Peckett ‘Yorktown’ 0-4-0ST of which ‘Teddy’ is the surviving example. A batch of these locos were built for munitions depot use. One later worked for Cadbury, anotherColmans Mustard. 
 

Note that the RNAD depots were for munitions storage and entirely separate from the munitions (Royal IOrdnance) factories and army depots. 
 

Dava

forgive iPad input errors 

46 minutes ago, Les1952 said:

 

The argument "this is the UK market" that is becoming synonymous with "We're happy to run narrow gauge and pretend it is standard, whilst criticising every misplaced rivet on the model".

 

TT3 is 4'0" gauge.   OO is 4'1.5" gauge and UK N is 4'4.4" gauge.  

 

TT:120 is 4'8.69" gauge.  Somewhat closer to scale than even EM gauge manages.

 

Les

It seems to me that if you want to model with a correct scale/gauge combination, TT120 is ideally placed between 2mm FS with 9.42mm gauge and 3mm  FS with 14,2mm. In both of these  you have to build the track and at least rewheel or kit or scratchbuild the chassis. I admire 2mm FS but it’s not for me. I don’t want to return to 3mm and working with legacy Bec, Peco and Triang rolling stock bodies and hand built chassis.

If Hornby produce BR steam/diesel ‘era 4’ smaller models such as an 0-6-0T, 1st era DMU or single unit railcar and type 1 or 2 loco with matching 10 foot wb wagons, it will have a lot of appeal. Maybe there is scope for slightly finer wheel standards (tread width & flange depth) if this won’t affect trackholding on curves?

Dava

Let’s not forget Wilko’s  later career, his ‘farewell tour’, miraculous life-extending cancer surgery, Game of Thrones, laconic humour, final two albums and being recognised at last as a cultural icon and not just Estuary but national treasury rogue we all loved. Worth two of any other R&B guitarists. 
 

Dava, promoted Solid Senders 1978. Virgin Records store didn’t sell a bleeding’ ticket!

I was at the GCR today and watched a Windcutter train if 16 ton minerals depart. I didn’t photo it as I’ve seen it many times but there is a display by the Windcutter group in the waiting room at Loughborough this weekend for the ‘Last Hurrah’ event.

The amount of distortion and bowing of the sides and ends on many wagons is noticeable. Generally from carrying ballast in their later BR or NCB years. This site shows examples. Easier to reproduce with etched brass or n/s bodies than with plastic, where heat and/or solvents can be used with care.

http://ukrailways1970tilltoday.me.uk/wagons_16t_mineral_wagon_gcr_page1.html

Also QW&W site & Rmweb weekly thread. 
https://quornwagonandwagon.co.uk/

Dava

11 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

 

Compared to what though? Ellis Clark bogie coaches are £230, Dapol mk1’s around £200. 

 

Slaters GWR 4 Wheeled 3rd-Class Coach  kit £86.50.

 

 

Dapol have been selling the brake vans with simpler detail and paint for £70-75 for the last few years so is £30 - 40

for a larger moulding, more paint processes and a few years inflation that unreasonable?

 

That Slaters kit of a similar prototype would be at least £200 - £300 from a professional builder and a good mahogany paint job would push that up more. 
 

 

It’s an observation. They are probably very good models if you want around 3 of them. My modelling interests have changed in the several years since they were announced and I won’t be preordering . I may pick up one or two later. We can all understand the cost pressures on manufacturers, they affect us as buyers too.

Dava

The little Nottingham MRS show last weekend was £5 for 7 layouts & 7 traders & demo stands. Busy too. 
I prefer local shows and won’t be going to Warley. 
 

Dava

The Rails advert still shows the unpainted EPs not the mahogany finish coaches.

Its been a long wait and over £100 per coach, Dapol ain’t cheap anymore. 
 

Dava

1 hour ago, russ p said:

 

That's a shame, is there any brakes preserved 

Not that I can see, BGs but not Brake Seconds.