latestarter

1 hour ago, BoD said:

You don’t necessarily have to use DCC to control your points just because you have a DCC controller.  Solenoid motors with a mimic panel at the controller end of your baseboard with switches, push buttons or  stud and probe via a capacitor discharge unit will work just as well.  

Thank God you put it in language a beginner like me can understand! Had you used any technical jargon, I would have been lost! 🤣

Now that my DCC layout is 95% ready, I have decided that I will 'power' some of the 18 points on the layout, maybe starting with 4 that I use most, and in such a way that allows me to stay at the controller end of the baseboard - so manual changing is not an option.
 

My local model shop guy suggested Hornby solenoid point motors, and a DCC accessories controller to be used with my Hornby Select DCC controller. That's as far as I've got, other than, if possible, I'd like to avoid buying a new main controller.

Can someone suggest if this is feasible and point me towards how it is all wired up - as simply as possible. :)

Thanks, Stephen

1 minute ago, RobinofLoxley said:

Pinning is essential in my book, although some people are very satisfied with just glueing the track in place. I use standard track pins, and I drill through the sleepers if necessary (1mm drill bit) so that I can press the pins into place rather than tapping them in. That is to avoid tapping the pin and suddenly its gone in too far, distorting the track, or causing damage near to point stretchers. Even with setrack elements, you can still drill xtra holes, sometimes even outside the rails if that is where they need securing. Some object to the visibility of the pin head, which happens when tapping lifts the black coating, so no tapping = black pin. Of course they often get painted in due course.

Thanks again Robin. Would you believe that I bought my first dremel-like power tool last week, I've just put the thinnest bit I have on it, and drilled some holes in the sleepers outside the rails and secured them. Again, it's not perfect but most of the time the Dapol large Prairie is passing through at about 15% power. 

On 08/07/2022 at 21:37, RobinofLoxley said:

I suggest when you run a loco over the point , if it stops, press down on the track in various places to see if that stimulates movement. If there is a poor connection somewhere it may suddenly 'make' and the loco starts.

 

I've just got around to testing your theory, and I reckon you're on to something! Using the first photo (in the OP) photo as a reference, the nearest rail to the camera is raised about 3 - 4mm off the baseboard. If I press on the sleepers sticking out from under the rail to the left of the plastic washer (now removed), I can get a 'stuck' loco to start up again. 

My issue is knowing exactly where and how to pin the track down. It seems to me that it needs to be lowered on that side, but presumably not too far!

4 hours ago, RobinofLoxley said:

Mr Latestarter, can I just ask if the stall happens on straight through or diversion, or both. You would expect it to be on divert but just checking.

 

Personally I wouldnt advocate removing any material as while it might help one loco it might make a problem on another. Where you coupled two locos and they went through OK, this is possible because the locos now restrict each others movement slightly. The test DCB referred to doesnt need them to be coupled (I'm ot 100% sure you did but the text suggests it).

Hi Robin, good to hear from you again. It's happening on straight-through. I haven't tried it on diversion.

Actually, the two locos were not coupled up when I ran through through 'together'. Maybe I misunderstood the advice on that point (pun intended). I ran one after the other, at the same time, with a few inches / seconds between the first one passing through and then the other.

As mentioned, the biggest headache I have with this, is that the problem is not 'easily replicated' (as we used to say when I studied research). It doesn't happen the same way every time. Sometimes the same loco will stick completely, or stick and move or not stick at all.

3 hours ago, john new said:

There were two things I actually cured -

 

1) I think the flange gap was a smidge too narrow, and I set it with a width of card that just fitted into the gap on other points.

 

2) the much more important factor that as moulded it was too short to actually guide the opposite side wheels through the point frog. The Hattons 66 was the main culprit as the lead wheel was riding up and over the pointed nose on the crossing frog and by slightly lengthening the new check rail (on the point’s straight side) that stopped the slight movement of the flange on that wheel/axle which was veering towards the curve and guided the bogie through where it was supposed to go. 

 

I am sure there should be a more elegant fix to the issue by using better points made to shallower angles/curvature but the DIY fix solved the problem - the check rail actually working to check the wheel.

 

Thanks again. I've copied this out and will have a proper read and a second look at the photos in the morning.

3 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

That looks fantastic for a first layout. You have done a great job.

Most of us will look back at our first layout & feel we have moved on. We learn something from each one, putting it right with the next & learning something more from that.

So we have all been through such issues as you are having now. Keep up the good work.

Thank you for the great feedback - and encouragement! :)

1 hour ago, DCB said:

It will be a right sod to replace the point, dremel the fishplates at the toe end with a slitting disc to extract the point, with luck if you lift the toe the heel fishplates will wangle clear and  prepare to lay the new one by removing the Hornby fixed fishplate,  and use  streamline fishplates cut down  so they can slide back under the rail ends of the STRAIGHT at the toe end, may need several chairs trimmed back to clear.

Thanks again. This is my first (ever) layout started 8 months ago at the age of 66. I knew nothing about model railways, or electrics, or making hills from bubble wrap, or static grass, or ballasting etc, etc when I started. I don't even own a Dremel. But, I like 'learning curves', so I'm going to buy one and give it a go.

 

46 minutes ago, john new said:

I had a similar problem with a Hornby point and the moulded check rail. Cut mine off and replaced it with a home made one cut from scrap rail. This is the relevant post but like with so many other posts the images are pending a reload.

Much appreciated. I looked at your other post but, as you say in it, it will probably make more sense to me when the photos are uploaded.

53 minutes ago, DCB said:

Does the loco stop because it loses contact or because it shorts out.   Put two locos on the track, if both stall its a short. if one stops and the other keeps going its lost contact.

I suspect its the missing rail allowing the narrow to gauge Lima and heritage Hornby locos to hit the end of the diverging rail due to the DCC clip.

 

Thanks for the suggestions! I don't have a 'heritage Lima' (I think you saw the weathered Bachmann Ivatt). I put my Hornby Ruston in front of the Dapol Large Prairie (recent model, bought in Jan 22) and ran them over the point together, at the 2nd power setting on the Hornby Select controller - slow, but not dead slow. They both ran over the point without stopping backwards and forwards. I tried this 3 times with no problems. This is the puzzling issue for me; one run can be fine and the next time they stop.

I've had a problem with Hornby standard points, in one way or another, since I started my layout 8 months ago. However, there is one particular set of LH points that is causing most of my locos to stick on them, at slow speeds. The only loco (including Hornby, Bachmann and Dapol) that doesn't stick is the tiny Hornby Ruston shunter.

I have tried several remedies, including making sure the track is dead level with washers and rubbing down parts of the plastic frog (see photos). Sometimes (the same) loco will pass very slowly both ways, but then forwards but not backwards, and then, on other occasions, not at all.
 

1) Could it be the plastic channel at the closest rail in the photo?
 

2) Would it be a real problem to remove and replace that point in the layout, as I have it now? If not, could I replace it with a straight?
 

Ignore the missing rail in the close up image. It fell off yesterday, but the function of the point has not changed, for the better or worse.

Thanks for any suggestions.

Thought you might like to see the programming track I came up with...complete with a station, road, 70's saloon, wiring and rubber feet! A mini layout in itself! I think it counts as 2nd build, ever. Overkill maybe?

 

I had my Dapol Class 5101 'Large Prairie' 2-6-2T 4134 on a new 'programming track I made, yesterday, to change the address. It has since started making a strange, low whirring noise when running. It's DCC but not TTS.

I changed other addresses on other locos and they are not making similar sounds. A short video showing the issue IS AT THIS LINK

Thanks in advance for any suggestions as to the cause and cure.

1 minute ago, smokebox said:

Lay down a length of track, connect it to the output terminals, Track A & B, of the Select.

 

Make sure the connections from the Select to the main track are disconnected though, otherwise any locos on the main track will also be programmed.

 

There are various ways of connecting switches to avoid having to move wires around to make it easier.

That's simple enough, even for me. Thank you very much!

I'm trying to find instructions for making a simple, portable DCC programming track, for use with a Hornby Select controller and, ideally, with the one I have connected to the layout. Or, I could buy a 2nd controller if needed.

The YouTube videos I've seen are over-complicated for my limited electronics and layout building knowledge and skills. Can anyone point me to a straightforward how-to guide please?

8 minutes ago, RAF96 said:

Select effectively programs on the main as it only has a track output not a dedicated programming out, hence it can only write to CVs not read them back.

The CV you are looking for is CV150 which at default is zero and needs changing to value 1 which cures most jerky locos.

Thank you!

20 minutes ago, johnd said:

 

Maybe of interest to you but have you downloaded the instructions for this sound file from Digitrains, it may help with the CVs.

 

I note that the volume CVs go from CV517  to CV692 with function Overall Volume up and being on F keys 27/28 respectively 

 

Paul Chetter who wrote the files may be able to further put you straight as it was he who wrote the files etc.

 

good luck

 

Thanks for that, do you have a link to the instructions, as I can't find anything on the Digitrains website - I've been looking before you replied, and again just now. The 2 page sheet I have, is for the decoder as I stated in the OP. The CV for volume is listed as 266. there's nothing about CV's 517 to 692, or overall volume functions (F27/28) on it.

UPDATE: I found the 'notes' by @pauliebanger on the ZS002A 2MT ACTIVEDRIVE SOUNDFILE FOR ZIMO DECODERS page on the Digitrains website, and have printed it. I'm still trying to find something about overall volume levels, but this is all very new to me!

I bought a pre-owned Bachmann Ivatt 2MT class Ivatt fitted with (according the paperwork) 'Digitrainsound Standard Class 2MT Multi-Drive version 1.0 TTS decoder by Paul Chetter' @pauliebanger .

The main sound functions (F1/On-Off, F2/whistle etc) seem to work fine, other than F5 - the 'sound set toggle', which to my ears makes no difference in the chugging sounds at all.

My main issue, is that I can't get the CV's to work, when used with the Hornby Select controller (Version 2.0). For example, CV 266 on the Zimo is to adjust volume but no matter which setting I try up to 255 (max) it always sounds at the same level (probably about 3 on a scale of 1 to 10). It won't even turn off.

I'd welcome any thoughts on what the issue might be. I've successfully adjusted CV's on Hornby decoders with the Select controller.

16 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

The Select can change CVs but does it allow you to read them? Changing them 'blind' is not always ideal because you don't know what you are changing them from.

The clue to my level of experience is in my forum name. So I know nothing about CVs, or changing them.

But I don't think I've done too badly to go from knowing absolutely nothing at all about model railways 8 months ago, to the layout in the photo above I completed a month ago. 

I'm at the stage where I am trying to make it run smoothly and well enough for me to actually play trains. I'll think about more advanced gear a bit further down the line (pun intended). Bank balance allowing. My next plan is to motorise the points, over the winter. 

1 hour ago, Hilux5972 said:

Check that it’s on the highest speed step setting. 128 is the highest and best. Are you using a controller that can change CV’s? https://support.Hornby.com/hc/en-gb/article_attachments/360015924940/4-1504c_class_a4_sound_manual.pdf

 

Thank you very much for that. Yes, I'm using the Hornby Select; fairly basic but it's version 1.6 which does allow for CV changes. That might be the problem, because I've done some already but can't remember which locos.

I've got 6 locos on the layout right now (all I possess), so I've have a got at your settings in the morning, as it will take a while to remove and then re-rail the others.

 

Can anyone advise if there are CV's I can set for smoother slow running of the R3395 TTS 'Railroad' Mallard? I find it runs fine most of the time, but it gets very jerky when trying to couple to carriages and wagons.

Thanks for any suggestions.

56 minutes ago, LMSfan72 said:

The bottom photo, the more tarnished grooved rod at the top looks bent to me and may bee jamming underneatht the body/valve gear

That did it! Thank you very much. I tried to flatten it the best I could, and it's running very smoothly now. Tips on how to get it very flat, would be much appreciated. Thanks again for the help :)

I was running my 'Aberdonian' today and it started making a click noise from the wheels/rods. It then froze completely and hasn't moved since. The wheels also do not rotate at all when pushed by my fingers.

I have had an issue with the rods jamming in the past, but can usually see where they are overlapping or have come out of a 'slot'. I can't see anything amiss right now. 

If anyone could look at the photos and tell me if they can see the cause, I'd be very grateful!

56 minutes ago, eldomtom2 said:

If I Recall Correctly.

Google is useful for such terms.

TY but DTYGTSE

9 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Mine currently are. Must admit it's not one I use often as it was bought for an industrial layout that's not built yet. But I have ran it around with a handful of wagons. ISTR I did need to slightly enlarge the slots though. I think I just used a bit of emery paper. I'll eventually fit proper coupling hooks from someone like Smiths at some point.

 

It's definitely designed for fitting tension lock couplings though, as there are three in the little packet in the box. As well as the other bufferbeam infill plate for those using scale couplings.

 

For removing the wagon I think you first needed to carefully disconnect the electric socket at the wagon end, then do the same at the loco end. Especially if you might want to put them back at some point. Then I think I had to remove the loco body to get at the rod that connects the wagon to the loco. Then I think the tension lock coupling fits into the place where the rod was.

 

I know you have virtually got to that point already.

 

Might be a bit more clearly described here.

 

 

 

Jason

Thanks for all the advice Jason. I'll look in the box to see if the couplings are there, when I'm back home. Not sure what ISTR is - abbreviations are definitely not my thing. Could be from teaching under-graduates to write essays with proper English :)

The rod connecting the wagon broke away a few months ago, and I removed it. I asked Hornby for a replacement, but they (eventually) sent me the connecting wires instead, which were not damaged in the first place.

BTW (my only abbreviation), I know Southport very well. I'm originally from Prescot, but now live in another 'port', Portmagee, in South Kerry, Ireland.