LNER4479

Evening all. Been doing some planning for the north end of Garsdale, as indicated above. Quite like an opinion or two, if I may, especially from any who might be familiar with the location. I am very familiar with it myself(!) but just wanting views as to whether I've made best use of space available to create as effective a vignette as possible. As ever, the dreaded 'C' word - 'compromise' (had you wondering for a moment!) - looms large. Here's a general view of the site showing how the 'to be built' section will link in to the existing (but yet to be completed) Garsdale Boards. Not very apparent (but it is there) is the trackbed of the line to Hawes which will disappear behind the mainline scene. This was one of the 'red line' aspects of the overall plan, in the sense that I wanted to include the gradual curve north of the station, as it passes over Dandry Mire viaduct, followed by the distinctive A684 road bridge before disappearing into the handy Moorcock tunnel. Right, getting into the detail now. The very temporary, wobbly boards show in the pictures above were marked out and have been turned into slightly more accurate templates. These are set out on a 90 degree, six foot radius curve so I have a total track length of nine feet to play with. Taking that in an anti-clockwise direction from 12 o'clock (where the to-be-built section joins the existing tracks, the first two feet is used up with the trailing crossover at the end of the down loop. I've then allocated three feet to a depiction of the viaduct, a further foot or so until the road bridge with the remaining length to allow for the land to rise from below the railway to take it into the tunnel. Here are the mock-ups for the viaduct and the road bridge. It might not look too bad ... until I tell you that the real Dandry Mire viaduct is 12 arches and even my reduced length actually scales out a 50% of the size it should be, even at 8 arches. The distance from the viaduct to the road bridge is also ridiculously short! It's when you put a train on it that the relative size becomes apparent. To try and keep some sense of scale, I've mocked the road bridge as 80% full size. Any smaller and two road vehicles wouldn't fit side-by-side without looking silly. This is a popular viewpoint of the prototype, showing both viaduct and road bridge in shot. Doesn't look too bad, maybe? And a view looking the other way, with some crude blocking in to show more of the overall effect. Am I worrying unnecessarily? There's two things I could play with. I could compromise further with the viaduct, reducing it further to six arches but occupying the same space, such that it is more like two-thirds scale rather than 50%. The other concerns the afore-mentioned down loop. Going back to that for a moment: This shows the total length of the loop and (I've just measured it), it's a very modest 34" between the left hand and right hand points. That's a paltry 10 wagons; by the time a loco is taken into account (say an 0-6-0 4F goods loco), that's probably a maximum of seven wagons. It should of course be MUCH longer. I'm tempted therefore to lose the left hand trailing crossover (such the the loop just becomes a siding) which would thus allow the viaduct to start sooner and could therefore possibly be a little larger. Any thoughts?

Wonderful! And quite a lot of footage at Carlisle too so that's made my day (although the photographer's panning technique needs some work). The Coronation Scot and Midday Scot departed Euston within half an hour of each other so would have perfectly suited the photographer. Some invaluable moments of the formation and vehicle types for the latter as we're working on a pre-war version of that train for Shap.

Can confirm that - a still from that piece of film is in the book 'The Colour of Steam - The LMS Pacifics' [Derek Huntriss, Atlantic Transport Publishers, 1988]. It is indeed 6227 and it is also a Euston platform end departure shot. One strongly suspects therefore that it was captured by the same filmmaker on the same day, given the rarity of pre-war colour cine film. Interestingly, the caption quotes the date as being 1938.

As last posts on pages often get missed, I'll just repeat the following information for t-b-g, which is also pointing to more of a mid-1950s date: Following up on your comment re mixing the pieces of film, the piece with the shunter (or was it the fireman?!) climbing out after coupling up shows a non-streamlined tender (giveaway is rear steps and lack of extended side sheets). 46247 being an ex-streamliner would have had a streamlined tender ... or would it? Interestingly, the records in the Ian Sixsmith book 'The book of the Coronation pacifics' show that 46247 ran with a streamlined tender - until Dec 1952, whence it towed a non-streamlined tender (No. 9749, originally built for 6231). So, if that info is correct, then it's a different loco ... or 46247 from 1953 onwards?

First of all - enjoyed watching the video, especially the pre-war colour footage. I've see stills from that footage but never the actual film itself. Thanks for sharing the link. Following up on your comment re mixing the pieces of film, the piece with the shunter (or was it the fireman?!) climbing out after coupling up shows a non-streamlined tender (giveaway is rear steps and lack of extended side sheets). 46247 being an ex-streamliner would have had a streamlined tender ... or would it? Interestingly, the records in the Ian Sixsmith book 'The book of the Coronation pacifics' show that 46247 ran with a streamlined tender - until Dec 1952, whence it towed a non-streamlined tender (No. 9749, originally built for 6231). So, if that info is correct, then it's a different loco ... or 46247 from 1953 onwards?

Good evening, Tony Looks you came across one of the issues with the LRM GNR 'horseshoe' tender that I've also just encountered with my D2 build. I think 'as built' it represents the original GNR configuration. After close perusal of photos at my disposal (RCTS 'green' book plus relevant Loco Illustrated), it looks like the LNER had made modifications to increase capacity, resulting in the front coal plate being further forward. In LNER days, most pics show the toolboxes being retained, but higher up, immediately behind the coal plate. I modified things as shown for my version (as of Saturday night). In my research, I came across the following picture showing the GNR tender under restoration that is now with the Stirling Single No.1. Possibly never a 'horseshoe' tender at all as the water space has either been modified or is a different shape altogether, with the coal opening higher up. The usual minefield!

'Twas attributed to a bad batch of flux. Now eradicated.

That's the one, Frank. A Paul Craig production, with assistance from the late Malcolm Crawley. Not too difficult to remove Graeme, as there isn't any additional structure other than the basic sideframe etch. I have indeed done this before and it will be the third 4-4-0 loco I've built so fitted. My D2 already running on Grantham has the same arrangement fitted. Some pix below from that build. Note the light spring also fitted close to the front axle. This is there to ensure that the middle and front wheelsets stay in contact with the rail (rather than just being left to flop around) whilst still leaving some room for the press down effect. Adding weight to the front of the tender obviously increases the latter effect. These were all posted previously on page 20 of the thread, in July 2013 - keep up, chaps!

The Covid challenge continues ... Time to switch to the tender, to catch up with the loco Day 9 (27th April) This isn't in the instructions! These are the inner frames, being ... er ... modified. All will be revealed in a moment. Frames being assembled via the simple expedient of some 8BA nuts n bolts. Now assembled. OK, so the idea here is that these frames are effectively pivoted via the rear axle, hence the pointed axle ends, with the other two plain. As built, the frames are intended to be fixed to the main tender body so the 'mod' was to remove the top 2mm or so of the frames to allow for the up and down movement. Day 10 (28th April) Basic tender body assembled - the tank body is one single piece which has to be bent to shape so as to fit into the half etch recess in the tender base piece. Day 11 (29th April) The interior pieces fitted and the mainframes prepared. Frames now fitted. This shows the bearings fitted to the rear axle end, ready for the ... Trial fitting of the inner frames. This shows how the tender body can move up and down at the front end, the concept being that the tender drawbar will rest on the rear of the engine to transfer some weight to assist with the balance and traction of the loco. Day 12 (30th April) Some tender detail work - rear buffer beam (together with devilishly fiddly gusset assemblies!) Tank top details - lifting lugs, toolboxes and rear filler. Day 13 (1st May) The distinctive but tricky tender tank flare, here shaped and ready to be fitted. The instructions (yes, they do get read on occasions) recommend starting with the middle section - who am I to argue? How did I set this up ready for the all important first solder? Sellotape! The solder takes before the Sellotape has time to melt. simples. Now all soldered up but yet to be cleaned up. A lower down view shows off the flare and also shows the method of filling in the curved corner. It'll be even better once cleaned up. More again in a few days ... nearly two weeks in; will I beat my five week 'record'?

Evening, Tony, I know you never mind constructive criticism and the pictures of LNER 'O's have reminded me of something I hope you don't mind I've noticed with some of your model photos. The weathering of No.63987 is indeed very realistic - but what about the front number plate?! I know you use the Ian Wilson ones for all your locos as the type face and size are spot on. But a dab with the dry weathering brush perhaps? On the prototype, virtually every trace of white paint on the numbers has disappeared under the grime. The same criticism could be levelled at my own BR models, mind you ...

We've all gone loopy?

I have a copy of an article in Railway Modeller April 2005 Tony, featuring the L&Y 0-6-0s. Covers the Class 27 (the so-called 'A class') and Class 28 with drawings for both; also for the superheated version of the A class with extended smokebox. If you don't have that issue to hand then I'm sure we can sort out getting a copy over to you. Meanwhile ... I was never going to be as fast as you but this is Day 8 (as of ... er ... early hours of this morning!) of my Covid D2 challenge so quite pleased with progress so far. No motor in it yet, mind.

Continuing with the Covid LRM D2 project ... Day 5 (Thursday 23rd April). The superstructure starts with the footplating being erected on a folded up cradle which includes the valances. Day 6 (Friday 24th April). Cab and splasher parts prepared for assembly. Lockers doors and spectacle plates a-fastened and splashers folded and soldered. And duly assembled on the footplating (splashers just tacked for now) Day 7 (25th April) Boiler / smokebox parts prepared for assembly (error in folding the wrappers subsequently spotted and corrected!) All but final wrapper soldered up. Day 8 (26th April) I wouldn't normally show blobby soldering like this(!) but it gives an indication of the amount of individual solder joints and subsequent filing back required. In places, the solder is used as a filler but the fit of parts was generally very good so it was just a case of going steadily a small bit of time, pressing the wrapper in place until the solder holds. Phew, that's better! Quite pleasing final shape, nice and tight, symmetrical and remaining cylindrical despite 3 build up layers. And there we are. Footplating removed from cradle and boiler placed in position. Washout plugs have also been added. I'm leaving the boiler removeable for now, Next up - the basic tender construction.

Good for you, Jamie. Do feel free to share any pictures you might have on the thread

2nd class as well as 3rd! Interesting. Also interesting that virtually all of the droplights are open. Fully. Presumably a hot day! Yes, I suspect I need to add them. No great hardship! Many thanks.

Thanks Tony, I have actually built this kit previously, albeit the saturated version. Mind you, it was over five years ago! I have No.4329 to hand to remind myself how I did it. Including enlarging the front bogie wheel frame cut outs... Last night's efforts got me to the same stage as your third pic (footplating fixed to valance). When complete, we'll have five of these ex-GNR D2/D3s available for service on Grantham.

Oh that I had seven hours in a day to do nothing else than build a kit!! Nonetheless, I have started as I mean to go on, as indicated a few nights ago. This the result of 4 consecutive days of 1-2 hour, late night sessions(!) I'm going to try and do a bit each day. Full story on the Grantham thread but I'll keep popping back here with progress.

Well, me hearties. Life's changed a bit since the last post on here! Taking advantage where I can of the enforced lockdown situation, and despite the layout not being set up at the moment, some rolling stock progress to report. Firstly, the Quint set. Prior to Southampton, I'd managed to do some further work on the brake vehicles so now the equivalent work on the intermediate vehicles, fitting the truss rods, brake cylinders (on two of them) and gas tanks. And then windows. Jeez, that's a tedious job. No opportunity to put a strip in, due to compartment divides and doors so each one is cut and stuck in individually. I've tried to get the camera to catch the light in this photo so you can see that they're actually there - probably seen best on the left hand vehicle due to three of the droplights being at various open positions. I also did the brake vehicles as well, while I was at it. In the extremely unlikely setting of the Westmorland hills, the set thus poses for a 'complete' portrait. Well, I say 'complete' but they really need their class numbers on the doors … don't they? A search of pictures from the 1930s (at the end of their life) is a bit inconclusive. Aside from most pictures being too loco-centric to detect any door numbers, other photos are unclear and I'm wondering if they just didn't bother at the end with such older coaches? Or was it still 'sacrosanct' (presumably to at least show first class versus third) and they should be there?. I have to admit that it does look a little 'bare' when viewed like this... Meanwhile, with the set at least looking uniform, I've decided to build a loco to pull it! Not that we're exactly short of locos you understand, but I have had the kit in stock for some time and sourced all the motor/gears and wheels needed so if I don't build it now then when it is ever going to get built?! In fact, I've decided that this should symbolically be my 'Covid' project, so we'll have some thing to show for it when the present ghastly business is behind us. Ladies and gentleman, I give you ... Yet another GNR 4-4-0 'D' loco! T'will be the fifth available for service on the layout, a superheated D2, to go with my existing saturated version. Tony Wright has already built one of these as well for Mark Allatt. And I resolve to try and build a bit of it each day and try and beat my current 'record' for a kit build, a mere five weeks! So here we go ... Day 1 (Sunday 19th April). Basic chassis parts freed from fret and cleaned up ready for assembly. Day 2 (Monday 20th April) - coupling rods sweated together then all in the Poppy's jig for assembly. Out of the jig and further detail parts added (ashpan sides, rear springs and brake shaft brackets (rear)) Day 3 (Tuesday 21st April) - Brake hanger shafts and rear brake shaft parts added (not apparent in this view) and bogie frames assembled. Day 4 (Wednesday 22nd April) - bogie completed (axle bearings, tie rods and front guards fitted). I'm going to switch to the body super-structure for a bit now as I want that to hand when I'm working out best configuration of the motor and gearbox. More soon!

Six Bells junction has the Chester tour down as 27th April 1963: http://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630427r2.html As there is an image of a tour ticket bearing this date then that seems pretty likely - has there been some digit transposition in the RCTS records (27/4/63 --> 24/7/63?!)

I don't see how it can be a combination of Dore / Bradway. If you look again at the station picture ... ... you can see the parapet of a short viaduct / long bridge so the railway looks to be crossing a river or road approaching the station - you can see the trees to the left of the railway obviously growing from a level lower than the station. That doesn't 'fit' Dore at all, as it's all in a deep cutting south of the station as well as a significant curve. Nothing immediately springs to mind at the moment; I'll keep head-scratching - I love 'spot the location' puzzles!

Fascinated by the Midland Railway tunnel conundrum. Not sure it's on the Peak line at all. Will keep researching. Meanwhile, here is my Covid work achieved so far: Work on making the connecting lines to the Shap Bank scene on my Carlisle scheme... Test build for the G-Train B7 kit ... Commission build of a GNR 218DD twin ... Undergubbins installed on middle coaches for Grantham's GNR Quint set. And, with the lockdown set to continue for a few weeks yet, I'm going to have a crack at a start-to-finish Covid project, hopefully as a permanent reminder to look back on when all this is over: This kit has been in the build pile for more than five years now. I have got everything I need to make it, wheels, motor/gears, etc so I'll be making a start later and reporting progress on the Grantham thread. My previous 'record' for making up a loco kit is five weeks (a DJH Std 5MT) so I'm hoping that I can beat that.

Does that mean that Mo comes as part of the deal as well?(!)

My eye was caught by what appeared to be a company name on the side of a building on one of the photos, partly obscured by the train. After spending FAR too long trying various combinations of letters and hunting around, I think I've identified that word as 'WEATHERGAY' - titter ye not! Furthermore, I found reference to a Weathergay Ltd, New Bridge Street, Manchester 3. New Bridge St is of course immediately to the north of Victoria station. Apparently a 'weathergay' was (is?) a type of raincoat? Every day a schoolday.

Evening Tony et al, Hopefully not too late to add to the artic. 'show and tell'? Firstly, another view of Jonathan's Dia.218CC at the head of the 4pm ex-King's Cross, heading away from its Grantham stop at 6pm. My GN Quint set, recreating a set that could still be seen operating Grantham-Nottingham services up to circa 1936-7. These were created from re-cycled former 6-wheel and 8-wheel rigid stock. My recreation uses etches from Frank Davies (Clayton project), Danny Pinnock and Bill Bedford, running on Graeme King resin bogies. As can be seen, still not quite finished yet - actually on the workbench at the moment(!) Finally, a Dia.218DD (as referred to on Wednesday by Jonathan) commission build that I'm currently on with.

Part of the fantastic Revie LUFC team of the early 1970s. Very sad indeed - RIP