S.A.C Martin

Prototype 2 uses a Hornby Railroad chassis. The only change to the Railroad chassis is to the cylinder block. The A3 type one is too wide, I have replaced it with one of my Hornby A4 spares (they fit perfectly - the Railroad chassis is a further derivation from the super detail Hornby A3/A4 chassis block). So, Bachmann chassis/GBL body + GBL Tender/Hornby frames in front, then Hornby Railroad Chassis/GBL body + GBL tender/Hornby frames at rear. Two different ways of doing things, I'm going to modify them as planned and see which one comes out better. The Hornby Railroad chassis has a few things going for it, so does the Bachmann chassis, the two body shells have to be modified differently to each other to fit properly so it's going to be a case of seeing which is easier. Enjoyable project this, hopefully will emerge with a few swans from some ugly ducklings in due course.

Right, because that's a fair and respectful comment for the rest of us southerners on here. He's done pretty well Alan Pardew with a limited budget and the limitations of Newcastle United full stop. Yes, he's done something particularly ill advised but he's been punished by the club for it this morning. End thereof? Just want to throw it out there, us Charlton fans are concentrating on the cup. That's my story for yesterday, I'm sticking to it…Leicester though, my god. Superb team. Champions elect in my view. Some really nice football. First goal might have been offside, I'm not 100% sure but it didn't really change the outcome of the match. We've still got a few games in hand so I am hopeful of survival and a nice run continuing in the FA Cup.

You see I've read those running problems and always wondered why my four have never exhibited similar tendencies when they're running. The pony truck is the same and I would hazard a guess my track laying is no better than anyone else's, yet I've never experienced the problem. I don't deny it's there - the double swing link nature of the 8F type pony truck works like that - but all else has seemed fine in my books. I would say the best runner I've ever had was the O1 though. Astonishingly smooth and powerful, and yet this type of chassis design became redundant over the last year with Hornby. Such a shame.

It's not 100% a copy. It is effectively the Hornby body shell, but engineered to be simplified, hence my use of the term "based on". There's no doubt the Hornby model was the original source of dimensions but the GBL A4 is a much simplified body shell with a lot of the separately fitted details being moulded in (such as the safety valves). The cab fittings including the back head and cab seats are differently moulded too.

Another vote for one of the Thompson trio here, though I think the L1 rather than the B1 or O1 gets the nod. It's just such a handsome design, perfectly captured.

I'm going to look this up now - not something I had noticed but if it's there it's certainly there for improvement. The Duchess is an odd combination - 6220 was never red except when it was Duchess of Hamilton masquerading as Coronation. So effectively we have a model of an impostor, so to speak!

More pics here - I will update the blog entry tomorrow with the full details of my conversion, using the latest Bachmann A4 chassis. I am also working on another conversion using the latest Hornby Railroad Scotsman chassis and tender as a basis to compare the overall look and build time/cost/running qualities. Thus far it's been good fun. I am going to fit Maygib buffers to the front, new handrails and a single chimney and turned brass whistle, and turn this one into 60006 Sir Ralph Wedgwood, in LNER garter blue but with BR branding and smokebox numberplate. This requires removing the valances, adding etched access hatches, a single chimney and a new whistle. The whole thing will be given a coat of grey primer over the top to check everything before the paint shop. Prototype two for comparison will be using the Hornby Railroad Scotsman chassis (the one with the flywheel and 3 pole motor) and will be modified to represent 60007 Sir Nigel Gresley in a matching livery.

For me, these A4 body shells have the potential to create a "standard" for me. I hate the fact my collection of A4s are all a bit botch potch, different chassis, different body shells. I intend to have a clear out if I'm satisfied with my conversion prototypes and then if happy with them, continue to use these to create my main fleet. The inherent advantage of these is that I have a good number of them that if something goes wrong, I can just start again with another body shell. The tender body shells on the other hand have proven most useful. I worked out a long time ago that I needed exactly 17 streamlined non-corridor tenders to fit to classes A2/2, A3 and A4 for my planned stockist of express locomotives. These coupled with a number of spare Hornby frames and wheel sets have provided me with enough to make up all of those. The production line will go into full force once my modelling desk is ready again (we're nearly there, just need to finish sanding down, and then varnishing, the new floorboards in my attic space). Truly, enjoying these models for their potential. The more I think about the Flying Scotsman model though, the more I am convinced it's not going to yield much bar cab glazing, particularly if the washout plugs aren't A3 type and are positioned for the old A4 boiler 4472 used to be fitted with prior to the current overhaul.

The K3 is most welcome if it comes, I suspect for shed dioramas and similar it'll be excellent modelling material. Butler Henderson too. I suspect similar things are being said by modellers of the other regions.

Give me a wave! I'll be there, as I was on Monday night this week.

See you on the 9th of March in the FA Cup then!

I think you've missed the point of Mick's posts. It's an appraisal of what the actual model can be used for - and yes, I agree with Mick entirely, for modellers - that's what we are, after all - the wheels are rubbish. Surplus to requirements, not necessary, fit only for the bin or a scrap scene. It is an ex-parrot! Mick's post was not denigrating the model, its price, or anyone looking at using it but was simply an exercise in appraising the model prior to using it for something constructive. Nothing more, nothing less, and to keep arguing that somehow Mick has offended someone somewhere by branding some wheels rubbish (these being the first thing a modeller will put into the bin with these, if the intention is to do some modelling with them) is daft, as is the idea that Mick or anyone else appraising these body shells for modelling was expecting something motorised for £2.99. I fear by not looking at Mick's thread you are missing out on a valuable resource, particularly where ECML modelling and repainting is concerned.

There is nothing wrong with looking at the product in question objectively and seeing if it has value for one's own modelling. Please don't turn what has been a rather productive and constructive discussion into yet another "them and us" squabble about the rights and wrongs of constructive criticism. Besides, I haven't exactly seen anyone doing anything other than working out what can be re-used from dismantling one. No complaints in four pages as far as I can see. On a different and more "constructive" note, I've been having a lot of fun with my first A4 body shell today. The tender and locomotive are being modified, ready for new handrails, new buffers on the locomotive along with lamp irons, rivets, and new, more heavy duty attachment points for fitting to the Bachmann chassis I have chosen to work on. Overall it's made a nice project and when in grey primer I will get some footage of it running on a friend's layout, or a test track I will set up for myself. I can say this categorically, the Bachmann A4 chassis under this body shell looks rather better than I anticipated. We'll get to the painting and weathering stage before I make a full judgment on it though.

Oh they are definitely in the category of cheap knock offs, but cheap knock offs that are actually rather good for the price we're getting them at. The cost of a streamlined corridor tender on eBay, for example, can be as high as £40…having bought one of these for £2.99, a set of frames off eBay from Peter's Spares for £7 and a set of wheels for £4.50…well, see for yourself: Overall there's a lot of potential here. Removing the moulded handrails proved very easy, the nameplate I doubt will be quite so easy! The tender just needs handrails, a bit of filler here and there, a repaint and for under £15 (using frames and wheels from Peter's spares) you have a new tender virtually indistinguishable from the real deal. I think a few of these will make great diorama models - perhaps with smokebox door opened for maintenance or similar. Getting the older Railroad chassis on eBay and swapping over better valve gear/wheelsets will be cheap enough for that. For working models, the Bachmann chassis or the Railroad A3 chassis seems as good an option as any. If you're buying a full spec A4 Hornby chassis you may as well a full spec Hornby A4 in the first place though.

The body is not a Bachmann moulding. I can categorically state it's based on the Hornby model, right down to the buffer beam insert and even the cab innards. The shape and proportions exactly match the Hornby A4 body. The loco to tender hook doesn't look like any Bachmann model I've seen…? The tender chassis was a very cheap spare from ebay, and hasn't got a rear buffer beam…yet. The new chassis for Bachmann's A4 isn't available separately - more's the pity as this body shell looks rather good on top of the Bachmann chassis, which has different and more heavy duty valve gear compared to Hornby's A4. There again, buy a Bachmann A4, throw away the body shell and tender, salvage the handrails, safety valve and whistle from the Bachman shells, and apply to these and suddenly…with a Hornby tender chassis and the Railroad Tornado drawbar fitted, suddenly the whole thing looks "right" to me. Lots to do, I plan to carve this up and get it repainted over Easter, but the £2.99 cost of each Mallard model alone is worth it just for the tender body. In short, very pleased with mine. I hasten to add I'm not advocating people rush out and do modelling like this - Hornby's A4 is still the best on the market - but as a project, I rather like being able to make the things I need (like streamlined non corridor tenders for A4s, A3s and A2/2s) so these Mallard models are perfect for what I need.

Spot on Eddie. It's a pity no other LNER engines were sent to Barry, or that there had been a Barry of the north. The A4s are well preserved but little else is. I've discussed my model a bit more on the LNER forum but to fill in the gaps here, I've had another look at the rest of the tender, and whilst my personal preference is to throw away the majority of it, you could in theory carefully remove the over glued bottom, fit full wheel sets with axles and thus have a fully working chassis. However the tender connection would need some getting so I'm opting to use only the tender body and marry it to spare Hornby A3 and A4 frames. Handrails come away easily with a scalpel, and humbrol plastic filler can be used to fill in the various nicks on the body shell. The loco body on closer examination is really very good value for money and is a much superior shape to the Bachmann A4. This is definitely a cheap way of improving upon that breed though of course, why pay for this, a Bachmann A4 and do modelling when you can get Hornby A4s with more detail? My answer to that would be, because you can (!) so I will if only to show what can be done.

In theory, what I have done this evening was an entirely pointless exercise. However the plastic model Mallard cost £2.99 and the loco and tender body shell have a lot of potential for some conversions I think. Mine is sitting on a temporary donor Bachmann A4 chassis, the tender body is sitting on a spare Hornby A4 tender chassis (which, with minimal modification to the tender body, fits perfectly). Remove moulded handrails and add wire ones, a full repaint plus some etched parts, new buffers, and suddenly you've got a an A4 which isn't quite as good as Hornby's super detail one, but for my money, is better than the Railroad body shell. Pointless? Yes, but a bit of fun nonetheless. If it comes out looking good after modifications and a repaint, then all the better, but if not it was only £2.99. No modifications to the Bachmann chassis at all.

The first time I saw that video I put it down as an A2/3 as well - but on a second viewing I think Larry's nailed it there. Look at the slope at the front of the deflectors - it's the A1/1 all right. The A2/3 deflectors don't have that slope at the front, they are straight edged. It looks like a Pullman train of some form - the up (down? forget which way it is to London!) Queen of Scots perhaps?

That was extremely fast! Was that a Hornby A3 or a kit built one? Blink and you miss it! Nice shots Tom, rather reminiscent of line side videos of the time.

Use the wheels and frames for a new build Bulleid prototype diesel...? Effectively back dating it. Doesn't have to work, could just be a new body on top with a museum inside.

Get a Macbook and an external hard drive and enjoy internet browsing at its best…five years my macbook has served me and it hasn't put a foot wrong. I was a died in the wool PC fanatic until using a friend's macbook pro and will never go back. The antivirus, constant crashing, updating and general frustration of a PC made the price of the reliable Macbook worth it. That's my experience, not necessarily reflective of the norm.

I think Bachmann missed a great opportunity with their new chassis. I have "William Whitelaw" on the workbench for a client and am marvelling at how nice running the new chassis is. It's as good as the new V2 chassis and has just two minor drawbacks. One, only pickup on the driving wheels (though this hasn't been an issue as yet), and two, the motor/gearbox combination is ridiculously large under the body shell. Here, Bachmann could have taken an opportunity to retool the A4 and put the same chassis under an A3 Pacific. Why would I suggest duplication though? Simple fact of the matter is there aren't enough A3s coming to market through Hornby, and, like the 08 diesel, the Thompson B1, the standard 4MT, the 9F and a few other models including some forthcoming coaching stock, the Gresley A3 is one of those models everyone needs in their catalogue - they sell. The A4 body shell and tender need to be binned, but with the new standard tender coupling employed on the Bachmann A4 chassis, they could in theory very easily tool up a non corridor streamlined tender to go behind it. They are partway there with the Darlington built A1 tender after all (just remove the electric lighting). A new body shell to fit? Well, they haven't done it for the A4, the V2 or forthcoming V1/V3 so at this stage of the game I think it's fair to say we won't be seeing a new body shell A4 or any of the older ex-LNER models retooled any time soon. There again, we did say similar things about their class 40...

Lots of things I don't need - but are highly desirable. Bachmann on the money with some of these train set choices.

I think one day when model railway magazines look back at the "greatest" layouts we've known in Britain, we'll see The Gresley Beat and Grantham together. It's the atmosphere of the time both have which ultimately defines them (whether fictional location or real, they both capture that essence of the steam railway in the 1930s with all the different traffic that era saw). I don't think it's a question of "if" but "when" Grantham is thusly described as a classic. It ticks all the boxes for me at any rate.

I'd love to work for them, if only to try and persuade them to go back to fitting brass bearings on axles and generally finding a balance between affordability and detailing/accuracy that doesn't result in models like the 42xx, and more towards the Tornado/B1/O1 sort of spectrum. However I suspect that 1) Hornby aren't hiring and 2) I'm not qualified in relevant areas to work for them.