S.A.C Martin

A few years back, when Bachmann was retooling their B1 and Hornby announcing theirs, I questioned why Hornby picked the B1. That model has now been in every catalogue since its announcement. I was very much on the side of budget models and detailing, but when Hornby B1s were first discounted - well, that went out of the window. It sells well because it's a magnificent model. One of their best over the last decade by quite some way. I personally think the Thompson L1 or the O1 get the nod ahead of the B1 and B17 mind, but that's personal preference. Hornby picked the B1 because they knew it would sell well if it they nailed it - and they pretty much nailed it, shapes of dome and chimney aside. Now, if they had done a V2 to the same standard, you can bet your bottom dollar that we wouldn't be having a discussion about how best to product a V2 through kits or resin conversions - we'd simply have a number of extra locomotives on the layout in various liveries and number combinations and would be praising Hornby for duplicating yet another Bachmann model, but by god making a supreme choice with what I feel was Gresley's best designed locomotive, the A3 and A4 apart. Would have been another stellar model and a top seller if they'd done the V2 at the same time as the B1. Shame really.

Maybe I'm not so familiar with the prototype as I thought but the Jamieson V2, though clearly cruder than than the others in some details, to my eyes looks the most convincing of those V2s for shape and proportions. I think Graeme King's new resin body shell may be the way to go for those of us who want multiple V2s though - the new Bachmann chassis really is a lovely smooth runner, if not as fine as the Crowline effort above for valve gear.

Beautiful modelling that. It has the weight and look of an A4 through and through.

Mick - the latest Railroad 4472 has an new, all moulded corridor tender, not the same as the old tender drive model. Clearly based on the super detail corridor tender but exhibiting the same design ethos as 60163, 71000 and the upcoming 2001. It's a nice enough moulding but was the first thing I disposed of when building 60112.

Forgive me for necromancing somewhat on a Sunday afternoon. I was browsing your thread Tony and came across the A4 models. All splendid, though it has led to me to ask the question: are any A4s in OO scale the "definitive" model? I find myself singularly unimpressed with the nose shape of the Golden Age models (all other details such as the exquisite working valve gear, accepted), find the valve gear on the Hornby A4 to be anaemic, and the general shape (and awful tender) of the Trix, then Bachmann produced A4 to be less than satisfactory. That being said, for many years I had only Bachmann A4 models, mostly down to the not too bad and certainly superior loco drive chassis to Hornby's contemporary tender driven alternative, but Hornby's super detail A4 then came along and I'm sold on that for the most part. What needs to be overcome on the "ultimate OO A4" are the turn ins to the casing on the cylinder and valances, for pre, war and then post war forms, as you stated above, the buffer shanks (which aren't part of the casing but fit through holes on the streamlined casing) and a lot more rivet detail on the cabsides and other areas missed on Hornby's model, together with with a decent looking chassis (never been entirely sold on Hornby's: in contrast, I like the valve gear on Bachmann's latest A4 chassis but find the die cast cartazzi sides disappointing. Lovely runner mind). I am a pedant at the best of times, but with Mr Foster's excellent garter blue and weathered models doing the rounds, one wonders if we can improve on the breed even further than that. It is a shame in many respects that Hornby, having retooled 4472 for the Railroad range and producing a new tender, did not do the same for their Railroad A4 which it seems, will still be using the tender drive tender. There in the Railroad 4472 model is a potential diamond in the rough, the Railroad A4 could have been similar in terms of a project. The more I research the A4s, the more I feel like coming up with my own part kit part RTR variety is the only way to be satisfied fully with one.

Looks utterly superb. Great pictures of the E4 too. However is there a bit of pipework missing from the model? This could of course be a later addition, I don't know. Not familiar with the prototype other than my limited visits to the Bluebell.

Can't give one as yet for DoG but twenty hours of running of a 42xx over the 2013 summer indicated some wear in the square axle holes (located in the roof of the axle box). This was under strictly test conditions on a running road at high speed and not indicative of normal service on a model railway. I would surmise that we will be looking at these models in a few years and asking the question then as to the suitability of the axle boxes. Personally speaking I feel square axle boxes also have the ability to create potential stress points in the inside corners, and it is this I am watching closely on my DoG for signs of cracking or wear over the next few years and much running in both on a test track and a rolling road. However it could all be completely unfounded and the material the die cast chassis is made up be perfectly agreeable for the job. It is a technically retrograde step and will not improve running better than a chassis with brass bearings but thus far has not hindered the relatively smooth running of my 71000. Of more concern are the one piece coupling rods but that's for another thread. The Tornado model Hornby produced is the best of all worlds in my opinion. Design clever produced an excellent chassis, and a nice budget body and tender. The model retails for a not unreasonable £75 when new in the Railroad range and the paint job is normally top notch on the main range model. The only downside are the plastic buffers, but they are removable and easily replaceable.

They are the same standard bearings (brass bearings inset into round axle boxes in the die cast chassis) as that seen on the main range A3 and A4.

All quite right there Tony. Iin addition to those problems with the boiler (of which I have only changed the dome on the boiler on my A2/1 and V2 behind), the chimney is a little too squat, the smoke box door too bulbous, the spindle ends on the Bachmann old and new chassis only account for a portion of the class, and the buffers provided (whether sprung or unsprung depending on the age of the model) not the right type (the spencer type or GS type dependent on your chosen loco). For its time Bachmanns model was good, and the new chassis for it is excellent, but a convincing V2 - of which yours I note on this thread indoubtedly are - can only be made out of the Bachmann model with some modification. Those mods I carried out on one of my new V2s, and Tom Foster has a similar model with near identical modifications. The one which changes the overall look the most, the smoke box door, is replaced by a resin cast of the Hornby A3 door. However because the boiler and smoke box are too wide in diameter, the door will look slightly odd - better than that before but still odd. Not something which can be fixed, and as I found on my A2/1, requires careful filing if you fit a new smoke box to the V2 boiler. Thank you for your kind words Tony regarding my model, however it is not perfect and indoubtedly the next version of 60508 I build will be better in a number of areas.

I agree with you Tony that, numbering only four examples, the A2/1 seems the least likely (bar the short lived Raven Pacifics) of all the LNER Pacifics to be made RTR. Yet if we can have the Duke of Gloucester which is in a class of one and significantly shorter lived in service (albeit preserved), we cannot in all good conscience say never to the orphans of the storm I suspect…! I think it's a rather convincing model myself. If I may add to Mick's excellent example on the previous page, here's my A2/1, also Duke of Rothesay. It was built using Graeme King's resin components, a Bachmann V2 body shell, a Bachmann B1 tender and a Bachmann A2 chassis albeit using the latest Bachmann V2 valve gear in place of the original set. One thing I think which is significantly noticeable about mine is the poor shape of the boiler which has resulted from the use of the Bachmann V2 boiler. Graeme King is currently working on a replacement resin body for the Bachmann V2 and I may yet be tempted to build a new A2/1 using that as a starting place instead. Different approaches to the same problem: if you want an A2/1, how do you build one?

They become only the second "Athletic" to win the FA Cup...well done Wigan. On the day, a superb performance and a dogged effort indeed.

Still can't quite believe Hornby haven't taken advantage of the tooling to do an apple green LNER liveried B1. When I looked at the choices for this year, although welcome as they offer variations they hadn't done before, I felt a tad disappointed that there would be no apple green B1 to join the fleet as yet. 61306, as in the above photographs and excellent film, show what a handsome machine the B1 is in the full livery.

No doubt in my mind: Graeme's parts produce the superior model by far. Couple that with your excellent paint finish Mick, and a beauty beckons.

That would have also sufficed: but I "accepted" the excellence of Bachmanns products when I made my point about Hornbys quartet. Not really something to get hung up on chaps, is it...? Definitely. For my money, the Thompson L1 remains the pinnacle of Hornbys RTR releases. Just such an excellent model. I dunno about that - cylinders aside, the 38xx is a stonking model, as is the castle class model. I remain skeptical about the heavy tanks because for me, it's an increase in RRP and several steps backwards in overall quality, in comparison to very, very recent releases. It is an interesting comparison that Bachmanns latest releases now have brass bushes in the chassis and Hornby have removed it from their latest release. I do wonder if the heavy tanks and DoG will present the "way forward" or a blip in terms of design. Probably the former, which is not something I'm wholly comfortable with. The B17, the last LNER release, really was a cracker and you would hope the much wished for P2 will be in the same vein. The B1 though I'm not sure they're getting their money out of at present, and won't until they do an apple green release. Cue LNER modellers up and down the country rushing to pre-order, particularly if its to the standard of the B17 before.

"Accepted" - taken into account.

It's interesting how views change. Reading back through this thread, I was adamant about the Bachmann B1. Happy to be proved wrong as prices on eBay have led me to owning three B1s now, with a further fourth bought by my better half for me. The Hornby B1 has proven itself a terrific model. The quartet of L1, B1, B17 and O1 comprise the best steam outline models LNER modellers have at the minute. Bachmanns excellent D11 and O4 accepted.

Gutted for Peterborough who played some great football this year. Watched a mesmerising second half at the Valley yesterday where Bristol City showed some guts but not enough skill I fear. They'll be back soon though - great fans making the trip down to Charlton. So another year in the championship, but you know what? I'm just happy we have such a passionate, determined manager at the helm.

Well played too, throughout the season as well as yesterday. Kudos to you Cardiff, that's how it's done.

0-6 to the Addicks against Barnsley. Bring on Cardiff - sorry boys, we're in the mood for spoiling the party I fear...

Good luck to Pompey and their supporters. I think you're getting a taste of what it's been like to be a Charlton fan, or some of the clubs which have been near the end of the road. It's not a pleasant one and it's one I know well from my youngest days. We came back out of it and so can you. Hang in there and hope to see you fellas back in the championship sooner rather than later.

I'd "like" that if I could Andrew, a very nice piece of work that. The etch in particular really finishes off the model very nicely. Will send you an email later today once I've got the major dramas out of the way.

No, apparently this is the real deal. First time I've agreed with David Miliband on anything, and I think he's done absolutely the right thing. I say this as a Charlton fan who thoroughly enjoyed Di Canio's tenure with us, but then he had not revealed the extent of his political beliefs at that point (and more to the point, I was young and naive enough not to know or understand the ramifications). I felt uneasy when Di Canio was manager of Swindon, and even more uneasy with him at Sunderland now.

I am definitely not worthy of the praise - Andrews work and quality of the CAD work is clear. The model looks the part because the model has been designed very well. That you can have both superheated and saturated types too adds a further dimension to the build. I'll certainly be buying more N1 bodyshells as time and funds allow. The end result is as good externally as an etched brass kit with the added bonus of knowing what the running quality will be like with the donor chassis. It's just a pity Hornby didn't more extensively retool the N2 chassis with a flywheel.

More on the build here. It's coming along very nicely indeed. A spare Hornby Thompson L1 detailing pack has proven surprisingly useful on several counts.

Thanks Andrew, I must say your 3D printed buffers seem to fit the bill more than the sprung buffers I was going to fit. The next job was going to be fitting the coal rails, but my preferred supplier of brass rod has sent me the wrong thickness today, so I'll be concentrating on other parts of the build instead.