Andy Hayter

You might think that, but consider how long it takes you to make up a working chassis. I know Hornby will have jigs to speed up the process, but tis is not going to be quick, and to expect say 500-1000 items to be ready in one week is I suspect what we would like to have and not the reality

http://www.ledauphine.com/isere-sud/2010/10/27/le-train-de-la-mure-ne-circule-plus This gives some idea of the issues in reopening the line The lower image shows the view from the balcon - just right from the view in the le Dauphine picture - which would be the end of the line from La Mure. The upper view is crossing one of the viaducts above the fall

Yes the line above the rock fall is the more scenic and in addition gives access to the mining museum at La Motte. The lower section is only really of interest close to St George station, where you have the old transhipment equipment and after the first tunnel a very nice view back down onto the station you have just departed from. After that it is a slow climb up through forest until you come to the tunnels immediately before La Balcon - which is here the rock fall occurred. BUT (it's a big one) all of the maintenance facilities are at St George. I suspect also that all of the locomotives and stock are at the wrong side as well. La Mure has/had virtually no facilities outside of the station building itself. If Baldwin did mean separate operations on the upper and lower sections, then I agree that there is no real practical chance of this happening. Although it covers perhaps a third of the length, the stretch from St George to the collapse has no remaining operational halts or stations above St George. The upper section did at least have 2 stations in use below La Mure. As for rebuilding the collapsed section, I doubt it. Expert opinion seems to be that there is a lot more of this cliff waiting to fall, so some very major stabilisation would be required. Since my post about tenders being sought, I have sadly heard no more, and given the difficulties I doubt that the line will reopen - though I do hope to be proven wrong.

Baldwin I am not entirely sure what you mean in your question. Could you be a little more precise?

I ordered on a Saturday evening and received the parcel the following Thursday in France. If you ordered Friday evening I could well imagine that nothing would happen until Monday in terms of dispatch.

The same happened to me with the Bachmann C class. I posted here about it and Andy Y closed the post as "resolved" because Hattons assured me (and I assume assured him) that a warning would at least be given when updating card details. It seems Hattons have not lived up to the promise yet - or at least perhaps not consistently.

It took Bachmann a week to put it on their own site, so there may be delays in getting the info out to the stockists - with holidays as well. Anyway given an 18 month wait, does a couple of days delay in being able to place an order amount to much?

A patent has to show novelty. It is possible to have a patent that is subject to another patent. So for example I patent a mouse trap which involves a piece of cheese attached to a piece of string that if pulled causes an axe to fall across the place where the cheese is. I patent this as a device for killing rodents (might get lucky with a rat) which involves a mechanism (string) linking a bait (cheese) to a means of killing the rodent (falling axe). I will normally have to provide some drawings of what might be a typical arrangement of this mechanism. The patent uses the words outside of the brackets and is pretty generic - which is how well written patents will be as a means of protecting the inventor. Now, along comes my mate and sees my trap and says that is a neat idea, but I don't like the idea of having to balance that cleaving axe when setting up. So he designs a better mousetrap that uses the bait sat on a pressure plate that when activated releases a sprung loaded arm that cuts through the rodent. (Basically the traditional mouse trap. My mate patents this on the basis of a pressure plate and a sprung loaded arm. His patent shows novelty (and improvement) but is still subject to my patent since his total mechanism still does what I described in mine. I hope that makes sense. So if he sells his mousetraps he will have to pay me a royalty to use my patent. Edited to add: Much of the current patent arguments between Apple and Samsung relate to the nature of interrelated and interlaced patents.

Oh dear I see the frustration spilling over. What do you want Hornby to say? and what would you expect the result would be? Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical) that Hornby were to announce at your behest, that there are problems getting the chassis to the specification that they want to deliver to you. So now you know. And what? Is that knowledge going to improve the delivery date? Can you offer a solution to the problem - like you building 3000 chassis cheaper and faster than the Chinese? My guess is that you will just want to know more. What exactly is wrong with the chassis? It won't go round radius 1 curves. Why not? The tolerance seems to be to wrong on the free play on the nth axle. Why?........... and so it goes on. And you know what? The model is still not going to get delivered one day quicker. The problem may well be commercially sensitive and making public exactly what the issue is could be damaging for both the producer and for Hornby. Taking my hypothetical example, telling the world that there is a problem with the chassis, could lead to the manufacturer losing business with other companies (the trade will know which company this is, even if we do not) and Hornby would lose trust with its other suppliers due to its readiness to point the finger in public, resulting in it being more difficult to secure future production from those companies - and so potentially worsening the supply situation. As for suggesting that Hornby might be committing fraud, well that is just silly. They are required to advise the market of issues that might materially affect the performance of the company. They have already announced that there are supply issues from the Far East and that they are in the process of addressing them. That the problems clearly still persist with one model from one supplier - albeit that we all hope this will be a landmark model for the 2010s - does not mean that the whole Hornby empire is about to crumble. It does not warrant an announcement to the market. So I suggest you take a deep breath, count to ten and accept that the models are not going to arrive as quickly as any of us - Hornby included - want. Fretting, probing, threatening and the like will not improve the delivery situation.

I can understand that as the situation today when the rtr producers exist, but I wonder how things would turn out if they all decided the UK market was not worth the hassle that a few seem to want to deal out here. How many kit manufacturers depend on a groundswell of models who having rtr, then decide to dip a toe in the water and try a kit - and then continue down that vein? And if they decide the market is collapsing and stop producing? How many parts and detailing producers would then find their market collapses? And if a number of them shut up shop, how would the raw material suppliers fare? Would the likes of Markits (wheels), Slaters Plasticard (card) and Eileen's Emporium (general bits and tools) have a big enough market to stay with it? Of course there are alternative suppliers of some parts on the continent and elsewhere, but I think to say that you are entirely independent of the rtr market is wrong, even if you do not buy directly from them. Of course if you do buy stock steel and turn your own wheels and etch all of your own parts apart from the ones you cast yourself, then I withdraw the comment.

All the while that you and everyone else wants to buy "cheap" models made on the other side of the world to keep costs to a minimum, Hornby (and every other manufacturer) will never have complete control of their supply chain. As I have posted elsewhere as an importer from the Far East you are at the hands of the shipping companies, and unless you are prepared to pay premium freight (which will make the cost of your already "too expensive" models even higher) you stand no chance of getting reliable delivery. (Premium freight will possibly give you a 50:50 chance of having a half accurate arrival date in Europe.) A container may be booked and on its way to the docks, that does not mean that the shipping line will not back-ship the container. This means it does not get put on the booked ship. This does not mean it gets on the next ship, but that it gats on the next available ship. From experience this can be over a month later if you drop unlucky.

........and you think e don't pay taxes here in Europe? Let me assure you that we do and the standard rate of VAT is around 20% just as in the UK. The difference is that the concept of zero rating of VAT does not seem to exist. So e pay VAT on Food, Books and Children's' clothes. Anyway this seems to be getting OT.

Very, very nice. Well done chaps

I would like to see the stats that support that view. I don't know whether on average German living standards are currently higher than the UK, but I do know that at the lower extreme they are not. UK Minimum wage 2013 £6.31 per hour (not a lot I will grant you) - introduced to try and activate the job market and get people back to work. Now used to keep wages down. Germany - no minimum wage Concept set up of the 650€ job (that is per month not week - I think at todays exchange that equates to £3.45/hr ) - introduced to try and activate the job market and get people back to work. Now used to keep wages down. Doing the exact calculations is difficult because of tax breaks and subsidies paid (in cash or kind) to low paid workers, but that is a very big gap. I cannot speak for the Netherlands.

A number of posts refer to limited edition and a lack of information on how many will be produced. Try as I might I can find no official reference to a limited edition - maybe I missed it. Exclusive, yes: limited, no. Of course the reality is that the production runs will be limited to a number to cover the orders and the model is likely to be a WIGIG - When it's gone, it's gone. While I do feel for those who cannot afford or justify to themselves the cost of this model, to blame Bachmann, NRM or Chinese workers for that is just stupid. I cannot justify the cost of Fulgurex models, but I don't blame them and I definitely cannot afford a coveted Aston Martin, but that is not their fault. Despite the negative posts on costs, I think I have seen as many if not more "I have/will order one" posts regarding this model than were posted in the first day after the announcement of the GCR 9J - which sold out in 3 weeks (504 models). I remain unconvinced that this will be anything other than a roaring success. Oh and I have ordered one and am seriously considering whether I can justify a second - but if I cannot justify it, then the only person to blame is me.

I think the error is yours K. Peco points small radius (radius 1 if you will) is nominal 24 inches radius. Pukka radius 4 (H,B,R) is somewhat less. Dutch master - I accept that much modern image (even 00 rather than HO as per your example) will negotiate 18 inch radius or smaller, but if we look at typical British steam locos with a leading bogie, then either we have to cut out bits of the outside cylinder (which in some case we have so carefully replaced after the manufacturer left them off, and/or we have to put leading footsteps back onto the bogie, where the manufacturer thought we would like them, rather than on the footplate, which is where the actual railway company thought it would be best to fit them. In the end it is down to what we want. If it is modular train set, then I have some sub 1ft Triang pre-ballasted curves. If it is modular model railway, then we should perhaps be a little more discerning - and perhaps more inclusive.

I see a realistic change of heart there Kenton. [ref post 144 and your use of the disagree button]

I don't want to pee on your parade, but is the motor for the fan fully isolated from the extracted gas flow? If not you run a risk of a fire or even explosion. The extracted gas flow will contain flammable gas/droplets and if the motor contacts are sparking (not uncommon) and come in contact with the gas flow......................................

Sadly most kit built locomotives will not negotiate even radius 4.

G clamps work well with solid thick timber ends. Anyone using double skin thin ply separated by blocks and open frame will confirm that joining boards with G clamps is only likely to deform the inner ply beam. It may not seem obvious to you but I can see the need for standards being set in addition to rail top height above ground and track gauge.

Sorry to disagree Kenton, but what about the fixings for connecting one board to another Electrical connection - you could rely on rail joiners I suppose - but only if everyone uses the same standard and make of track And I am sure there will be other items that I have not thought about

Articles about Pechot wagons and Pechot Boudan locomotives can be found in the following French magazines. The reference to plans sheet indicates that there will be a scale drawing Voie Libre 2002 April page 18 Voie Etroite 2009 April 35 Voie Libre 2010 March Plans sheet Voie Libre 2010 March Plans sheet Voie Libre 2010 March Plans sheet Voie Libre 2010 March 36

7013 Good luck on getting guaranteed prices for future releases, but if you find a supplier. please let us all know. Regards wagons for the SECR Wainwright C - have a look at Cambrian kits, who do a range of SECR wagons. Transfers may however be a problem. Edited to correct typo

ABS unfortunately do not have a web presence.

The confusion is now clear. I had the original OPC single volume version. The Wild Swan books are out of print and command a substantial premium.