thegreenhowards

We are approaching the evening peak at Gresley Jn and today I feature the first of the down evening business trains, The West Riding. Here she is emerging from the canal tunnel with A1, 60118, Archibald Sturrock on the nose. The first picture is a telephoto view but has come out rather grainy. The second is more conventional. I’d be interested in which one people prefer. Here is another view from slightly further on. This shows the two ex West Riding Limited streamliner twins and the Thompson FO in between them. This is a long train (13 coaches) and difficult to do justice to in a photo. Hopefully the video shows off the full formation.

Thanks Guys, I stand corrected. I know there was a reason why I decided against Royal Sovereign but it looks like my memory has failed me and it wasn’t the P2 tender! It may have been the celebrity loco issue as I tend to agree with Steve on that or maybe just that I thought a standard tender was a bit boring when I could introduce some variety with an ex NER one. Anyway, I’m going to do Castle Hedingham first and then we’ll see...maybe I’ll succumb to Gilbert’s incitement! Andy

I’m interested in this discussion on ballast. One issue which doesn’t quite make sense to me comes from Graham’s picture of the A4 at Essendine. If the staining around the tracks is delivered by oil from the motion, then, given that most (many?) locos on Stoke Bank had three cylinders, why isn’t there a line down the middle from the central motion? Andy

They would be tempting...and easier than a B2! However, my understanding is that the royal Claude’s at Cambridge were there to do the Cambridge to Sandringham leg of these trains. Did they also work south?

Thanks John, Yes I was aware - that’s what inspired me. I thought his write up was still on the LNER forum as I’m sure I’ve read it and I post date the old RMWeb. I’m sure I can work it out from the diagrams and whatever photos he has available. Andy

Tonight we feature a Colwick-KX goods headed by O2, 63983. Here it is on the approach to Gresley Jn. ...and here she is heading through the goods loop at the station. My WTT shows this as a Class F, but I think the fireman must have put the wrong code up - sorry! I’m not sure what goods the train would have carried but I need an excuse to run my pipe and steel train so here it is. The loco is Heljan which I’ve just fitted with a Youchoos sound chip. It’s in the ‘too be weathered when it’s warmer’ queue. You seemed to like the WD ‘chuffing’ through here so I’ve done the same with this train for the video. She is slowed by an adverse signal for a message from the signal box and then accelerates away. I rather like the Gresley 3 cylinder beat (recorded off the K4 and adapted for the O2). I’m afraid that you’ll have to imagine the signal for now!

That is incitement to a recovering locoholic! Seriously, you are right. I’d been put off Royal Sovereign because of the P2 tender and if and when I ever build the rest of the royal train, I can run it with a Pacific on the mainline. But I certainly need a B2 for Cambridge line turns. I have bought a spare B17, a B1 body, a spare B16 tender, an Isinglass B2 drawing and some castle Hedingham plates But that is as far as it’s got. I must promote it up the roundtuit pile!

Hi Jesse, I like the look of the milk train. What is the origin of the tankers? Can you say a bit about what you’re doing to them? Pack your milk brake well for its journey to NZ - that resin is very brittle. Regards Andy

Interesting question that Manna. Pictures of the east coast royal train in BR days are quite rare. I was expecting the challenge that it should be B2, Royal Sovereign which I think was the designated engine for these runs. One day, I’ll build a B2 but that’s a big gap for now - a missing big green engine for ‘Sir’s’ list? Longer distance runs seemed to get a single pacific. I based my (non royal) train on the one on the title page of ‘The Power of the B1s’ which had a lovely apple green 61333 on the nose and then a rake of teak liveried all door Gresleys (at least as far as I can make out). I’ve not seen a picture of a single or double B1 on the royal train. Can anyone else help? Andy

Tony, I've just received January’s BRM digitally (3 or 4 days ago) . Is this a special edition? Andy

Lining up four lamps isn’t easy!

Today is a special day at Gresley Jn as we get to salute King George VI and Queen Elizabeth as they take a trip back from Sandringham to London on the royal train coaches. Rather than the full royal train there are two saloons attached to the front of a Standard Cambridge Buffet Express. Here is the formation at rest at platform 3. ...and leaving Gresley Jn. Finally a close up of the royal saloons 395 and 396. The loco is RTR Hornby and apart from renumbering and lamps I haven’t done anything to her. Having praised RTR haulage power yesterday, I have to admit that the B1 struggled with this 9 coach rake. She got round the circuit but the wheels must have done twice as many revolutions as normal! The six wheelers are heavy and the bogies are a bit stiff. I clearly need to do some work on the coach bogies and fit some weight in the loco. My eventual aim is to build some of the other royal train vehicles and run it as a dedicated formation. Bill Bedford did the sides a long time ago and I’m working on him to do another run. This train is also the primary home of my D.78V buffet car which got another airing. It’s now acquired Wedgewood Blue curtains following a recommendation from @jwealleans.

John, I saw that and very nearly succumbed. However, I read up online about them and it's not very complementary! Whether this is just key board warriors having a pop I don't know, but I don't feel like parting with £579 to find out - especially as I haven't got a layout to test it on yet. We bought the timber for our club 0 gauge layout yesterday and construction will start shortly in my (well ventilated) garage. I'm hoping that counts as outside from a Covid POV! But sadly we're a few months off running any trains. Andy

I agree with that sentiment! I love the presence that 0 gauge gives but, for me, dabbling in 0 gauge at my club seems to be a far better bet financially and space wise. I could never really achieve the sort of long mainline trains in 0 gauge which I manage in 00 so it will be a different sort of layout. If I ever have an 0 gauge at home it would be a garden railway.

Thanks Jonathan, I should have guessed that! I’ll message Graeme. I can always paint them in late LNER livery and weather them well. Andy

Jonathan, I like those LNER insulated containers. I think some of those would look good on my meat train. Where did they come from? And do you know how long they lasted? Andy

Another goods train today. This time it’s an Inverkeithing to KX East Goods Class C and our photographer is still at the viaduct to catch it. I don’t really know what was carried on this train, but I saw Gilbert’s version had a cattle van at the front so I thought it was an excuse to use my cassette which consists of a head of cattle vans with assorted other vans behind. This creates the first 4’ of the train with the balance being the rear of my scotch goods rake. I hope the subterfuge isn’t immediately obvious! It’s hauled by a K3, 61870, as might have happened in the early ‘50s. This one is a Wills body on a Bachmann chassis. Another photographer was lower down in the valley for a (perhaps more typical) upwards view of the viaduct. ...and here’s the video.

Just wait until you start adding 0 gauge stuff to it!

Peter, Thanks for the offers of A4s. I have concentrated on Hornby loco drive versions as I find they look the part and pull anything asked of them. If I had an older model, I probably wouldn't be so tempted to use it. I'm in no rush, so I'll hang on until I see what I want at a sensible price. Anyway, my budget is mainly going on O gauge stuff at the moment. Andy

You can lose a lot of wagons in that space! As I go through the sequence this time, I'm photographing every wagon, coach and loco and inputting them to a database. An entry consists of a photo like this. And a spreadsheet entry like this. So when I finish the sequence I will know what I've got. I just have to keep it away from the missus!

Thanks David, That's reassuring about the reverse curve. I have drawn up Keith's 'B' and will put it to our members for consideration. I rather like it. I agree about the passenger run round. Moorgate didn't work like that, so nor will we! It also gives an excuse for more engines - no bad thing. I envisage the goods cassette representing a line of 2-3 miles in length, possibly serving more than one destination. I have a thing about fish vans, so Billingsgate will be one of them. A train will go down there; the cassettes will be swapped over; and a different train will emerge later. Andy

I could do that. But its primary purpose is as a loco spur for the turnover engine. As such it would be more awkward to use with a trailing point. I suppose if it was more prototypical that would be a good argument for such a change.

Thanks Keith, This has been an area of debate in the club! So much so that I had to do a complete sequence on paper to prove that it could be operated without a run round. I intend to use the passenger turnover loco as a goods pilot. Alternatively a pilot could sit in the goods yard on the track you’ve used as a run round (in B) which I’d intended as a brake van line. We looked at your A, but it’s very tight without a point over the baseboard joint. I didn’t consider B as I thought more tracks under the road bridge would be unprototypical, but it’s a possibility. It would be a bit strange with the run round under a road bridge though? My proposal was a third different option as below. I feel this overcomplicates the layout and spoils the simplicity of Minories but I’d welcome feedback. By the way it also shows our other option for station building - comments welcome on that as well. Andy

Thanks for your comments David, I think there is one reverse curve - heading from fiddle to hidden goods cassette. But as this will only be 4 wheel vans and an 0-6-0T I thought that was acceptable. It’s a club layout so democracy will rule stock wise. Given the O gauge member’s interests it’s likely to be A LNER/SR joint Station but could be set in eras, 2,3,4 or 5 and will probably do all of those at some point. I suspect that the infrastructure wouldn’t change much, so we’d just need to swap some road vehicles, signage and people over and could run another era. I think we’ll start with 1930ish. That will mean a mix of 6 wheelers and bogie stock. I’m building a Kirk Gresley artic twin as we speak. I think the LNER Passenger rakes will be: 1. 5*51ft Gresley non corridors (two twins and a BT). The platforms are 8ft plus another 2ft before the point work, so this plus 2 * N2 will be close to the limit for the two main platforms. 2. A quad art (the platforms are very marginal for this, so it may have to run as 7 vehicles rather than 8. 3. A string of 6 wheelers. I can’t speak for the SR side, but some Kirk Maunsells And some 6 wheelers are likely - there’s a lot of kit building to do! None of us have much experience of 0 gauge so we’ll be leaning as we go (brave or foolhardy?). I’m going to try the dingham auto coupling system but I don’t know whether it will work for us. Andy

This is my first post on this fascinating thread having skim read much of it over the last few days. I am designing an 0 gauge layout for our club's new venture into the senior scale loosely based on the Minories plan. This is what we've settled on at the moment. It's designed to fit into a space in our clubroom with a wall which projects out at the right end (as shown) but still allows room for a narrow shelf in front of it. The scenic length is 19' with the shelf being another 10' which can support cassettes for a fiddle yard. This area is where members sit and socialise (Covid permitting) on our main club night, so the layout will have to pack down easily and just be put up on '0' gauge nights. The layout is designed to be exhibitable and for exhibitions can have a wider fiddle yard board with traverser fiddle yard and a narrow scenic section in front which we plan will be an additional goods facility. It will be viewed and operated from the bottom of the plan in the clubrooms, but viewed from the top at exhibitions. I started with a classic Minories but then was asked to add in more goods interest. I have done this in two ways: 1. A line to a hidden goods cassette (bottom left) which I envisage as through goods to Billingsgate fish market or similar. The line would descend and enter a tunnel rather like platform 15 at the old King's Cross. The 4' cassette can hold a J50 + 6 vans and a brake van in 0 gauge. 2. Rather more goods on the kick back (top right) than the classic Minories with a line which can extend in future The Peco pointwork in O gauge has an 8 degree angle which makes for gentler double slips, so getting round some of the problems listed over the last few pages. I'd be interested in any comments the 'Minories experts' on here may have on the plan. Thanks Andy