CKPR

The various articles about the building of  the 'Heckmonwike' P4 layout that were published in 'Model Railways' in the late 1970s make reference to Midland PW practice and were rather well referenced IIRC.

I don't think even the Danish Scud-mag purveyours would stoop that low, the Fell is an obscenity deserving of a special place in hell  

I understand there are magazines catering for more, ahem, 'specialist' tastes - "'ere mate, you got any magazines of, ermm, you know, like weird stuff ? You know what I mean, prototypes, diesels, coupled wheels, crank shafts ?"

My contribution to this topic is... Ardwick, first station out from Manchester Piccadilly . Easily the most run down and grotty station in the country with a backdrop of a  waste recycling plant on the site of the old goods yard. Now there's summat you NEVER see modelled.

Hi. I enjoy reading these posts very much. I have always liked old toys, maybe because I never had too many  as a kid (yes I know start the violins)!  A work colleague introduced me to Bowman live steam O gauge a few years ago & since then I have got all 4 locos that Bowman made, plus others, and have had a lot of fun getting them to run well and buying and making suitable rolling stock for them. They need to pull rolling stock as there is no form of speed control other than more/less wagons or reducing the number of working wicks (flames).  Lionel 3ft radius track is ideal for the largest Bowman loco and it is compatible with Hornby which is very useful. Yes new Lionel track is available in the UK at Tennents Trains but I prefer to get the older, better made track from the States on eBay. (Rusty track is not a problem for me). I also like the between-wars era American 8 wheel (bogie) rolling stock made by Lionel & American Flyer as well as Hornby.

Live steam is not often seen at exhibitions for a variety of reasons but mainly, I suspect, the "fear factor" on the part of organisers which they explain away by stating insurance or health & safety issues. I built my own demountable exhibition layout and take it to various events, mainly full-size steam shows, toy steam shows and model railway shows run by enlightened organisers. These are 60%/ 40% outside/inside. Needless to say, I am very conscious of running a responsible and safe display and I dress the layout up with tinplate buildings, bridges and tunnels for added interest. Visitors are always entranced to see live steam actually working and it is always worth doing these exhibitions just for the reactions and conversations I have. Apart from messy layouts,it annoys me as a spectator at exhibitions when the person/s running the display totally ignore you.

I will be part of the team running Bowman locos at the Exeter Garden Railway show on the 18th Oct (this month) and the day after I will be operating my layout at the Wimborne O gauge event. A busy Weekend then!  

 

Cheers, Trevor.

The Solrail show at Workington often features tinplate, coarse scale O  gauge and live steam layouts and jolly good they are too.

I wonder if an olaf cutter (or a squawker in old money) would follow the scored lines of the Amy cutter free hand to clear it out better?

 

Need to find out where to get one from to try and play with it...

 

BTW I'm in the middle of a different project at the minute which will be loaded here when a bit more complete. I haven't forgotten about the works in progress, just this project has caught my imagination at the minute, and yes it's still coach related!

 

Happy New year BTW

 

Andy G

It should do - I've sometimes used mine free-hand after scribing a line with a normal craft knife [usually a Swan-Morton 10a blade in an old KeilKraft brass handle - lovely !] and it works fine. Squires sell proper Olfa cutters and any general model shop with a HobbyCo account  should be able to get a Tamiya one if they don't have one in stock [item #74091 600 91].

Really nice work indeed. Regarding the slight problem with scoring the matchboarding, have you tried using an Olfa or Tamiya cutter ? These remove a tiny v-shaped strip of material to produce a perfect planked effect that doesn't need any sanding down.

Now, back to annoying people at an exhibition.

 

So far we have only presented the exhibitor/visitor side. What about the trader's?

How about...

1. Register as a trader
2. Put a very BIG sign out reading "ALL the 2014 models from your favourite manufacturers"
3. Have a completely empty and bare stand.....
4. Have a very small notice reading "subject to ship arriving from China"

OR

1. Register as a trader
2. Put up a sign that reads "Pre-Owned and Rare Models"
3. Fill the stand with chipped, cracked, broken and defective models, some with accompanying mildew and mould encrusted boxes (preferably mismatched with model)
4. Indulge in lottery fantasies when writing out the price tags
5. And whenever questioned about a model, always answer - no matter what the model - that "it's rare, is that, don't make them anymore, that's the price, take it or leave it"

OK, OK, I'll get me coat, (tin) hat and (flak) vest.

"Well, it's kit-built, innit ?" is usually the reply you get when querying the £100 price being asked of a very badly assembled, tar brush painted and non-working Wills engine on a Tri-ang chassis

I read somewhere that it got to the stage where it was requiring excessive maintenance to keep it going and sadly it was dismantled.  When and where I read this I can't recall.  I too have fond memories of reading about it in my friend's October 1968 RM when it was Railway of the Month, billed as 'Midland Magnificence'.  It was about that time that I first saw Grandborough Junction in the RM for October 1964.  I'd never seen a model railway look so realistic.  My friend gave me his copy and I can recall walking back home with my head almost dizzy from what I'd seen - and any part of Buckingham still amazes me now.  Size wise at the other extreme I still enjoy looking at Ian Futer's 'Ashleigh'. One more or I'll never stop; I always thought the December 1968 ROTM 'Huntshire' was fascinating.  Still do.    

There must be a new version as I saw it running in Derby Museum about 5-6 years ago when the Derby exhibition was on.

Just finished idly scrolling through this thread - some marvellous memories!

I remember seeing Mac Pyrke's "Berrow" at a London exhibition (probably the MRC pre-IMREX Easter show) some time around the late 1960s, it was probably one of the first London exhibitions I attended.

 

Somebody on another thread mentioned Colin Boocock's "Weybourne" (RM article mid to late '70s?), I found that layout very inspirational because of the operational interest in a modest space and more importantly to me, region & era depicted (BR/SR c.1966 to end of steam) but I doubt I'd ever have had the bottle to convert class 33s out of Hornby AL1 electrics! Thankfully Lima brought their 00 model out soon after the article appeared.

 

Does anyone else remember a WCML based layout called (IIRC) "Lancaster Junction", featured in RM in the late '70s? I think the builder was a gent called Brian Taylor. The layout featured a branch to a station called Glasson, and the whole thing looked as if it was great fun to operate. Stock was very good for its time - mainly detailed/converted Hornby Dublo with a few TriangHornby locos and kitbuilds and I remember thinking that although the station itself probably bore little relation to the real Lancaster, the layout had real atmosphere. If anyone knows which mag it appeared in, I'd be grateful if they'd tell me as I'd very much like to read about it again!

 

"Castle Combe" by Ken Payne (EM, GWR) is another one I'll never forget - such a spacious, open feel - especially the Tyling branch line where the auto train appeared to traverse a considerable distance before it reached the terminus.

Lancaster Junction  was 'Railway of the month' in Railway Modeller May 1978

 

The Locoshed, 48 Bury Old Road, M45 6TL   http://www.thelocoshedmcr.co.uk/

 

 

It's definitely got that proper model shop atmosphere and lots of stock (and not just the usual stuff) 

 

hi, due to a house move i am having to scale back to smaller lay out for the time being, and what came to mind was a small industrial layout under the stairs it will be about 8' 6'' x16 inch. i have no track plans yet but i have just ordered the robert stephenson & hawthorn 0-4-0 ct i have just found out the loco is HO and not 4mm but i just like the the prototype so i'm still getting it.. i am also thinking of going EM but a made up layout and not set on any real railway.so i can run locos and rolling stock that take my fancy 

 

any ideas, suggestions or pointer i should consider would be appreciated ,

 

check out Smallbrooke Studios who do resin kits for ubiquitous the NER P1 chaldron wagon (used by the NCB up to the early 1960s) and some other industrial wagons. Their kits are very accurate and very simple to construct

I've just purchased the pre-war Andrew Barclay 14" kit and it seems to be good value for quite frankly not very much money at all. Yes, it's quite basic but I much prefer to work up a kit without having to remove lots of inaccurate detail (an analogy from cooking, it's always easier to add more salt or sugar than to try to remove too much of it...). Moreover, the separate cab sides mean that backdating it to a pre-WW1 example should be pretty easy. 

I'm really tempted by this series of locos, I've always fancied a small industrial layout, space being at a premium.

 

I can't remember ever seeing any drawings of industrial locos in the model railway press - are there any sources?

 

Also what filler do you use in your resin, or, to put it another way, would I have to invest in tungsten carbide cutting tools?

 

Regards

There was a run of industrial loco drawings in the Railway Modeller between 1973-1977 IIRC

I wonder if this difficulty for some people to comprehend that a model is of a fictitious place is related to autism/aspergers. I don't know much about ASD, but wonder if for a person somewhere on the autism spectrum, when presented with a "real" model, they can see the model is "real", so it must be "real" - but then they are told it is "not real", a made-up place ...

 

And to make things worse it uses a real name or one close to a real name. If your brain struggles to process the ideas, the links between real/not real, that most people have no problem with, then you end up looking daft. Perhaps.

In my day job, I'm a psychologist researching both autism and the understanding of the real and un-real and I'm saying nowt...

 

Person standing in front of a P4 layout, "Is this 00 gauge".

Operator, "no, it's P4"

Person, "Whats P4"

Operator, "It is 4mm/1ft scale with correct gauge of track at 18.83mm, whereas 00 gauge has a track gauge of 16.5mm"

Person, "So it is 00 gauge with wider track"

 

Person then walks away to the EM layout next to the P4 layout, and asks "Is this 00 gauge".

Operator, "no, it's EM gauge"

Person, "Whats EM"

Operator, "It is 4mm/1ft scale with the gauge of track at 18.2mm, whereas 00 gauge has a track gauge of 16.5mm"

Person, "So it is 00 gauge with wider track"

 

The same person then goes to a 009 layout and asks, "Is this 00 gauge".

Operator, "No, it's 009"

Person, "Whats 009"

Operator, "It is 4mm/1ft scale, but narrow gauge prototypes with track gauge of 9mm, whereas 00 gauge has a track gauge of 16.5mm and is of standard gauge prototypes"

Person, "So it is 00 gauge with narrower track"

 

(Last I heard the three operators were all huddled in a corner of the local pub. mumbling and knocking back B52's).

 

Scale, gauge... scale, gauge...scale, gauge...oh dear, where has the rigour gone ?

'Expert' was dying to be lynched - why wasn't he?

 

M****** - Midland?

Your words not mine !  

At a certain specialist finescale show, oh, about nine months ago:

A leading pre-group 'expert'   - "Your Maryport & Carlisle engines, are they scratchbuilt ?"

Me  - "Ermm, yes" (resisting the temptation to say that they fell from the sky or were a very limited Bachmann issue)

'Expert' - "of course, you'll know that the M&CR lined it's engines  don't you ?" (ignoring lined tenders and boiler bands)

Me - "I know, I just haven't finished them yet"

'Expert' - "and ALL M&CR engines had numberplates but you've missed them off this one" (pointing to a model of M&CR No26)

Me - " Well, No. 26 was the only one that didn't"

'Expert' - "Oh, I think you're wro...(big clear photo of said engine sans number plates silently pushed under nose of said expert)...anyway, what did you varnish them with ?"

Me - "Johnson's Klear"

'Expert' - " Oh, you made a big mistake there, you should never ever use Klear on models, oh dear me, no" (that's me and several thousand aircraft modellers told, then)

Me - "I'll bear that in mind. Did you bring any of your M****** Railway models for us to see ?" (at which point said expert starts talking to one of his mates and ignores my obviously feeble attempt at fine-scale pre-group modelling)

My main influences have been the Madder valley, Derek Naylor's Aire Valley and John Allen's Gorre and Daphetid. - I do seem to like big layouts!

 

One other line which I found fascinating was a freelance TT scale pre-grouping line - the North Caledonian ?  there was  couple of articles on it in a late MRN and one of the early Model Railways mag called closely watched trains and More closely watched trains respectively. I have lost these now and if anyone has them, I would dearly like to find them again.  

 

There was a slate quarry line I saw at EXPONG 30 odd years ago, with lovely fine running scatch built locos. I seem to remember it was 4mm scale 7mm  gauge? any remember this ?

 

Another line I liked was a model of Uganda Railway is something like 10mm scale on 32mm track . Have some photos of this I took an early digital camera.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Tom 

Giraffes - now there's something you don't see on many layouts these days !

There are references to road vans being used in West Cumbria by the M&CR, LNWR and the Caley. The only drawings I've ever seen are for the LNWR van as published in Cumbrian Railways [the CRA journal] a few years ago, which appears to be a standard van with vacuum brakes and larger coach wheels. 

I believe the GWR only had two brake vans with the side doors which were used on branch lines (I think one was at Cirencester). The road vans were operated on numbered routes – Mike the Stationmaster says above that the number was painted on the van though I've not noticed this. They used ordinary goods vans for these services. There were several hundred designated routes.

 

Richard

There is a 4mm kit available from Frogmore confederacy / Dart Castings - http://www.dartcastings.co.uk/frogmore/3943.php

I've got a photo of it in a book some where I'll try and find it but yes it looked quite vulga

 

Edit to add information

 

Found it on Google 

I recall a photograph in the Railway Modeller c.1968-69 of a GWR Castle or King in a temporary pseudo-psychedelic livery with the caption saying that this had been done for a film. A one-off livery, a GWR engine, the end of steam, the 1960s - how come there isn't a groovy  'limited edition' (of 5000)  model ?!  And think what the DCC sound card would be like... 

How about liveries that could have been but never were ? One day, I'll produce a Bachmann SECR  mogul in Maryport & Carlisle colours to run on my 'Mealsgate' layout as the M&CR considered buying one of the surplus engines c.1920-21 but presumably though better of the idea. Actually, I think I'll probably emulate the M&CR in this regard...

Just before I walk the dogs, I've been reading George R.R Martins 'Game of Thrones' series, you may be familiar with the current HBO tv series, basically its like Lord of the Rings, only longer and more beheadings. Theres certainly a lot of scope for the Railway modeller with G.O.T, for one thing it would be a lot easier to reinforce the Wall if there was a line to Winterfell. Another idea I've had is how the Railways in the USA would have fared in the film Red Dawn.   

There was a LOTR-themed layout featured in RM in 1978-79 IRRC

What about liveries for the pre-group mergers that never happended, such as the MR/GSWR or the NER/GNR/GER, or the alternative versions of the 'big four' that were considered and rejected ?

Can't remember the last time I saw a treacle mine on a layout.

Or a "Sabden Treacle" wagon. These in jokes seemed to be quite widespread back in the 1950s-1960s to judge from the magazines of this period