46256

Hello Andy,

Mr Rhodes off licence…the man was a legend in the village. The village hall used to have a disco on a Friday night, circa 1970. A number of us would attempt to buy cider from him, we selected the most suitable of us…ie who looked most like an eighteen year old to attempt this. The volunteer had to remember what their date of birth would be if they were eighteen….in this case 1952. He wasnt often fooled, but when he was the cider tasted better. The road past the shop in this photo,  is Old church Road, I used to do a paper round  along it, again circa 1970. I used to hate going past the old church yard, situated, just past the shop on the left, in the dark. 

Another view of 60114 at New Street, for some reason when I put on this thread it has this lovely pink glow…now removed picture now in b and w

John R and I are discussing the differences between Tornado and the earlier A1 class. These of course were a requirement to run on the modern railway. Looking on Wikipedia the changes meant a reduction of an inch of the height of chimney dome and safety valves. The cab roof was also re profiled . I’ve just compared with my Bachmann A1 60147 North Eastern.The chimney is definitely shorter, cab front sheet shallower against boiler, and cab roof vents less prominent on the Hornby. I can live with these discrepancies on a layout locomotive. The biggest problem with mine, I re used the tender which had been behind the SEF W1. It is too high. I have just ordered a Hornby Tornado one. It will require changing the rear top plate back to 1960 s condition. I have done this already with a previous Hornby Tornado, since sold on. The moral  of this tale, how to add yet another unintended locomotive to my stock!

Hornby W1 arrived and I have to admit it knocks spots of my earlier effort. It won’t however have, the same emotional attachment,  I have with my home brewed models. 60163 now renumbered to 60114 WP Allen. It’s awaiting smokebox deflectors and nameplates ordered from a company called Silver Tay models. The Hornby A 1 chassis is a fine mover. 60114 the stray A1 that found itself in Worcester in 1964. 

A1 tornado chassis, arrived,  a real non starter to put under the SEF  60700.  It has two aws boxes cast in the rear bogie. I assume the real Tornado has these, so not appropriate for a 1960 A1. I have bought a A1 body , so will add another to my fleet. I ve sawn off one of the extra boxes, not recommended but necessary. 
 

This leaves 60700, a search on eBay has produced a Hornby RTR at a great price, duly ordered. I wasn’t going to take a chance on putting another duff chassis under my old one. I know , my earlier comments about being a box opener etc. I hadn’t included on my earlier model the rear twin lubricator nor detail on the right rear bogie. 

Ok missed the blindingly obvious just comparing the chassis, the A1 brakes are different located from back to front….ok more work….

Just comparing the chassis between the two photos, immediate differences noted ..valve guides, cylinder steam pipes,  motion bracket and rear Cartazzi truck, cylinders might need filing thinner to fit within SEF body…have to say the Hornby RTR is stunning, but where is the fun just opening a box!

A cautionary tale Manna, I hadn’t run this loco for some time. It has the same gear set up as the early Scots, guess what…gears came adrift, same problem the retainer keeping them meshed. It then became one of those modelling disasters, the more I tried to fix it, the worse it became. I eventually resolved, as I’ve done with the Hornby Scot chassis , to cannibalise it and replace with comet frames high level gears  and their big motor. Then to use wheels motion and front bogie. Sadly comet A3/4 frames and full chassis kits are out of stock. I then checked EBay and found below. Tornado chassis. The cost was roughly the same as comet chassis kit( the high level bits would  double the price) so one bought, chassis gears and motor complete. It has a better gear arrangement than the Hornby A4 version. I will report how I get on fitting it. I’ve retained my rear bogie  2 plus 2 , from my now defunct chassis, to be fitted to this. 

Just down the line from Water Orton, the glory that was Saltley MPD circa 1962

Photos 60700 SEF on Hornby A4 railroad chassis.

Class 25 , pristine bogies denote the modification described, and lastly 60077 passes Water Orton West box, a rare optical illusion, noted in the West Midlands…usually after five pints, has obscured the sidings.

I suppose more a modification to rtr rather than kitbuild…have a  Bachmann blue class 25. It has been unpowered for some time. I’ve used it to double head electrics through the station on the Trent Valley diversions.  Ive had some doubts that a single class 25 would have been able to do this. In any event, I’ve wanted to re motorise  the loco, especially as I’ve become slightly nostalgic for BR blue. Searches on eBay showed that class 24 chassis are some ten pounds cheaper than class 25 for some reason. A class 24 one purchased. I then realised the underframes are completely different between the two classes. I have therefore transferred the motor weight etc  from one to the other, fiddly but now completed, trickiest bit getting the two wires from the bogies through the little holes in the upper castings, then attaching to circuit board, whilst engaging the gear.

John yes that is also recorded in the Midland lines book, the Scot workings to Newcastle

Talk of coincidence, what is in my display case,? 60077 White Knight, complete with German smoke deflectors . I knew I had a couple of Hornby A3 s , didn’t realise I had this one. I will stage a re enactment of  its journey through my modelled location!

Gday Manna

I created my version of 60700 some years ago, like you using the SEF kit. I’m ashamed to say I made a real dogs dinner of the excellent kit chassis. I therefore like you , utilised a Hornby A4 chassis. The completed model, along with a number of other “ specials” reside in my display case. 
 

best wishes Brian

Have just read the chapter in detail, the author details how a number of Eastern locomotives were utilised in January 1962 on the 12 43 pm and 3 30 pm Newcastle to Bristol trains. A3 60077 White Knight then based at Ardsley travelled to Brum. This was the loco that returned via Wychnor Jct as the Water Orton route was closed due to a Sunday diversion..

Hello John

blooming frustrating looking at the photo, oh for a better view.  I’m just grateful though, that Vic the signalman at West box recorded it for posterity .

The author of the book where I gleaned the info, is clear that Sandwich did travel past Derby on one occasion,  but failed prior to reaching Birmingham. The  same author records another A3 returning from Brum , north eastwards,  but sadly for me missing my line, going via the Wychnor Junction route instead.

I can only assume by 62/3 that Kings x was cascading its steam locomotives northwards pending the ban on steam into London. The other alternative a shed poaching another’s loco for the odd  trip or two..

I met up with my former trainspotting chums recently on SVR. I asked them if they knew of a ROD O4 traversing our sacred rails….they didn’t. This same book records one being seen at Bromsgrove…63610 on 12 th June 1960

good enough for me to justify my Bachmann example.

The book in question Midland main lines  by John Palmer

best wishes Brian

Thanks John 
 

I think it was 60039 Sandwich from further research.  Humorist is looking fine, I’ve just read, on your other thread, the other changes required rather than just adding the unique deflectors. Best wishes Brian

I’ve been reading one of my books concerning the NE SW line, and under the heading you wouldn’t believe what went through, the author confirms A3 s were utilised along with V2 and B1 locos during the period of diesel failures 1962 1963. These locos certainly got to Derby and at least two A3 s went on to Birmingham, one being 60039Sandwich. The book also confirms Book Law was used on the Sutton Coldfield to Stirling night car sleeper. I’ve just looked up 60039 and viewed a photo of that loco in 1962/3 on East Coast line. It has German smoke deflectors and the later tender, so the same as the loco shown  in the Water Orton photo.

On a separate correspondence John R has been working on his A3 one off Humorist. This having the full smoke deflectors. I shared my photo of an A3 going past west box and the sidings. I have read recently what it’s identity was…then promptly forgot where I had read it! In any event this , then led me to discover how many Eastern Pacific’s came to Brum in fifties and sixties, other than Scotsman.

A Birmingham history thread identified 60088 Book Law was seen at the ex LNWR shed at Aston. I recall a story in my spotting days an A3 being used on the nightly Sutton Coldfield car sleeper, Aston shed providing that trains, motive power usually a Britannia. There is a well documented record  of 60114 visiting the Midlands…

A further search just now has discovered this photo of another A1 this time on a special at Moor Street

In correspondence with Iain 92220 again about Royal Scot models. Hornby chassis . The subject of Hornby chassis fail, replacement with comet chassis . We discussed the use of Hornby wheels and some of the issues when combining them with the comet chassis and high level gears and motor. The photos below were shared showing the pick up arrangement on all wheels given they are plastic centred. 46120 is my latest, 46126 is being worked on.

Hello John good to see Humorist on the roster. The joy of the unexpected, possibly the only time an A3 other than the preserved Scotsman visited Birmingham in steam days. I have seen it’s identity published somewhere will try and look it up. An A1 60114 also ventured to Worcester, on a rail tour returning a few days later.

A great video Iain, nice to see your locomotives in action

Nice photo John, you feel the loco is working example

best wishes Brian

Returning to Bromsgrove via Water Orton

Thank you both, I have shown a humour response to Signal Engineer post, on reflection such a mishap either in real life or on the layout would be terrible. I did put eight coaches behind it, after adding the lead weight. The loco handled it with ease, even up my mini Lickey incline exit from the fiddle yard. On the real railway I travelled to Tamworth the other day from New Street. It is a journey I’ve rarely done these last thirty years since moving over the city to the Black  Country.The latest unit just glided through my station…seventy plus? It was a sad journey on a line I travelled on weekly in the seventies ( Water Orton to Brum).  Saltley TMD is no more, Washwood Heath sidings a shadow of their former selves, and nature in the form of vegetation springing up everywhere. On a positive note I found myself with half an hour to spare at Tamworth on the return journey at about 11 pm. Leaving my wife and sister in law in the High Level waiting room, I went and stood on the low level platform . I was treated to a variety of trains. In my active spotting years 69 to 73 the famous Tamworth field had lost its appeal, certainly to my fellow Water Orton crowd. We saw the Midland lines stuff from our vantage point at Water Orton, the west coast stuff we captured by cheap visits to Crewe…with the benefit of doing the sheds. I still regret now not spending some time at Tamworth in those years.