Mark Carne

John, that is a truly remarkable story, well done for taking the time to find out. The postcard is a nice object in itself too, I can't recall seeing one before, except in an article in the Bassett Lowke Society magazine, Lowko News. It does occur to me, that there might be 2 people who would be very interested in this, one would be the editor of the BL society mag, who I'm sure would like to publish this fascinating story, the other being Christine Sanderson, from 78 Derngate, the museum devoted to 78 Derngate in Northampton, W J Bassett Lowkes Mackintosh house. https://www.78derngate.org.uk/ Mark

Hello Douglas. On the matter of track, I seem to recall that Bassett Lowke small scale permanent way, which was sold for gauges O and 1 between the wars, is actually scale for gauge 2. Basically the same size rail section, code 200, is still popular in gauge 2 today, but is acknowledged to be slightly overscale, which is why there has been a gradual move towards code 180 for gauge 1, promoted and sold by gauge 1 track supremo Cliff Barker. Mark

Here's a rather poor photo of my own example, on which they aslo took the trouble to paint out the M prefix on the number panel on the body side. These things are an interesting rabbit hole in collecting that I have well and truly fallen down, having original and modified versions of most of this range, which thankfully isn't huge, 10 originals, and a few more modified. Mark

Apologies for the belated reply. Nothing wrong with it, just Marklin getting out the German equivalent of Humbrol in 1923, after the grouping of Britains mainline railways, to update their stock. They went much further with some items, very skillfully hand painting out the original pre grouping letters, and painting on new post grouping lettering. Mark

John, thank you for your thoughtful and detailed answer, I think all of us as modellers in whatever format we choose have had similar struggles, balancing our mix of desires with the available space. As you say though, with this kind of modelling, it's not the end of the world if you change your mind! Cheers, Mark

John, I suspect your table is post WW2. the photos I've attached are from a Bassett Lowke Model Railway Handbook, 4th edition, 1912. These standards are what pre and post WW1 Bassett Lowke will conform to, or is supposed to. All of this is based on the use of track with a hollow sheet metal rail, either conventional tinplate or Lowko track with a hollow rail in brass or tinplate, to a slightly smaller size than conventional tinplate rail. Note the standard depth of flange, 3.25 mm or 1/8", to ensure reliable running on tinplate track with a rail head diameter of 3.25 mm, when loose laid on a not necessarily smooth or level floor. And to drag this back to O gauge, a pet point of mine, is there are 3 basic standards in O gauge ( I know I will be bombarded with numerous others, but in this discussion, we are talking from a commercial, historical, pre 1970 perspective), tinplate, coarse and fine, and the O gauge standard and dimensions here are those for O gauge railways using tinplate track. Trying to run coarse standard wheels on tinplate track is about as successful as running them on finescale track, but people persist in confusing the two standards and thinking that they are the same and totally compatible, they are not. Cheers, Mark

May I ask why you left the head shunt so long, seemingly at the expense of a shorter run round loop? A head shunt half the length would appear to suffice, and would permit you to run round 2 bogie coaches happily. Maybe somewhere in between the two, to keep the goods siding a bit longer? Cheers, Mark

I saw Nearholmers request for information on the back to back dimensions of a Bassett-Lowke 112 or Peckett Tank, over on the Train Collectors Society facebook page, and having spotted where the query originated, I thought I'd come and answer it. I measured the back to back on 2 Bing for BL 112 tank locos, a Winteringham for BL Peckett tank, and a Carette Peckett tank. The results were, Generic green clockwork 112, 39mm. Midland Railway electric 112, 37-38mm. Winteringham for BL Peckett, clockwork converted to electric using original wheels, axles and mech frame, 39mm. Carette Peckett, clockwork, 37mm. So I would not expect any of these to pass through G1MRA standard pointwork. I know they don't, as a friend who is both interested in O gauge tinplate and gauge 1 live steam, decided to buy a Bing for BL 112 tank last year, to run at his local permanent gauge 1 track where he runs his gauge 1 live steam. It didn't pass through the points, so he sold it back to the guy he brought it from. I do actually have a couple of LGB R3 points in a pile of stuff in my off site storage facility, purchased many years ago, with some Aristocraft track, with the intention of building a portable track for running clockwork and steam vintage gauge 1, but ended up acquiring a heap of tinplate track after, so it never happened! Think the loop of Aristocraft track had one day of use on the lawn in my Mums garden, and the points have never been used, I really must move that all on some time! I've added a photo of the generic 112, so called because the sold this version as a number of different company names, NER, GWR and LSWR among them, and a photo of the minimum space vintage gauge 1 layout I displayed at an event just before last Christmas, to show just how little space it really needs, and to tease those among you teetering on the brink! Cheers, Mark

Greenly and Bassett Lowke changed scales in both O and 1 before WW1. The first 3 scale model locos in gauge 1 that BL commissioned from Bing, the GCR Sir Alexandera, a GWR Atbara, and the LNWR Precursor were all 3/8" to the foot, but after that, they shifted to 10mm to the foot, the last being the Precursor introduced in 1907. The first O gauge scale model loco BL commissioned from Bing was the O gauge version of the GWR Atbara, which was 1/4" to the foot. It looks a crude thing to modern eyes, but in 1904, it was nothing short of a miracle which we cannot comprehend, as we are so accustomed to smaller scale model railways. It was still very early days for model railways in O gauge, and without digging through reference books, I cannot recall another scale model O gauge loco commissioned by BL from Bing before they went to 7mm scale. Note in the catalogue description of the GWR loco, it even mentions the scale, 3/8". Mark

Most people really don't realise just how prolific Bing were in the British market in the 1920s. And how keenly priced they were compared with Hornby. Or just how much Hornby and Bing copied each other and made introductions on an almost tit for tat basis. There's certainly plenty of 1920s British market Bing still floating around in the UK. I'd say, based on my collecting experience, it would be far easier to build up a wide ranging collection of British market Bing from the 1920s, than the equivalent in Hornby. And replying to the earlier point about the cost of things, I recall reading in the reproduction Bing 1912 catalogue that the retail price of a lithographed George the Fifth was 12/6, and in the pre WW1 B/L catalogues, a Carette litho George the Fifth or GNR Atlantic was 8/6. "Cheapie" Carette wagons were 1/- each. They must have sold in reasonable quantities, as they still turn up often enough. Mark

The Bing for Gamages Ivatt 4-4-0 was thankfully one of those semi scale items that was made before and after WW1. I have a pre 1914 example, which I don't have a photo of to hand unfortunately. Which I immediately found in the relevant file on the computer after posting this comment! Mark

Thank you for remembering! Here is a photo of my Mignon display, from the first time it was exhibited, at the Beckenham and West Wickhem Model Railway Club annual vintage show. Mark

The loco isn't generic, it's an LNWR Chopper tank increased in size until it was big enough to take the smallest possible clockwork mech Bing could make. Mark

Don't believe everything you read, the Spa side at Eridge is getting a ramp cut into the platform, to permit a run round. Mark.

That GTV dates from around 1920, only livery they litho version came in before WW1 was LNWR black. Mark

12 volt DC according to the instructions, reproduced in the Hugar book by Paul Brooks. Mark

I have to admit, I'm equally bemused as to why they have chosen to do things this way round, what with the new LBSCR Atlantic at the Bluebell being so close to completion. No big news stories to accompany the GN version, as far as I'm aware? Either way, I'm in, I've got to be, after the campaign a friend and I have mounted against Paul for the last 3 or 4 years..... Mark

It's useful to remember the less than obvious fact, at least from an early 21st century view point, that when electricly first came to the domestic setting, there were no electric appliances. It was purely for lighting, then came thoughts of other things that could be powered by this new source of energy. Mark

The gauge 1 0-6-2T is indeed Bing for B/L. Attached is a photo of my example. Some of the descriptions have to rate as probably the worst lot descriptions in the history of auctions, the description of the 0-6-2T is "Vintage iron and tin motorised G scale model locomotive". I read it over the phone to a friend, and he was amazed and shocked to discover what it was actually describing. Also a couple of good gauge 1 locos separated from their tenders, which appear as separate lots. Oh well, some buyers may get a bargain, but pity the unfortunate vendor. Mark

Those knees almost certainly belong to Tappers supremo Graham Lock, well known shorts wearer.

Did someone mention trains? Mark

Dragging me into the conversation? Thank you for the invite Kevin! :-) Well, the B/L 112 tank was a post war (1921) introduction in O gauge, but it did appear pre 1914 in gauge 1 and 2, 1911 for steam, and 1912 for clockwork, so maybe the gentleman has that slightly confused. I have a bit of a "thing" for 112 tanks, having 7 O gauge and 6 gauge 1 examples! Probably the most interesting are the ones referred to in B/L collecting circles as the generic versions, in green livery, as in my photos, Actually, the example with the white/black/white lining is the pre grouping GWR version (don't laugh, you'll hurt its feelings, and the colour and livery detail are a match for the Bing for B/L O gauge GWR 2-4-2T Birdcage tank), and the white/black/gold lined example is the NER version, the white/black/gold lining matching Aerolite in the NRM at York. It's something I've been meaning to write an article about for the Bassett Lowke Society magazine for some time, but failing to do. Short Precursor tanks, a great loco for collectors to obsess about, due to the large number of different liveries they did it in. LNWR, CR, MR, GNR, NBR, GWR, LMS, LNER and SR, and that might not be all of them. I've only got one, an SR example. Mark

A recent acquisition that deserves a place here, this set was made by George Fischer, a German maker of tin toys of the inexpensive kind, in the mid 1920s. I need to sort 4 wheels and a couple of axles. Last photo contains an O gauge Bing for Bassett Lowke loco for scale. Mark

I was lucky enough to know John as a member of both the HRCA and the TCS, a true gent and a great friend, he will be seriously missed. Mark