jdb82

Hi Peter, Apologies if this is a rather amateurish question.....I’ve read through and follow a number of your threads following your builds, and the quality of finish you achieve is outstanding. I’m currently part way through my first brass build and loving every second of it. I notice that you always seem to keep your brass almost completely unblemished. How do you do this? My kit was quite old when I bought it, and the brass already quite tarnished. Do you have a secret for keeping it from tarnishing, or do you just keep it polished? If so, what do you use? Really enjoy following your threads - an absolute treasure trove of useful advice and inspiration. John

Looks great! Very neat job. I need to read you painting thread for your methods on lining..... Enjoy the UK - I'm just putting my shopping list together as I type. In the summer when I did the same thing, I found my weight limit on the plane did not stretch quite s far as I hoped ;-) Better luck this trip hopefully, although I'm not overly optimistic!

Answers on a postcard please! I'm afraid I'm still learning the finer points of the various pipes, valves and knobs that you come across....purely going on photos found on the web. I think the larger of the 2 pipes may well be a post-preservation addition, as it seems to be absent from the older locos I have photos for.....see below. As for whether it is appropriate for me, that depends what route I decide to go gown. The intention when I started out (and still now) was always purely to use this kit as a learning tool, rather than to end up with an accurate representation of a specific loco. I needed to learn the basics of brass kit construction, as well as painting and weathering techniques, but didn't have a specific loco, or time period in mind. Really, I should model the loco in it's preserved state, particularly in light of the exhaust pipe, but also because these are the photos I've largely been using. However, I really want to get into the weathering aspect of finishing too, which modelling the older working locos would be much better for. So now I have a decision to make: 1) Paint and finish in preserved state - shiny and polished as the photo above 2) Paint and finish in a 1910's-ish state (whether I remove the exhaust pipe or not remains to be seen!! May use a bit of modeller's license) 3) Go for a slightly run-down creation of the preserved version to allow me to practice some weathering. Food for thought.....need to chew it over fairly quickly though as I need to obtain paint and weathering materials to bring back to Brunei with me in a few weeks. Thanks for your input and observation - it's exactly what I need :-) Edit:- It might be worth me saying that I do not have a layout either currently or planning for it to run on, so am not bound to any particular era :-)

Thanks for the detailed explanation Phil - all makes perfect sense. I shall certainly be giving all of the above a go when I return in the new year :-) It seems like building a sweet running chassis (even a simple one) is modelling's way of teaching precision and accuracy! Fractions of a millimetre..... I know the accepted order of building is to do the chassis first, and then then body, but in this case, I'm glad I've done it the other way round. I think if I had starting with the chassis, it may have put me off!

A packed diary and a 3 week trip back to the UK in a weeks time (via Dubai for a few days to take in some world class badminton) means that work on the Hudswell Clarke will most likely have to stop until after Christmas. Ever the impatient though, I can't quite stop myself planning ahead to the next few stages. First off, the coupling rods. I haven't yet laminated these, but I wonder whether it is best to articulate them on the centre wheel, or to solder them together to form a rigid coupling rod? I'm deliberately keeping the chassis very simple - no compensation or springing - just a rigid chassis. I'm perhaps jumping the gun a little here as I haven't yet sorted the chassis out (see my previous post). The next couple of questions are born out of necessity, as I need to buy paints and equipment in the UK, as I can't get them here in Brunei. I would like to invest in an airbrush - I've seen some good things written in the forums on RMweb about Harder & Steenbeck. Thanks to my birthday being quite close to Christmas, I have a top end budget of about £100-£120, which should be enough for a decent bit of kit. Even though I'm a Yorkshireman, I don't mind spending a bit more if it will be of benefit in the future. 'Tis a good incentive to develop my skills in airbrushing, as currently, I've never even help one before!! Apologies if I'm incredibly naive here, but I'd like it to be able to spray anything from a wide area for the primer coats, to fine lines for detailing. Does that exist?! Lastly, I need to buy paint to bring back with me. Which means I need to make my mind up what livery to choose. When I first started this, it was purely a kit that I was going to teach myself the basics of kit-building. However, the further I have got with it, the more I have found myself looking at photos to make sure it's 'right'. I could go for the green livery and model the preserved version of 'Gothenburg' below (although I believe it's currently in Thomas blue ready for the Christmas season, which I have no intention of recreating!). Another option, and perhaps one that I'm favouring at the moment, is to model an early 1900's working prototype to enable me to weather it....I do like a well-weathered loco. Is there anybody out there who knows much (anything) about the MSC Railway? Obviously all the photos are in black and white - I'm assuming that they were in black, but not sure what colour they were lined in....indeed it seems that some weren't lined at all, although this could leave the model looking very plain. Any thoughts on the above?

Thanks for the compliment, and thanks for the advice too..... been looking at so many photos of pipework recently that I must admit it didn't even cross my mind to look at the hooks. I'll jump onto it this week. Simon, thanks for the advice. I'll see what happens once I've got the rods made up, but I like the idea of unsoldering/resoldering on the jig - hadn't thought of that.

Coupling hooks have been laminated and attached, along with the buffers. Also soldered in the bearings to the chassis sides. I have a master chassis jig from Hobby Holidays, and this is the first time I have used it. I won't be soldering the frames together until I have laminated the coupling rods, as these are used to determine the exact position of each of the dummy axels on the jig. Just out of curiosity, I tried to slide one of the frame sides onto the jig, but found it to be an extremely tight fit, to the point where the frame was wanting to bend.....I thought better of forcing it! No matter how much I adjusted the position, even by minute amounts, I couldn't seem to find a location where it slid on easily. I'm not sure if this a result of me not yet locating them using the coupling rods, inaccuracy in the etch, a tight bearing (I haven't reamed them yet), or a problem with the jig (highly unlikely....hopefully!). My plan is to do the rods sometime this week and take it from there. Hopefully I'll not need to unsolder the bearings, as I made quite a neat job of them (for me anyway!!).

Thanks - that’s helpful :-) So just to confirm then, that a bit of tarnishing has no effect once airbrushed with primer? If you’ve not guessed, I’m a painting virgin.....just working on my first loco currently. Loving it, but learning as I go!

I'm considering buying an ultrasonic cleaner to prepare my models for painting. This is possibly a daft question, so apologies for my ignorance..... My current project definitely has plenty of general muck and grime that an ultrasonic cleaner would remove, but does it also remove the general tarnishing of the brass you get as you handle it, and the brass oxidises? I suppose what I'm asking is, can I just pop my tarnished bare brass (as it were....) into the cleaner for x minutes and have it come out all gleaming and shiny? That sounds far too simple!! As always, your advice would be treasured :-)

Progress! Lots of little bits over the last couple of weeks that individually, didn't seem worth writing about or photographing. The tank tops and boiler were all soldered together to the cab front The dome and safety valves were soldered on, as I still has access from below the boiler for these. The castings were a pretty large heat sink, particularly the dome, and so the temperature needed to be cranked right up on the soldering iron - perhaps a little too high as I could see the element starting to glow.... As I said in my previous post, patience is not always a strength of mine, and so I decided to add the pipework details at this stage, rather than wait until after painting. Connecting plates, and taps were all added using straightened out electrical wire, some waste etch and a spare casting to try and replicate the photo in post #54. Need a bit more cleaning up around where the pipes enter the tanks, but other than that, I'm pretty pleased with the outcome Next, I Araldited the chimney on to the smokebox, and bent & riveted the cab roof. Rain strips were carefully soldered on to the sides. Once I knew how far the roof overhung the cab, I soldered on the whistle to the front of the cab. The roof just placed on the cab in the photos, as obviously I still need to paint and fit all the cab details in place. Just the buffers & coupling hooks to add to the buffer plates, and then onto the chassis, which I've been putting off for a while now

Impatience won out, and I have started the pipework on top of the tanks and boiler - I'll post some photos when I've got a bit further with it. These are not provided with the kit, and the various lengths of nickel silver wire were all either too thick or too thin. So I've straightened out some electrical wire (thanks Peter - N15Class - for your uber-helpful scratch building thread http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/100390-scratch-building-the-way-i-do-it/page-3 post #69), and used a few spares from the off-cuts box. Coming along nicely. The right hand side (as you look from the cab) will be fully detailed, but nowhere have I found any photos of the left of the loco. Not a clue what's up on top on the left hand side of the loco, so if anyone has any photos that can help, it would be much appreciated :-)

Mmmmmm.....I think this drill-service.co.uk might be providing some things to fill Santa's sack this year ;-) Thanks for the info.

All good info for the next one! i knew when I started that I'd make mistakes - in fact that's why I started with this particular loco..... purely to teach myself the do's and don'ts before starting on something a bit more layout-specific. I'll definitely go for screwing various elements together next time. Makes total sense. Do you need to make many adjustments to the kit when doing this, or is it just a case of drilling a hole and soldering on a nut?

Unfortunately, not experienced at all ;-) This'll be my first one, so thanks for the advice. I would love to get everything on there first, but need to restrain myself! I'll get a copy of Ian Rathbone's book, as I have seen him mentioned before on other threads. Mmmmm.....hadn't even considered the sandboxes! I could take them off, but risk making a bit of a mess if I do. I might just have to work around these somehow. I guess blindly following the instructions is not always the best way!

Spent a bit of time 'pondering' yesterday evening, and cleaning up a few castings such as the chimney, dome and safety valves. I'm getting to the stage where I need to add all the pipework on top of the boiler & tanks. I'm very much looking forwards to this stage, but I'm not sure whether I should add all the pipework yet, or wait until it's painted. I like the idea of being able to solder everything in - it gives things a greater sense of permanence (in my mind, although I realise this is not necessarily true!), but this will make painting very awkward if I add it all at this stage. Alternatively, do I try and reign in my natural impatience, wait until after painting, and then epoxy them? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated Photo below is what I'm aiming for.

I'm currently building a short tank Hudswell Clarke from the MSC (7mm scale), and have been looking for a set of drawings. Where did you obtain yours from? I'd be interested in getting a set for myself!

Managed to get back to the workbench this weekend after a couple of busy weeks at work. Solved the smokebox saddle wrapper issue by adding a strip of brass to the bottom of the etch, which affectively pushed the curve up to the bottom of the smokebox. It's not the smoothest join ever, but it's out of sight unless you turn the body upside down and look for it. Some of the short tank Hudswell Clarke, had tank top extensions to cover the gap between the top of the tank and the boiler. My model is also to have these, and so I knocked some up from waste etch as they were not provided with the kit. These were soldered on with a deliberate 'join' visible, as on the prototype they were an additional plate, resting on brackets on the tank. Next, the boiler assembly was soldered to the footplate and up against the cab front. A bit of cleaning up was needed here. I was unsure whether to solder or Araldite the smokebox end to the footplate.....I knew that it would be difficult to solder cleanly from the front (there was no access from the back), but wasn't sure if Araldite would be strong enough in the long run, so soldered it on in the end. Still need a little more cleaning up, but I think it will look OK eventually. Not sure if this was the right way to go or not. Last job for the weekend was fitting the handrail. This is a one-piece rail that runs from the tanks, and curves round the front of the smokebox, following it's profile. It took me quite a long time and a couple of wasted pieces of wire before I got it right. These extra details as they are added to the basic structure are really starting to bring the model to life now. More detailing is next up - I had a look at the clack valves. Unfortunately, the castings in the kit are not the correct ones for the prototype. Even then, they are pretty poor quality, so I need to either source some others (which would mean waiting to complete this detailing until I return to the UK over Christmas), or attempt to make my own. I will probably plump for the latter option, as I'd like to get the bodywork done before then!

Wish I'd have read this post 24 hours earlier.....Spent most of yesterday afternoon battling with my one-piece hand rail All in place now though and looks OK. In fact it's the first time I've come across this thread - nice work! I'll be following this one with interest.

Agreed! I'm currently working on my first brass kit, and can only aspire to this level of craftsmanship! Shame we can't always just leave them naked rather than painting - I think they look beautiful in the raw metal

Although not perfect, something like Milliput could work if the gap between the saddle and the smokebox is not too big - that way you could form the radius by simply pressing the boiler into the Milliput, trim off the excess, smooth with water, file and sand. I've just done something similar with my saddle, but it was only a small gap, but too big to fill with solder. It is a bit of an experiment, and one which for my loco is mainly out of sight...

I'll go for the solder option with the blemish in the door I reckon. The more I work with it, the more I like the stuff! I actually soldered the door onto the front of the smokebox - I was fairly careful, and it did take a while, but after a bit of work with wet & dry paper, all looked good. I think the making of a new saddle might be the way forwards, but out of brass, not plasticard.....not going to find much of that out here, so I'll bring a stock back with me when I come home for Christmas. The profile of the curve isn't bad, it just needs to be higher up.

Onto the smokebox. I needed to make the wrapper from scratch, so the first task was to measure out, cut and roll the rectangle of brass needed to wrap around the front of the smokebox. I dimpled out the rivets, and then soldered on the wrapper to the front of the smokebox. The smokebox door and locking handles were one of the lost wax castings provided with the kit. These do not have the finest of finishes to them and required quite a lot of tidying up before use. The door needed quite a lot of polishing, and even then still has a very noticeable blemish (bottom left). I'm still undecided how to fix this....solder and file back, or maybe Milliput? It's not huge, but I need to do something with it, otherwise it's the only part of the loco I'll ever look at! Soldered the door, seal and handle onto to smokebox and gave it a clean. Attached this to boiler and stood and admired it for a while. These stages of the kit start to make it look like a loco! Beyond the appearance, just the satisfying and increasing weight of what I've put together so far is a pleasing indicator of progress! Or maybe that's just the large quantities of solder I've been using ;-) Question for the day..... As can be seen from the photo below, when I attached the boiler support at the back of the smokebox, there was a gap between this and the boiler. This might have been a lack of accuracy when I made the smokebox wrapper, or it could have been something (unknown) else. Either way, everything looks OK when placed on the running plate, but I need to fill this gap with something. Should I solder some scrap brass behind the gap and fill the recess with solder, or should I just fill it with Milliput and sand it smooth? It's not really going to be very visible, unless you go looking for it.

the motor I have is rather wide and long.......just too big really. A bit of extra trimming of the boiler might be needed.... My boiler beachhead I think I have made a bit too deep (I had parts that I'm still waiting for too, so made my own in the end), but this might work to my favour for fitting the motor in

Looking good! Hats off to you for tacking valve gear.....not ventured that far yet. Another week or so, and I'll be onto the chassis of my loco - been putting this off for a bit now

Yep, you're right....maybe I should have referred to it at the depth of the firebox. I can take a certain amount off this measurement, but if I take too much off, there will be gap between the front of the firebox and the recess in the internal floor