TangoOscarMike

Dear all Almost a year ago I posted pictures of my first attempt at putting a tender engine on the cheapest-chassis-of-all. My aim is to produce bodies that simply clip onto the unmodified chassis. https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/135272-freelance-tender-engine-for-the-Hornby-0-4-0-holden-chassis/ This post produced a lot of useful feedback, and it started an extensive offline discussion with Gibbo, which has resulted in what I hope is the penultimate version. Contrary to my concept, it is necessary to make two tiny modifications to the chassis - the rear coupling hook must be removed (but these fall out by themselves anyway!) and in some cases it is necessary to trim the ends of the motor retention spring. The basic dimensions are finalised except that I want to make the boiler a tiny bit fatter, and raise it a tiny bit, to give better clearance for the motor. And this will give me an opportunity to incorporate any further suggestions from this forum. I plan no further modifications to the tender, although I am going to make an alternative version without coal. So. These are the 3D printed parts: And here they are with the additional off-the-shelf parts - a donor locomotive, a NEM coupling and two pairs of wheels: Before painting, I pour plaster into the tender for weight (not brittle plaster-of-Paris, but one of the modern resin-reinforced plasters):

Just a tiny bit of progress to report. I was planning a significant remodelling along the join, but I decided not to overdo things. So I've simply filled the gap above and below the door, and replaced the destroyed hinges with scraps of plastic (only necessary on one side). I reckon that'll have to do.

"... plausible nonsense. maybe...". Indeed, much of your nonsense is plausible. Magnificent!

Right, I've ordered some of those couplings and some of the old-fashioned wide Bachmann couplings with holes for screws. And I already have big Hornby NEM couplings. When the new things arrive I'll tackle this again. Meanwhile there is still work to be done on the body and the roof. And for the ducket project I've produced a picture showing the original version and a possible new version side by side. As always, comments would be most welcome.

I have no idea what the right answer is, but the "masking tape and super glue trick" has popped into my head. So here it is. Cheers Tom

Thanks Corbs What specific product(s) do you use? Is it this? https://www.Bachmann.co.uk/product/branchline-long-straight-nem-coupling-with-pocket-x1036-030/

Thanks Jon I'd glanced at them before, but now I've had a proper look. They don't have plain Hornby old-fashioned wide non-NEM tension lock couplings, but they do have the Bachmann part, which looks very similar. And there are innumerable NEM couplings (but I already have those). AND there are a few NEM pockets, which might be suitable for my needs. Although it seems a bit silly to buy attachments to attach the attachment. It's difficult to search for "couplings", because (a) there are so many different styles of couplings, (b) there are lots of results for things that _have_ couplings and (c) there are also results for things with coupling rods! I'll probably go for the Bachmann part, from Peter's Spares or perhaps another reputable online vendor. Cheers Tom

Thanks The Johnster So, those Parkside mountings are for Bachmann couplings, and I realise now that the Bachmann spare couplings product range is a bit of a rabbit hole. There are many different products. Maybe the best thing for me would be the basic Bachmann coupling (https://www.Bachmann.co.uk/product/branchline-large-loop-screw-on-coupling-x1036-009/) screwed directly to (a brass bracket soldered to) my chassis. I'll probably order a packet of these. I see also that I was wrong - the basic Hornby coupling (in plastic) does exist as a spare part (https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/shop/accessories/spares-accessories/wheels-couplings/large_couplings_pack_-_plastic.html), but it seems not to be actually available (I can't find it with a quick scan of online retailers).

I'd be grateful for suggestions for the couplings. I want to use tension-lock couplings for compatibility with everything else I own. I have some Hornby NEM tension-lock couplings, so: Plan A was to use a piece of rectangular section brass tube as a coupling pocket. I would attach it to the (brass) chassis with a pylon of brass tube. This plan hasn't got off the ground because they don't have rectangular tube of suitable dimensions at the local model shop. And I haven't found any online yet. I think that 4mm by 3mm would be about right (depending on the wall thickness) - the shop has all sorts of dimensions, but not 4 by 3. Plan B would be to use one of the pressed metal couplings from older rolling stock. One of these could be attached to a vertical piece of studding, which in turn could be soldered to the chassis. I've had a look online and I haven't been able to find these couplings as a spare part (and I don't want to butcher any of my old rolling stock). I could possibly take a drill to one of the plastic couplings I already have..... I want to get this sorted out before I start assembling the Cleminson underframe, because the first step with the underframe construction is to choose the wheelbase. I would be awfully vexed if I chose a long wheelbase and didn't leave room for the couplings. Thanks in advance!

I'm pottering away, slowly making progress... The roof joint came out well, and was surprisingly stiff. But I added another piece of plasticard nevertheless. The sides of the two pieces have better alignment than they did when dry-fitted. I put the roof back on the body to preserve the alignment while gluing three layers of strips into the unnecessary gap I'd made. I might be overdoing it with this approach to keeping things aligned, but I reckon that's better than under-doing it. The foil is to keep the roof from getting stuck to the body, of course. But it didn't prevent a dribble of glue from getting perilously close to fogging a window. I was planning to use filler on the gap, but instead, once it had been built up, I simply glued a piece of 10 thou plasticard all the way across. I hope that I'll get a nice smooth surface when I sand it back. And despite the good alignment of the edges, I'm following Gibbo's suggestion with strips of plasticard where the sides are too far in.

Thanks Gibbo It can't be symmetrical left-to-right, because of how it plugs into the window. But the current design is symmetrical top-to-bottom, which means that there is only one design, and it works on both sides. This saves me from any risk of putting them the wrong way round (sometimes my attention slips!). But this feature is not worth preserving if it means the the shape is sub-optimal...... Making it thinner will make the curve more gentle anyway. If I make it just 1mm taller (1/2mm top and bottom) then maybe that will contribute to a nice elegant shape. I shall meditate and doodle.

Meanwhile..... I prefer to take pictures outside, with my wife's camera. But the rain has driven me indoors and I'm using my phone, with the stairs for a booth. My 3D printed duckets have arrived. Here is an offcut coach end, with part of the beading removed. And this is what it looks like with the ducket in place. It's a little bit too close to the door. If I decide to use them for this coach project (I'm still prevaricating) then I will fix that with a little bit of filing. But in any case I'll make a new 3D model for future use, and perhaps for sale. I'm considering having it stick out a little less. I think there might also be room to make it slightly taller, producing a more elegant curve top and bottom. I would be most grateful for any suggestions.

So. Here are the two roof halves. I've removed some glazing and cleaned away the ejector pin marks and suchlike underneath. I've also roughened the underneath a little with 600 grit sandpaper. And here is the body, screwed to a stick. And here is a piece of 20 thou plasticard, formed into a curve with hot air and a tin can. The radius is slightly greater than the underside of the roof. Also shown, an 8mm socket tucked inside a 17mm socket. The idea is to Line the two roof halves up, upside down. Glue the piece of plasticard across the gap. Weigh it down with the metal lumps. Lower the coach body onto it until it all clicks into place and everything is held in alignment while the glue sets. The piece of wood might not be necessary, but it might be useful for holding everything in position upside down. The cost of getting (with any luck) a good glue joint is that the plasticard is rather thin. I hope to be able to take it apart (gently!) and add some reinforcement, to produce a roof that comes on-and-off as easily as the original roofs did with the original coaches. I'll let you know!

Yes, I'm pretty pleased with it. I think that on a small layout with tight curves a few of them might provide a plausible illusion of a proper main line train. I've removed the glazing from the end compartments, in preparation for gluing them together. I've done this because I want to have the glazing holding the roof on (as per the source 4-wheelers), but I reckon it might be hard to remove the roof if the glazing-attachment runs the whole length. More importantly, my Brassmasters Cleminson underframe kits arrived today. Gadzooks! Have they accidentally sent me the Z-gauge variant? Or have I bitten off more than I can chew? We'll see. The etchings are so pretty. Maybe instead of building them I should frame them and put them on the wall, safely away from my great greasy fingers.

No, I'd need to have a lot more to show for myself before I started bringing things to exhibitions (especially since I live in Germany).

Here's a little bit of progress. I've cut the two roofs to fit. In fact, I removed a little bit too much, so (after I actually join them) there will be more filling than I intended. There is also a discontinuity along the edge of the roof, presumably arising from asymmetry in the original models. Next time I will check the alignment all ways round before I start cutting. I have just ordered two duckets from Shapeways, and hopefully my Cleminson underframe kits will be in the post soon.

So, there's an undercurrent of brake coach discussion in this thread. Processing everyone's inputs has led me to produce the following doodle: The simplest brake coach conversion, using this, would be: Remove the glazing for the two windows of one end compartment (keeping the door glazing). Remove the beading around the last window and the last panel, and the oval beading above and below them. Glue in these duckets, pushing the inner protuberances into the window cavity for alignment. Blank the other window (turn it into a panel) with plasticard and milliput. Let somebody else worry about glazing for the duckets. Carefully, carefully remove the word THIRD from what is now the guard's door. Or leave it. The same ducket could be used with other approaches (moving panels to put two doors side-by-side, for example) provided it always occupied the place of the last window and panel. I'm going to tinker with the dimensions, then send the design off to Shapeways with another chunk of my children's inheritance.

So, some progress. Gluing the tops of the sides looked like this, with a strip of aluminium L-section to keep them aligned, and a piece of tin foil to keep the glue away from the clamps. And this is the result. I'm pretty pleased with this, so I've emailed Brassmasters to ask them for two of their Cleminson underframe kits. While I'm waiting for that to run its course, I will have a go at the roof. I'll probably also tidy up the join a bit with milliput.

Thank you Corbs! I was delighted with them, right up until the point where it went wrong! But I think the level of detail and the expense (of FUD) are not justified. I have been mulling over producing a less-detailed version in WSF, and your interest might give me the extra impetus (although I'm juggling a few too many 00 3D printing projects just at the moment....). I've also been mulling over an alternative. Maybe printed card cut-out-and-fold interiors would be easier to manage - certainly they would be cheaper - and thus more appropriate for these 4 wheelers. I'd be grateful for your opinion.

If this idea takes off then I'm available. I have 3D modelling experience (not so much actual physical modelling skill). Cheers Tom

So, as suggested I filled the gap with thin plasticard, glued, trimmed then sanded until I was happy. The two halves are joined along the bottom (with the glazing to keep them aligned and the glue is drying now. I kept glue off the top parts. When the bottom is set I'm going to glue the tops with a metal strip clamped in place to keep them aligned. I'm being a little fanatical about alignment, which is surely better than being sloppy.

Then I would say the project was successful. Those two coaches look as though they belong together. The engine is a piece of ancient Triang history, right?

I like it. Do you have any pictures of it alongside the unmodified Hornby 4 wheeler? I've seen (on this forum and others) rearrangements of the sides of the Hornby coach to get 2 doors side-by-side. But for my taste the duckets are the important distinctive visual element.

That would do to satisfy casual glances, and it could certainly help break up the uniformity of a train of these coaches. There are plenty of suggestions on this forum (and elsewhere on the internet) for moving doors and windows around to make a brake compartment. I want to make sure that the guard can see in both directions, so when I get round to this I'll be adding duckets and probably windows at one end. 3D printing may be involved.

I plan to use a Brassmasters Cleminson underframe ( http://www.brassmasters.co.uk/cleminson_underframe.htm ). Hopefully it won't prove too difficult for me. If I'm successful then my second attempt will be a brake coach on the same chassis. I'm also considering making a slightly longer 6 compartment coach, and putting it on a pair of these: https://www.shapeways.com/product/BTMNEZZJT/gwr-dean-6-4-quot-bogie-Hornby-fit