Iain.d

How time flies on this thread…. Over the weekend I was able to finish my build of a LSWR 3 coach set from Roxey Mouldings. Overall, I’m quite pleased with how they have turned out. As a whole (with painted roof, underframes, numbering, and so on) the colour has toned down and is much less garish on the eye. They went together really well, much easier than the Maunsell’s I completed previously. The roof fit is much better too; I took my time and was much more careful in marking, cutting and filing. The only part I didn’t use in the kit was the funny S style hand rails on the guard’s doors – they were the wrong size, so I just bent some .33mm wire. The commode handles were a bit of a faff, when I trialled the first one or two, the bit you're supposed to bend over and pass through the holes in the carriage side made the handle look wrong - or maybe I got the bend in the wrong place - anyway I ended up drilling out the centre of the top and bottom of each handle and soldered in a piece of .45mm brass wire as a stanchion. I have no specific LSWR carriage books, so I spent ages pouring over photos in the various books I do have, CWNs from Robert Carroll’s website, magazines such as Backtrack, and just about any info I could find on the internet, including RMWeb and even photos on eBay. LSWR Dwg 1227/1568 (SR Dia 131) 56 ft Corridor Brake Third (Left Hand) LSWR Dwg 1214 (SR Dia 282) 54ft Corridor Composite LSWR Dwg 1227/1568 (SR Dia 139) 56 ft Corridor Brake Third (Right Hand) On piecing the information I found all together, I concluded that I wasn’t going to complete an accurate set that ran on the Somerset and Dorset in the early 50s from what was available on the kit market, so they are a representational set. In my research I was actually surprised how tidy many of these carriages were at this time, despite most being somewhere between 40 and 50 years old. This set is still perhaps too clean and will, one day, receive some weathering treatment. I was also quite pleased how the corridor connectors look, despite the reasonably large gap between the carriages. When the money tree blooms, I will look to purchase another set, probably non-corridor in BR Crimson. Kind regards, Iain

Maybe!

Thank you. Sorry, I was teasing!! Kind regards, Iain

Like Jesse, I feel too that I'm hijacking the thread with some modelling...I liked the posts on cats (I don't have one now but did have one once)....!! I thought I’d post an update on a 3 coach LSWR set I’m building… The bodies are now painted; they are definitely bright!! They’re done with Humbrol 101 (thanks Al / Barry Ten) and, from memory, seem to be familiar with my recollections of the Hornby Mansell stock and the Battle of Britain locomotive that featured in the 1981 Hornby catalogue. If it wasn’t for the period I was modelling, they wouldn’t be in my first choice of colour. All being well, when numbered and varnished, ends painted, roofs, grab handles, etc are added, I hope they will tone down slightly. There will also be some weathering to do. The underframes are also done less the dynamos, there are a few additional (detachable) handbrake fittings to fit to the brake underframes after the bogies are attached. These are sprayed with Vallejo Primer (German Panzer Grey) and will be dry brushed with dark brown to dirty them. The interiors are built, yet to be painted. All going well I can get the numbers added in the next evening or so and varnished over the weekend. Then next week will likely see them assembled and then, hopefully, a package from Wizard Models will arrive with the bits to start on the next coaches! Kind regards, Iain

Thanks Al, they look really good. The vents on the brake are the same as one of mine (the one in accordance with the drawing) less the extra one in the brake area next to compartment four. And the colour looks good, being balanced by the roof. It doesn't look overly vivid or garish. I'd be happy with those. I fit the handles after painting, I don't trust myself to scrape the paint off without damaging the finish of the coach; ask me how I know! Do the toilets on the Composite have vents? In my kit there were only 14 of the larger vents and 2 smaller vents for the toilets. I have just noticed I didn't fit the fillers to mine. A job for tomorrow. Kind regards, Iain

Thanks John. You are quite right – it is still a big gap. My ‘test curve’ is just a length of track pinned to 3ft that I could make tighter but I’ve left it the same for consistency. When I get round to building a layout, I envisage a whole heap of rework of things I’ve completed but if I don’t do as much as I can at the build stage, I feel overwhelmed by part/unfinished projects. At least I will know these will run and I can modify/amend at leisure. I've just taped a length of track to the kitchen bench top at 2ft 6in / 76cm radius and the coaches will travel okay with about 4mm between the buffer faces, there is though a lot of overhang. I'm happy as they are. Kind regards, Iain

Hi Al, As requested… The roof plan for both the LH and RH kit is the same and shows some ventilators marked with an ‘X’ and states ‘ventilators marked with an ‘X’ apparently not fitted on all vehicles’. I have no suitable roof images that show what should or shouldn’t be fitted – so I guessed. But also because I wanted to make them individual carriages rather than mirror images. Below is the LSWR (4C95) RH brake. For the first three compartments, the plan/picture provided with the kit shows one ventilator over the centre line of the roof and one ventilator inset by about 4mm over the approx. centreline of the compartment. The toilet and the fourth compartment have their vents inset 4mm from the centreline. The four ventilators over the brake section should be on the centre line but I chose to place them 8mm either side of the centreline, in line with the centre of the double doors. The kit was provided with 6 smaller torpedo vents – not sure what these were for. I should really add a fifth vent over the brake area - only noticed now - but I won't as I probably won't get in the right place. For the LH brake (4C96) I decided not to fit any compartment ventilators over the centre line of the coach (those marked with an ‘X’ on the plan). The four brake end ones are over the centreline as per the plan. The brake end also has one ventilator 4mm inset next to the fourth compartment – maybe that’s where the guard had a desk? Compartments one to three have one vent and compartment four has two vents; all inset by 4mm from the centreline. The grey patch between the end right hand two vents is filler as the roof had a bit of a dimple in it. I also added a .25mm x .75mm thin cantrail strip on all the carriages; rain strips yet to be added. They'll be from tape, and fixed after the final scrub. Hope that helps or maybe that’s an overly complex explanation – sorry! I intend to model a representation of an LSWR 3 coach set that ran on the Somerset and Dorset between about 1950 and 1955 and from the information I have (Backtrack Vol 9 No 4 April 1995), it suggests the sets were a bit of a hotchpotch rather than built as a set from new. Some of the coach running numbers listed on kit instruction were in the S&D sets but I don’t have photos and those sets were mostly withdrawn before my period. Therefore I’m modelling something that may have happened in the early 1950s. I’m content that what I’m doing is close enough to be acceptable to me. I don't think they will be sprayed this weekend. We're forecast a months worth of rain on Sunday....oh so like Britain! Kind regards, Iain

No problem, it’ll be tomorrow as it’s late now! I don’t think my ventilators are 100% right though, the instructions say something like “vents marked ‘x’ might not be present’ so I guessed! I have a LH and a RH brake, I did each roof differently - for no reason other than I could! Kind regards Iain

In the spirit of showing what we’re building, I thought I’d post a bit more progress on a 3 coach set of LSWR stock I’m part way through building. They’re similar to Al’s a post or two above but not as far advanced. Happy to show photos if others are interested. The subject of couplings came up a page or two back and I thought I’d show how I couple my sets together. Its not my idea – I have no idea whose it was – it’s a copy of that shown in Stephen Williams’ The 4mm Coach Part One (page 20). First off I solder a 1mm piece of wire rod behind the headstock/on the buffer bases. I do this on both ends on all the coaches. I then make up a simple hook from 1mm wire rod, bending it to shape and winding round a bit of thin wire from old electrical cable to represent the hose ribbing. I may add representations of hose couplings from washers or twists of thicker wire, if the mood takes me, all secured with tiny dabs of solder. The part with the hook is maybe a mil or two lower than the opposite end that passes through the headstock as it has to go below the headstock of the following coach – seems obvious, but I’ve got it wrong so many times. I temporality fit the corridor connectors to get the right tension / correct (ish) distance between the coaches. I realise these are too far apart compared to full size stock but it doesn’t look too bad as the void has something in it. I then solder the hook to the headstock. The hook rubs on the bar – this seems smoother than it just rubbing on the back of the headstock. These LSWRs will go around 3ft radius curves on a test track without issue. I have no idea how they might fare on a full layout, reverse curves or a crossover….we’ll shall see one day! Nor do I know how the compressibility / tension of the bellows will last…time will tell. The reason I put a bar behind every buffer is in case I decide to add further stock at a later date and it’s easier to fit at the build stage. The process it the same for plastic bodied stock/underframes except I use glue. This is how the set looks, the corridor connectors are held in place by friction for the picture and the photography has shown how grotty the sides are. They’ll get scrubbed over the weekend and if the weather is warm they might even see a coat of primer. Kind regards, Iain

Thanks for taking the time to do a comparison Al, scientific or not it works for me! It does look close - I'm happy with that. Kind regards, Iain

They look great Al, thank you for showing us. In fact, I've been waiting to see if/when you'd post them! Any chance of some closer images? How does the Railmatch Malachite compare to the Humbrol Matt 101 you previously mentioned? I've bought a couple of tinlets; it seems dull compared to your photo. My coaches are close to being finished also. If time allows I'll try and take some photos tomorrow and post them. Kind regards, Iain

Can you please tell me how / what you made the door hinges from? They look good. A really nice build. kind regards Iain

Very nice! kind regards Iain

Thanks very much! Well there you go...so they weren't! How I missed that I don't know - probably a case of looking but not seeing. I will add that to the upgrades as I go. Kind regards, Iain

Thank you very much for the compliment, it is kind of you. I was a lurker here for many years and considered my modelling to be of not a high enough standard to be shown. And then one day thought that I couldn't care less if anyone thinks its good enough or not. There are, naturally, various levels of modelling shown on this thread, and across RMWeb, but I think they all have something to offer. I sometimes think too, who on earth would be interested in seeing what I am making. Re the soldering, I do make a mess, I have to be in the right frame of mind and some days things just work better than others - when it's a 'not so good day' I make sure I stop and walk away or do something different. One of my learnings was to use as small a tip as possible, that means the least amount of solder goes on; its easier to add more than try and take it off! Kind regards, Iain

Thanks for the tip on Humbrol 101, my local model shop stocks some Humbrol so I'll drop in. The colour doesn't need to be spot on, close enough will be good enough. I did read / hear that early BR DMU green was close too. I thought I’d show a few pictures of where I’m at with my Roxey LSWR coaches: The bogies and underframes are done As are the battery boxes (still to be folded) and corridor connectors / gangways. I think these are very similar to Blacksmiths Models ones – mine follow the idea in Stephen Williams’ The 4mm Coach Part 2. The cover is made from some camera lenses cleaning tissues I bought in Boots years and years ago (coloured with a Sharpie); they’re tougher than more recently purchased tissues. The one in the coach end is just a test fit and all the 'inside bits' were painted before glueing in the bellows and attaching the tissue. I like to build things in bits and then put it all together. I have also bent up my coupling bar. I’ve formed the turnunder on each coach side and started to add the extra bits such as door stops, vents and hinges. I couldn’t drill the corridor side of these coaches for door stops as the beading/raised panelling was thinner than my drill bit. Kind regards, Iain

I have three ‘ancient’ Millholme 2Ps. They haven’t been out of their boxes for years; and two of them have never run other than on a metre of test track! In the discussion on chassis’ though these all have brass components for the locos and Romford wheels and have DS10s in fold-up motor mounts; it’s the tenders that differ. I’m pretty sure I built all these straight from the box. On the oldest (40563) the tender wheel axles rest in the whitemetal axle boxes – well they should but the chassis is cracked and they’re loose. The move to Australia was rough on my models and many were damaged and need some sort of remedial repair. Not sure why I put later BR emblems on this loco as I don’t think it carried them. 40527 and 40634 were bought and built in 1998 and the tender of 40634 has a brass sub chassis (just stamped and pretty crude) and 40527 has a more complete brass sub chassis with brake gear. There’s enough whitemetal in these kits to make another loco! I fitted all with 12mm bogie wheels as (in 1993) I had a 6ftx10ft layout in a back bedroom of our then house and that was all I could envision for the future too. The layout curves were about 2ft radius and the points were all set track, code 100. 40563 worked well - happy days! I have bought Gibson 14mm replacements to correct them one day…. 40527 should have been numbered 40537 but I recall listening to a world cup match in 1998 when I was applying the transfers - I think England scored and I was distracted! Kind regards, Iain

They're looking good Al. I doing a 3 car set at the moment, the construction is not at as an advanced stage as yours, so no photos as yet. One of my brake coaches also had the wrong instructions - it had the ones for a 59ft Maunsell, although it had a line drawing of a LSWR brake; it took me a read or two to realise. Happy to provide a copy if you need. I have made my gangways work but used my own method, if you followed the Roxey instructions they won't work as the tabs, holding the end plates in line, and the scissors don't leave enough room for the bellows paper. Across my three kits there were only two sets of end castings. I too had issues with the trussing. There was no appropriate queen post wire in the kit and (I think) the dimensions it tells you to cut them make the proportions all wrong - the trussing is a real characteristic of these coaches and if it doesn't look quite right, it looks totally wrong. I agree though, the fit of parts is really good and I'm really enjoying putting them together. Mine will be SR malachite too (I think you mentioned that in a previous post) with BR numbering, but I have to find the closest match in the Vallejo green range to do that. Not much chance of a trip back to the UK in the near future to stock up.... Kind regards, Iain

Hi, You could try MRJ 173: Suddenly Last Summer (Again) by Chris Pendlenton on page 43. He builds a number of hoppers, the Bradwell 13T is mentioned and there is a picture. Not much on the building of the kit though, other than its a joy! Kind regards, Iain

I have managed a couple of further coach refurbishments / rebuilds. The first is a LMS D2123 BTK that uses a 1980s Hornby Stanier as the donor; only the chassis solebars, interior, ends and roof survive. The roof ribs are quite prominent on this one – I know they’re not to everyone’s liking (I can live with them, just!). It’ll be at the end of an eight coach rake. All will be based on these old carriages so hopefully they will kind of all merge together…. The second rebuild uses an old Airfix Non Corridor Composite where I have replaced the sides with Comet ones, the bogies are also Comet etches but I used the Airfix side frames. Scratch built underframe and some additional detailing on the ends. It’s sprayed with Model Masters British Crimson (2009); it’s a few shades different to Railmatch BR Crimson, but close enough. It’ll be part of a two coach set, the other coach being a Hornby Non Corridor Brake Third in maroon – other than the glazing, an exquisite model. On the Hornby I’ve matt varnished the interior and painted the edges of the glazing, this has reduced the worst of the prismatic effect. I sprayed the roof and ends with matt varnish to take away the plasticky look and painted the bogies and under frames a mix of Vallejo German Tank Crew (333) and German Cam Black/Brown (70.822). Both are yet to be weathered. To couple the two coaches together I bent up a length of wire to represent the brake hoses and added a few twists of wire to represent the hose couplers. I also made up a screw coupling and soldered the hooks to the pipes where they bend to go under the headstock. The screw works (a 14BA nut and bolt) so I was then able to tension the coupler. I added steam heating hoses to each coach but chose not to connect those. Kind regards, Iain

That looks stunning! Kind regards, Iain

Hi Peter, Some of these sets did have the inner buffers removed. In Mike King’s An Illustrated History of Southern Coaches there is a picture of one of the brake ends from set 395, on page 59, where it appears the intermediate buffers are missing and the picture is captioned as such. I don’t recall reading in this book or David Gould’s Maunsell’s SR Steam Carriage Stock about this practice though, or maybe I've missed it. The set make up notes that come with Roxey Moulding’s Maunsell’s of this type state that sets 392, 395, 396, 397, 398 and 399 only had buffers at the outer ends of the sets. None of the 44x sets are listed as having had them removed. In terms of ‘buffing’, I would imagine that the buck eye coupling did most of the buffer work, assisted by the corridor connector. Happy to be put right on that though if someone else can advise. Hope that helps. Kind regards, Iain

Thanks Andrew! I was pleased that the interior paneling showed through too. The toilet windows are just old plastic milk bottle materiel cut up and stuck inside the glass. From some of the images I have, some Maunsell's had semi opaque/frosted glass while others had what seemed to be white painted windows. Kind regards, Iain

Among the clutter of my work bench is now a completed SR Maunsell 3 coach set in BR Crimson and Cream built from Roxey Moulding kits. Despite my earlier concerns the paint went on really well. The lining (HMRS transfers) was a bit difficult in that the black line ‘swapped sides’ about 2/3 of the way along, so it took a bit of cutting and fiddling to make it all look one. They’re pretty much as the kits came. The only things I changed were the corridor connecter bellows - the kits come with some foam and a semi rigid housing that I changed for black concertinaed paper – and the glazing, I substituted cut glass for the plastic provided. I built the seats from plastic card and I added a few passengers. I've yet to add the coupling system (hook and bar). I’m pleased with how they have turned out, please excuse my over indulgence of a picture of each one. Not sure how they’ll run, I suspect they’ll need some adjustment though. And they’ll need weathering, but that will be a project in its own right; I need to do some practising first. They’ve taken longer than I expected but like most of us I have had too much on the go at the same time. I’m also nearing completion on two more Hornby/Airfix coach refurbishments using Comet sides. I’ll maybe show those next and I also started another Roxey Moulding set of kits to make a LSWR 3 coach formation. Kind regards, Iain

Contributors on this forum/thread often mention time as one of the restrictions they have on their modelling. I’m much the same, so what I try and do is break my modelling into chunks of time or smaller tasks that can be done in limited time. This might range from 10 minutes upwards to whatever time is available or appropriate among all the other things I need to do. Saying that, I don’t think I would have the ability to model all day – even if time allowed of course! In achieving this I will often batch build things like subcomponents that I know I’m going to need for models in the to-do list. Coach underframes, corridor connectors are examples, that may even be broken down further (such as making all the queen posts for all the underframes and then all the brake hangers for all the underframes and then all the battery boxes and so on). I’m trying to use whatever time I have effectively. We don’t watch much telly in our house, perhaps an hour a night when something of interest is on (currently Australian Masterchef…) and during that time I will normally bring a few bits and tools through to the TV room and work on them while the telly is on in the background. I’m happy and the family are happy that we’re altogether. I’m very lucky too that I have a modelling room office library where I can leave things set up and do the things I can’t do in front of the telly. I find that on the sofa I’m less rushed or distracted than when sat at my modelling bench. I’m also very lucky that my partner tolerates brass, white metal and plastic card filings on the furniture. If I lose something on the carpet she’ll often say, ‘don’t worry the vacuum will find it tomorrow!’ I also think one of the other skills we need (as well as being able to do the basic physical skills of modelling) is to think about what we are modelling and how we might want it to look it or put it together. Historically I would buy something like a Kirk coach kit or a Parkside wagon kit, get home and build it and paint it in an evening. I never really considered or took the time (…time again…) to think about what I wanted it to look like, what extras could I add to it, how I could make it better. That bit usually happened after I had glued it all together and it was too late, but then when I bought the next one I did the same thing all over again! Nowadays I make myself slow down and take the time to consider these things, this has helped my modelling no end; it often means I get things right first time so I don’t have to use valuable modelling time putting the errors right. Does it really matter if I it finish tonight or next week? Not really. Gee, this thread moves fast, living in a different time zone doesn’t help…… Kind regards, Iain