Aire Head

Try asking the LMS society they will probably know.

When expecting we were debating the name of our future child the subject of middle names for a boy came up. I wanted to use my late grandfathers name wheras my partner wanted to continue her family tradition of using the name McDonald. As a compromise it was proposed that we could use both until we realised that mean the child's middle names would be "Ronald McDonald". Ultimately all pointless as we had a girl anyway!

Given what you have just said it seems most likely thelat they are indeed misidentified D305s

I've just seen a good few images of them in my chosen period of the early 1950s that I feel I could justify one. Other suggestions are always welcome!

D673 and D818 would certainly be of interest. They share the same Underframe as the D663A and D607

Can't seem to make it work on my phone unfortunately 😕 I have been pleased to see that Mousa Models has added the D607 and D663A to his range!

Is there any evidence that the D1856 Driving trailers were outshopped on the fully lined LMS livery? If so is anyone aware of any images of them in this livery.

Not necessary for them to be XP According to the 1957 dated general appendix I have at home XP only means that the vehicle can be attached to express passenger trains.

Which reminds me I dug out my 1956 Midland Division general appendix which has some interesting bits to add to that!

People seem to be getting confused between stuff travelling in stock other than coaches and goods trains.

Oh I definitely still agree. I'm struggling to see how we progress this to be honest. We know that Morton Brakes and bottom doors was an option and some wagons were built as such. However the overwhelming majority wasn't built as such.

If you can find anyone who wants to be the ones extracting it. I know I wouldn't want

The crossshaft would be more susceptible to damage and therefore more expensive to maintain/operate the wagon than an independently braked example.

Are we defining a period that this statement covers? Both the Midland and Great Western were much more renowned for standardisation than the LNWR

In a similar manner the Bradford-Carlisle all stations stopping service was used for running in meaning such a humdrum service would attract it's share of named locos such as Rebuilt Scots, Clans and Jubilees

Well if it's colour you are after don't forget the Appleby-Cricklewood milk trains!

He isn't suggesting you are the mail reader just that some of the other people responding certainly sound like they are. Well at least that is my interpretation of what he meant. It can be hard to convey context through text!

Barring the Second World War I can't really say there is a significant aviation presence within the area. However around what is now Leeds Bradford Airport there was an Avro Works and on the far side of Leeds and up the Vale of York were a number of RAF bases a number of which are still operational.

To be fair to us all the class 308s did replace Pacers with electric doors 😅 I wonder is any other place had there trains "upgraded" by replacing the existing stuff with older stock?

Skipton had a sorting yard at the North of the station as it served as an immediate Junction for 4 different routes with many other Junctions within close proximity of them. The Aire Valley Line to Leeds, Bradford and onwards The Colne Line which allowed further access into North Lancashire The Little North Western towards Lancaster/Morecambe/Heysham and the Settle Carlisle The Wharfedale line to Ilkley which also accessed the NER. An incredibly busy route with around 150+ trains a day with many of the goods trains terminating or departing from the sorting yard at Skipton Heysham Moss

If they were scattered about the yard it is most likely that they are wagon load traffic and were mixed into more general goods trains. I am aware of them being transported in the train I detailed in my earlier post mixed in with other chemicals. Given the volatile nature of these vehicles they will end up in the middle of most trains if traveling as wagon load traffic which is probably why images are so scarce of them not in the yard.

I'm not aware of dedicated methanol trains however I am aware methanol did travel in some of the chemical trains which typically carried Anhydrous Ammonia or Ammonia Liquor. These trains ran between Heysham and either Teeside or Immingham. Nitric acid was another chemical known to travel in these trains. Heysham/Teeside and Immingham all dealt with Ammonia and frequently swapped material between sites due to storage issue as far as I'm aware. This means that loaded wagons could be traveling either way. Loaded Anhydrous Ammonia tanks were noticeable as they tended to form a layer of frost on them due to the nature of their cargo. Heysham also have facilities for unloading oil so don't assume that a train load of tankers around Skipton will be carrying chemicals! As to train length anywhere from 10-20 tankers + barrier wagons seems to be the typical amount according to most images I have seen. These trains typically ran under a class F "express Unfitted" headcode and seem to have attracted a variety of motive power.

Yeah I realised my mistake too late 😅

Oh boy which part of the Midland Region? On the Aire Valley Line I know that the following were used Fowler 4F Johnson 3F Ivatt 2MT (both types) Stanier/Fowler 3P L&Y Radial Midland 2P Ivatt 4MT Fowler/Fairburn/Stanier 4MT So a large variety of stuff was used! The reason I ask what part of the Midland Region is that whoever the original pregrouping owner of the route was could effect things well into the 60s.

Midland Railway D663A were built for both mineral and merchandise traffic and as such they have bottom doors and full height side doors. Many lasted into the 1950s and some even into 60s. They are easily identified by the vertical bracing up the side.