Bassettblowke

I wouldn’t worry to much about exposure to any paint primer the only caveat being you observe sensible precautions. Problems mainly arise in industry where the likes of red lead, white lead, calcium plumbate, zinc phosphate and zinc chromate were used in vast quantities within manufacturing processes. For the hobbyist Removing rather than applying them probably carries more risk. modern etch primer is wonderful stuff although the high build nature of the paint can sometimes be an issue. The cleaner the surface the better, most rust treatments don’t remove rust or convert it all they do is seal it and give you a suitable surface to paint, I would suggest abrasion is the best option wherever possible, total rust removal being the aim. Obviously this isn’t always achievable And that’s where all these rust treatments find a niche. When looking at many of these products Hammerite, Jenolite, Waxoyl and numerous others many lay claim to use in industry and the MOD I can say hand on heart I never once encountered any of them. The only exception was Rocket WD40 which was embraced big time although this was a water displacement product it rapidly came to be used for all manner of oddball things. Rumour had it that the engineers writer brushed his teeth with it. The Navy in particular didn’t look kindly on the quack remedy school of thought, any deviation from the accepted process would undoubtedly bring down the wrath of the Buffer and even worse the Jimmy neither in any incarnation inclined to give anything the benefit of the doubt. Once you have a suitable surface for paint it must be applied promptly and properly, no point in doing a thorough job on rust removal if you skimp on the paint system. Rust like dry rot is quite content to fester out of sight even underneath what might appear to be a sound surface, An elderly frigate that was dispatched to the Far East along with my own ship was alongside in Simonstown South Africa for an assisted maintenance period and investigation of a leak on her focsle deck, by the time they were finished the investigation one of her deck plates resembled a lace curtain, this was cut out and replaced. In reality the whole ship was unfit for service and whoever thought it suitable for service in the Far East obviously needed their head testing. On return it was promptly scrapped.

In a previous life I had more experience of dealing with rust than I care to remember, a chipping hammer and a descaling pistol were never far from my hand And neither was a large pail of zinc chromate primer. It’s the nature of the beast that any ferrous metal will rust when exposed to the air, in the marine environment this is especially so hence the need to progress the job quickly. Many primers are porous so the top coat needs to be applied as quickly as possible. Care needs to taken to provide adequate coverage as it only takes one pin sized hole in the finish for rust to rapidly gain a foothold and spread beneath your nice pristine paint system. If you have stripped an item back to bare metal it really should be primed the same day and the finishing coats applied as soon as the primer has dried. There really is no silver bullet when it comes to rust, nothing on Gods green earth will prevent ferrous metal returning to its natural state all you can do is slow that process or speed it up depending on your chosen method. On the bright side the last time I handled Zinc Chromate was in the 70’s and to date despite the dire warnings Issued in subsequent years, I haven’t sprouted a second head, the lungs full of rust dust might come back to haunt me though, and the high as a kite paint fumes from working in confined spaces doesn’t bear thinking about either. The two pack epoxy deck paint was quick drying so you had to motor with the roller before the stuff went off in the bucket. Thank God for the HSE and the abolition of Crown Immunity just a shame it isn’t retrospective.

On sale from Sunday are some keenly priced rattle cans, the three that appeal to me with my taste for minimalist scenery to compliment tin plate track and Bassett Lowke wooden structures are the speckled stone effect in light and dark grey and the concrete colour, also available is Rose gold/copper and silver. May be interest to fellow travellers and half the price of Plasticote and Rustoleum offerings.

In the world of Die-cast restoration caustic soda finds frequent use and I use it on tinplate as well. I have always found Nitromors hard work even the old stuff although the stuff with the consistency of water for me worked better than the paste. The modern nitromors is a completely different product as far I can tell sharing only the brand name with the former highly noxious product. Over the years I’ve heard many recommendations for all sort of odd concoctions. Car brake fluid once the favoured choice of vandals among them, personally I will stick to occasionally drinking Coke and putting Vinegar on my chips there are more effective tried and tested methods out there.

I am surprised to see Coke recommended for anything other than drinking, as for it being a danger to health well it probably is if consumed by the barrel load. Surely we should be exercising some common sense here, the food standards agency exists for a reason. The same goes for rust removers, drain cleaners, oven cleaners, if you follow the instructions and refrain from gargling with it you won’t go awry. Living as we do in a heavily regulated consumer society we can hopefully rest assured that genuine products have been thoroughly tested and comply with current legislation. Now there’s a well known saying that you can’t legislate for idiots and there in lies the danger, follow the instructions and you won’t go wrong, every house is stuffed with products that have the potential to be dangerous, used correctly they will perform safely and as expected.

Wobbly hand syndrome is my problem, fortunately it’s not constant but I have to judge the moment. Out of curiosity does anyone have any experience with lining pens I have been looking at a few and they don’t come cheap.

Searching around the web I’ve come across several different types of mouldings the obvious one is the coach body minus window vent frets, apparently it was common for any damaged frets to be removed completely and the coach body offered for sale sans window frets. The other stand out one was the ribbing on the roof mine is perfectly smooth but I’ve found pictures of others with ribs seemingly in the mould, unless of course they have been added. These coaches were available as the finished article or as a kit of parts and were sold from the immediate pre war years until the company ceased trading. Garry’s three I would guess to be factory finished and then subsequently refurbished and upgraded by him and very nice too. On my example so far so good however looking to the future the thought of lining them gives me the heebie jeebies.

When I started this thread I was hoping that someone like your good self would chip in with some sound advice and steer me in the right direction. That’s one of the good things about the internet and especially forums such as this, in that someone like me with little knowledge of the subject in hand can acquire a few obscure bits and pieces from a long defunct model railway company and with a lot of help from fellow members actually (hopefully) produce the finished article, looking as it would of back in the day.

Agreed a first class job and something to aspire to, I like the brass rod fixing, simple yet functional, brilliant. Did you scratch build the seating ?

I think you are both on the right track, looking back at the 53 Leeds catalogue lighting is indeed quoted as being available. So another of my suppositions crashes and burns. like Garry before me I am stuck with a mildly Banana shaped roof so if interference fit was the intended methodology it ain’t gonna work with this one.

Prowling around Lidl today I came across some rattle cans that might be of interest to restorers or modellers, the dark red/brown oxide primer in particular appealed to me both for use on stock and brickwork on buildings. Two for £4 which is a steal compared to Halfords, other cans that may appeal were black and clear lacquer.

Here’s a picture of the underside of the roof which shows the sockets circled in yellow which I presume has something to do with securing the roof to the coach body however there are no corresponding holes in the coach floor. The locations marked by the yellow cross are I think the locations of the roof vents.

More progress with the paint shop, whilst waiting a day or so before doing further work on the paint I’ve been test fitting windows and trial fitting the bogies, buffers and couplings,

I was thinking along the same lines, initially I was tempted to clamp it together and glue it but that presents the obvious problem that should you ever wish to access the interior it would involve breaking it open. i wonder what the suggested method was back in the day.I can see four large socket type mouldings on the underside of the roof maybe these were meant to be fixing points. Were these coach parts ever sold with instructions or were you left to make it up as you went along. Time for some research.

The priming is finished Just a 24 hr wait before a quick rub down and the top coats being applied, I’ve backed away from the departmental idea and settled on Halfords Rover Damask red For the sides and Matt black for the roof and ends. There is a slight hump in the roof and this will Have to be dealt with when a method is devised to secure the roof to the body which Also enables access to the interior. The glazing will need cutting to size and fitting and a decision made as to whether any interior is fitted. Also I will need to draw up a list of parts to purchase from the Leeds Steadman trust. Comparing the pictures of either end will highlight the loss of detail due to several coats of the etch primer and subsequent flatting with wet and dry this principally involves the detail on the buffer beam. ,

Just bouncing the ball around no decision made either way yet, looking at it in red oxide primer though you could be right.

Push comes to shove I have a green class 20, I suppose It could be paired with a green departmental coach.

Drat that’s put paid to that bright idea

In between spraying and rubbing down the paint job I’ve been reflecting on how to use this coach, as with most of my purchases I didn’t set out to buy this specific coach it was just an impulse buy. I have to accept that finding another two at an affordable price is pretty unlikely so how to employ said beast. Looking at it along side Ace, B/Lowke, Darstaed and LMC overlayed wooden stock it looks a tad out of place. Eventually the lightbulb moment came and I am now toying with the idea of painting it olive drab and using it as a departmental coach. This appeals for several reasons firstly it can be paired with a tank Loco and an assortment of vans and open wagons and used as a works train. Secondly it can be parked up in a siding somewhere (good reason to add a siding) and thirdly and best of all no worries about the livery, lining, transfers etc. Time to contemplate the navel and make a decision.

Thanks for posting that link very illuminating if not downright fascinating just a shame it was like most Pathe news films to short. Interesting as well was the you tube link to Victor Martin and his Wife and his railway on the isle of Sheppey, I’ve watched this before but I never tire of it, a great British eccentric or just a really committed rail enthusiast either way great stuff and inspirational for us lesser mortals.

A quick update showing the affected end after priming, flatting, and repainting. The high build primer has worked quite well on the mottled surface with just a few remaining areas needing further work. The down side to the high build etch primer is the blurring of the finer detail. However with me operating in a world far removed from fine detail that’s not such a problem. Acceptable is what I am aiming for, which is a good standard to aim for as you can shift the goal posts to meet the situation.

As an aside to dealing with the problems caused by the Caustic the possible problem of asbestos being present in the Bakelite mix has to be considered. At some stage the roof will need to be attached to the body and this will probably require holes drilling and also for the roof ventilators to be fixed in place. The drilling operation will have to be in a contained environment and suitable PPE used. It does say in the 1953 instructions that needle files can be used to remove excess flashing, obviously knowing what we know now about the possible consequences of exposure to asbestos due care has to be taken, not only for oneself but also for those who share the same environment. Thinking about John’s suggestions for possible causes of the caustic problem I tend to lean towards the first in that the solution may have been stronger at the bottom. During the process the coach was attached to a piece of wire coat hanger and was kept moving, essentially the coach being used to agitate the mix and dislodge the paint. For this reason I would tend to disregard the gas pocket suggestion. On emptying the bucket there was no undissolved soda at the bottom of the bucket, although that doesn’t necessarily mean there wasn’t some there at some stage during the process. Still an element of mystery about it all especially as the sides that butt up to the ends are completely unaffected. My other thought was that possibly the ends were made separately and subsequently attached to the sides raising the possibility of a different mix of Bakelite being used. All a bit of puzzle. moving onto the paint process I decided to use an etch primer on the damaged end, this tends to be high build and hopefully will go some way to evening out the surface, first coat is grey, followed by a flash coat of red oxide and then a coat of Matt black all being Halfords spray cans. The next step is to flat down the end using the different colours as a guide so I don’t start flatting Bakelite just the paint. Prior to flatting it has the appearance of Leatherette used for vinyl roofs that were de rigueur on cars in the 1970’s looking to the future I am hopeful that the damage being on the end of the coach won’t be glaringly obvious time will tell.

All strong possibilities should I ever repeat the process a more thorough mixing process will be on the cards.

I purchased this coach some time ago, it was in pieces basically a pair of bogies a roof and the body. The coach body had been brush painted in maroon and whilst the colour looked good the finish was something lower than abysmal. Fortunately for me this seemed to put the majority of punters off and it fell into my hands at a reasonable price. This was my first experience of LMC Bakelite coaching stock so some research was in order. i managed to find an LMC catalogue circa 1953 which showed the coach as it had originally been purchased, from the looks of things the original purchaser never progressed beyond painting the coach and I can only presume this was down to dissatisfaction with the finish, which was pretty grim. I tried flatting the finish but still couldn’t obtain a satisfactory finish so for a few months it was set aside whilst I pondered the next step. Eventually I decided to strip the finish and having had good results in the past I decided to use caustic soda. This being the first time stripping Bakelite I used a piece of broken Bakelite wagon as a test, this worked fine so I took the plunge. Initially all went swimmingly with the paint dissolving freely and as I rotated the body in the bucket all appeared fine, the reaction was very quick no more than a minute or two and it was only when it was lifted clear and immersed in water that I realised the caustic had worked in a radically different way on the end of the coach that was at the bottom of the bucket, essentially the Bakelite instead of looking like smooth plastic now resembled rough sawn wood. it was evident that something was awry so the coach was quickly immersed in a solution of white vinegar and water in an attempt to stop any further degrading of the surface. The enclosed pictures will show the effect on the end and also the unaffected sides. The puzzle for me is why we have two radically different results on the same lump of Bakelite. more to follow including the hopefully restorative process.

And a Biller Bahn image search threw up this gem which shows the hook carrying a cradle.